To feel sorry for the Australian DJs?

[andapartridgeinaRowantree]

Obviously more sorry for the nurse's family. I wonder how long she was having suicidal thoughts for? I can't think this could have been the only cause,

But these pranks have been going on for such a long time and those DJs could not have predicted such a result and are going to have to live with it for the rest of their lives.

It's such a tragedy and I feel very sad for all concerned.

[Yellowtip]

Come on gazza that's a pretty flaky basis for casting that sort of imputation. Two young girls have died in precisely that way in the past few years near my village alone.

[SusannahL]

Gosh I didn't know she killed herself by hanging. That's terrible. Just about the most dramatic way she could have chosen. Will make it all the harder for her poor children to cope with.

I am also not sure what Mimi meant by being 'fishy' Perhaps you could explain further Mimi?

The poor woman must have been in such a bad mental state.

[PumpkinPositive]

Women don't normally commit suicide by hanging - that in itself is fishy

Au contraire, if you're an assassin looking to make a murder look like suicide, you're hardly going to choose an atypical suicide method for the victim, are you?

If indeed hanging is an unusual MO in women, that rather more points to it being self inflicted than the opposite.

[SusannahL]

Maybe Gazza meant sleeping tablets are more commonly used by women, rather than hanging.

So sorry to hear about your friend Welove.

[Smellslikecatspee]

Women don't normally commit suicide by hanging - that in itself is fishy

True, except for female HCPs.
They are actually more likely to use hanging, seen as more commonly male, rather than OD, seen as being more female etc.

There are lots of theories as to by this is so. From HCP knowing that they may be found in time or left brain damaged and seeing hanging as more final. I used to have references for this, I'll see if I can find them.

[Nancy66]

people really think MI5 would murder a nurse for not recognising a prank phone call.....good god

[DontmindifIdo]

I was going to add something similar to Smellslike comment - you need to allow for the fact this woman was a qualified nurse who would clearly understand the difference between different suicide methods, and that pills can be unsucessful (either by not having enough or because the chance of you being rescued in time increases as it's a slower death), and if you aren't successful you are left with damage to your body.

[PumpkinPositive]

True, except for female HCPs.
They are actually more likely to use hanging, seen as more commonly male, rather than OD, seen as being more female etc.

That's really interesting. Is hanging the preferred MO for male HCPs too?

[DontmindifIdo]

Nancy - of course, it's more platable than the truth, we don't like to think that someone could die of something that was done in jest - it's much more acceptable that it was planned that she would die. In the same way that a lot of people who think there's something fishy about Princess Di's death when pushed seem to think there must be because someone that famous can't possibly die in a mundane way (a speeding drunk driver crashing seems so normal for an abnormal person). It's actually more comforting to think that someone was in control and took the decision these woman should be killed rather than sometimes making a bad decision has unexpected consequences (and that you could also make a bad decision that could lead to unexpected consequences).

[gazzalw]

I just said women don't normally hang themselves. I didn't say they never commit suicide in such a way...And you are totally right about statistics MrsDeVere.

[SusannahL]

Some interesting points there Dontmind.

It's hard to imagine just how rational a person would be when driven to suicide. It was a good point about tablets having a less certain outcome, compared to hanging. I guess I just thought that being a nurse she would have had more access to, say sleeping tablets than the rest of us.
Of course I realise that even nurses can't just self-prescribe.

[mathanxiety]

Animation -- The culture of fear among nurses has always been there. It's a way of keeping a mostly female profession subordinate.

I remember seeing a family history documentary where Robin Gibb's grandmother, a midwife, was hauled in front of a midwifery council for treating a baby's eyes (which were affected by an std passed on at birth iirc) and not reporting the condition to a doctor even though a doctor had seen the baby before she did.

[Yellowtip]

This is an absolutely dreadful conversation to get into but given that she was a highly trained nurse, the fact that she chose this method means that she was absolutely clear she wanted to die.

It really is one of the worst and saddest stories to hit the headlines for as long as I can remember. The poor woman herself, her poor children and her poor husband. No words to describe.

The problem I have is that if one starts to say well, it was a mistake, but readily understandable at that time of the night, in that situation and after all no real harm was done - it devalues her death. Why could no-one have stayed with her and repeated like a mantra: no harm was done, don't feel bad, it doesn't matter. Why did no-one make sure this nurse was ok? There really was no harm done. But now there is.

Absolutely dreadful.

[sudaname]

Yes having worked in a hospital l agree most nurses or any HCPs for that matter would steer clear of ODs as they all too often see the results of unsuccessful attempts, plus as has been already stated the irreversible damage that can be done to the organs leading to a prolonged painful death and often sadly after the patient has realised they do want to live after all.

I have read somewhere however that many less women than men in the rest of the general public will actually choose hanging,

I think there needs to be much more research into the treatment and causes etc of depression/stress/anxiety - as much as there is into cancer and other more 'tangible' killers.

[natation]

Still people are assuming the nurse who died was left alone and no-one made sure she was ok. Why are you writing that? Unless you were there, you don't know that do you? Please stop speculating!

[sudaname]

Yes l agree. Also not many of us would kick a door in or drive hundreds of miles if we couldnt get a reply from a colleague/ friend who'd had an upsetting incident at work - on the assumption they might have taken their own life. So we dont know - many people could have tried to contact her/call on her. Sadly nobody could have reasonably foreseen a need for 'suicide watch'.

[Mimishimi]

Just wanted to add that although I said that I thought the circumstances of this particular case are possibly a bit murky, death by hanging is quite common among women in India. Nearly every week you will read some story or other about a girl who has hung herself by her dupatta ( long neck scarf) for failing an examination or due to dowry harassment.

[SusannahL]

That's right. No-one could possibly have foreseen such an extreme reaction

I have just read that she was a Catholic, which makes what she did even harder to understnad doesn't it?

I have resad several times that the hospital stresses that she had not been blamed for the incident, and that she was being supported, and also another assurance from Buckingham palace that they hadn't lodged a complaint.
I guess they are telling the truth ?

[mathanxiety]

I don't think being a Catholic makes any difference to trauma or depression. over the past three years two parishioners in my parish took their own lives after long struggles with depression. Both were respected professionals (one a doctor). Very sad for the families who were left behind but there was also a sense that the whole parish family had let those two individuals down somehow.