to think that within a few years we will be paying to visit the GP,Conservatives consider limit on GP visits

[MiniTheMinx]

The Conservatives have considered limiting the number of times patients can visit their family doctor in a year, it has emerged.

"Labour health spokesman Jamie Reed told the Independent on Sunday: "This paper, hidden away on their website, reveals the Tories' true agenda for the NHS. After throwing the NHS open to ever more privatisation with a wasteful and damaging reorganisation, it seems the Tories want to go even further.
"It's shocking that they are considering limiting the number of times patients can see their GP - changing the fundamental principle in the NHS constitution that access to the NHS is based on clinical need.
"The Tories have already wasted £3bn on a top-down reorganisation of the NHS and overseen a crisis in A&E - now they are consulting their members on opening up the NHS to even more competition, and making it harder for patients to see GPs in the evenings and at weekends."

A Conservative Party spokesman said: "This was simply a topic to provoke discussion and isn't Conservative Party policy."

Yet.

We all know where we are headed with this don't we? or am I being an unreasonable old cynic?

Yes i believe this will be the scenario across the uk. For now people may think it will deal with time wasters & hypocrondriacts but what about the real sick people that really need that appointment but cannot afford it nor get an appointment atall due to this new limit on how many appointments one can have.

I think it is a sad fact of life when in a highly taxed county we are not only paying for the nhs through taxes but also paying extra's too. So only the flush can get a diagnosis.
Thing is like everything that has came into force, it probably won't be means tested which leaves the ill hanging for the sake of £20+

It took 10 visits over 8 months to get my agonising back pain finally reffered to the ortho dept. The GP just kept suggesting painkillers even when my legs were numb and tingling. Thats a total waste of my time. Turns out I had a slipped disc and spondylitis and crumbling spine.
I bet if I'd been paying they wouldnt be refunding for that waste. I dont even bother for my chronic migraine. Now I'm losing sensation in my hands and arms. I cant be arsed. And thats without paying.

Portofino, you get most of that charge back after paperwork if you are in a mutuality, and I think you have to be in a mutuality don't you? perhaps if you're "on benefits" a mutuality payment is taken out of that. I don't know that, however.

The uk is not a highly taxed country! I pay more than 50% of my salary in tax and stoical security payments.

Paying also means a return to contagious illness spreading. People will ignore symptoms because they dont have the money. Before you know it measles/swine flu/whatever will have spread. Especially in poor areas.

Yes, you can Liam most of it back -17 euros out of 23. But you have to have the cash in the first place.

This frightens me. I went to my GP every month for 7 months before they finally got so fed up with me that they referred me. It was bowel cancer, as I'd said it was, not IBS they were sure it was.
It had spread into the lymph nodes by then. I dread to think how long I'd have had if I'd given up.

I pay to visit my GP here in the CI. £40 a go

infamouspoo I know its so hard, especially so when you are in pain but you must get seen and treated. Maybe the migrane is related? it sounds terrible for you. I say, get in there whilst you can still afford to

I should go to the doctor more to mop up some of my taxes. None of what I want you can get, like cervical smears for women under 25, blood tests for immunity, preventive mole removal. But you can get your breasts enlarged if you're depressed about them, or a gastric band if you eat too much.

People on benefits would have to be excluded either from the cap or from paying. Or would they?

IVF is expensive too. Should that be rationed in favour of free access, no cap to GP visits and concentrating on medical treatment of disease/illness.

infamouspoo very good point. At the outbreak of the war people in the countryside were shocked to find their new charges were riddled with lice, scabies and other nasty contagions. That was the 1930s and most of the children came out of the east end from very poor families.

Evidently you know not of what you speak crumble, surgery such as breast enlargement ia very very carefully assessed and rarely done. How do I know? Because I've had 'cosmetic' Nhs surgery for medical reasons and believe me, it takes a long time - 18 years in my case - to get anywhere, even after I got the go ahead I still had doctors telling me off for wasting Nhs money- including consultants and a GP despite the fact that I had diagnosed medical conditions and was told the op was necessary. A registrar actually demanded I cancel my surgery but that's another story. Things such as breast enlargements, 'desginer vaginas', pinnaplasty etc is very rarely done.

you could start a list Mini and see what outrage you can get
Pesky disabled kids for starters. I know mine costs the NHS a total fortune. Lots of GP isits, surgeries and blue lighted in lots. And I see your IVF and raise you trans surgery and boob jobs

I wonder if you'd get charged for routine ante-natal checks under this?

That presumably wouldn't look good for the survival figures...

This would actually create job losses too given the inevitable sharp decrease in patients. Not only for GPs but admin, nurses, hospital staff..

I think this is a bad idea. And I notice that the article gave no indication of what number of appointments the annual cap might be set at.

Firstly, there'll be some patients who have chronic health problems - possibly more than one chronic health problem - who genuinely do need to see the GP frequently, and will be facing serious, possibly fatal consequences if they're turned away because they've already been too often that year.

Secondly, most patients will be booking appointments because they have genuine concerns about there health. Some may appear to be timewasters who are taking up the GP's time with trivial problems, but that doesn't mean that there's not something wrong.

Some patients may have to make several appointments about the same issue before they're taken seriously - i.e. I have a friend who had severe back pain for several months, and made numerous appointments with the GP about her back pain, before she was finally referred to the hospital for scans. The GP's initial opinion was that she'd pulled muscles, or maybe slipped discs, lets refer you to a physiotherapist and so on and so on. But when she finally got the scan, it turned out that she had severe back pain because she has cancer in her spine. It's entirely possible that until that scan result came back, the GP thought that she was making a fuss about nothing or wasting time. It certainly took her more than 3 GP visits to get referred for the scan that showed the cancer in her spine.

And thirdly - if people fall ill after using up their allocated number of GP appointments, they'll have no choice but to head to A&E, whether that's appropriate or not. So it'll put more, totally unnecessary, pressure on A&E.

I think "pay to see GP" is, sadly, likely to happen because people like Liam Byrne (a Labour junior health minister) and Vince Cable have been in favour of it. It's not a Cameron thing, and the mutterings of it come from every side (feels presence of ghost of tuition fees here).

The idea of rationing number of visits is so spectacularly awful, I cannot think how it could have been considered (unless raised blue-skies only to be firmly rebuffed), let alone included as a question.

My dd broke her wrist on holiday in France. I had to pay 100 euros in cash, they made sure I had it before they drove anywhere, for the ambulance to take her from a&e to the Clinique where she had it reset under ga. Then they sent their bill for 700 euros for surgery and a one night stay in hospital. Thank The Lord for Travel insurance. Then when the cast was due to come off, I had to go to GP (23 euros) for the sole purpose of her ringing the general medical place to make an appointment. Then X-rays, then another appointment. (££££) then more X-rays and the cast removal (££££). I claimed the vast majority of it back but I still had to pay.

what would have happenend Porto if you hadnt had that money?

tallulah I hope you are getting good treatment now.

I agree scaevola I don't think we can rely on Labour. So much of what is happening now is backed by labour. They are not an effective opposition. They will sit back, say nothing quietly happy that Scameron is perceived to be the bad guy.

I went to hospital two weeks ago for a blood test, whilst I was there i had to get an appointment in out patients - above the out patient desk was a sign

1323 patients did not show up for their appointments in the month of April. Ok so a % will not have received hospital letters or the hospital transport failed to pick them up or any other cock up that wasn't due to patients.

but for all those who simply didn't show - then I don't see why they can't be charged for wastage

portofino - what about your E111 card - why didn't they accept that?

Shadow is right, if this were to ever happen the A&E would bare the brunt of it, they are overstretched enough as it is now, what with the Nhs Direct changeover to the go damn awful 111. But maybe that is what the government wants, a total crumble to the Nhs so that only those that are rich can afford care.

Ehic - not E111