Another inheritance AIBU

[GilbGeekette]

I'll try to be brief. ExH has terminal cancer and is young (early 40s). We have two DDs, 14yo lives with me and my DH, 16yo lives with ExH and her SM. Both the children have been told that when he dies, everything will be left to their SM with the (unofficial) understanding that she will provide them with financial help through Uni etc. I make no judgement as to whether this will happen or not, I don't know her well enough to be able to gauge this. ExH and wife are v well off.

Whilst I would have been pleased if the children were left something that was categorically 'theirs' I don't think it's any of my business. DH and I will help them with the cost of Uni as much as we are able, or they will have to do what lots of others do and get student loans.

The few (close friends and family) I have discussed this with have all been horrified and have said that, should this happen, I should contest the will on my DDs behalf. I feel really quite icky about this. AIBU to think that, whilst given similar circumstances, I might have made a different decision, it's none of my business?

"He left everything to my SM but her will and his explained that, after her death, the proceeds of his share of their home, plus his capital (she had the interest on this in her lifetime) would come to us."

Yeah - right until the surviving person changes their will. Once you have died it is up to the beneficiary what they do with their inheritance - even if you write in your will "I leave the money to X and then to Y when X dies" it's not valid. Once X has the money it is theirs to do what they want with. Leave things to the person you want them to go to - you can always put things in trust so that people can't be thrown out of their homes etc...but don't rely on someone just doing something after you have died.

It sounds like your girls have a lovely relationship with their SM, however I still think it is strange that he has chosen to do things this way. After all when he dies it will be SM's money and she will hand it out to the girls as and when and if she sees fit (or not). What a weird position to place everyone in.

HipHop - I couldn't agree more. That's why I handed it over to the vipers MN Jury for their robust discussion I think it's odd and it's making me bloody uncomfortable.

I'm trying to see a path through it all that minimises stress on DDs, and, to be fair, on their SM who has a dying husband. The views of people who aren't emotionally involved give me alternative viewpoints, which was much needed. Shame it's too early for though!

Isn´t the problem also if something happens to SM?

They are not her next of kin-would they be provided for at all?

She may also want to move/downsize...

It's common, though, I can't think of anyone who has done different, to be honest. Thinking of my uncle, DH dad and my own dad's plans with stepmum: nothing officially to the kids, all to the wife. Poor wife, having to watch her husband die & being told to worry about his live & well children. It's hard for her, too.

Would OP's DDs have any claim if her children were age 18+?

Before my mom died she made it clear that although I would nominally inherit everything, she expected me to divide equally with my (often irresponsible but quite adult brothers). A problem with this was that I could have died before I had a chance to dish the money out (to brothers & their children). I don't know that DH would have had the sense to figure out what was rightfully my niece/nephew's.

I do see it as weird HipHop. If he had still been married to the OP, he would probably have had a will leaving it all to her.. even as their biological mother she could still do what the hell she wanted to with it.

As I said earlier, my husband and I have joint assets. We have been married over ten years. Longer than he was married to his first wife. Our wills leave everything to each other, and as we have no children together, after we have both died, everything goes to the children and is split equally between them.

I inherited quite a lot of money after my mothers death, during this marriage. That is part of our joint wealth. My stepchildren will benefit from this after my death.

meant to say dont see it as weird, not do..

I work for a solicitors in this area of the law. I have seen this happen time and time again. And believe me, where money is involved and children from previous relationships there is always the risk of falling out and quite often the children get nothing.

We had a case of this very recently, albeit with grown up children, who ultimately got nothing from their father's Estate.

Unless the Will is of a discretionary nature then the SM inherits everything (from what you have said there is no provision for your children). In theory the children could end up with nothing.

And the fact is that they are dependents by nature of their respective ages. Please, please see a solicitor, just to get an idea of the position.

Remember you have six months from the date of the Grant of Probate (not the death) to make a claim against the Estate.

Orange, thank you so much for the clarity. You (and many others) have convinced me to arrange and appointment with a solicitor to try and get clarity about what the legal position is.

Squeaky - I agree that you and your husband have built up assets together. I was in a similar position. Which is why when I was married to my exh (he had four children from a previous relationship and we have one child together) we owned our property as tenants in common. His Will split his half of the house and any cash between all five children and I had a life interest whereby I could live in the house for as long as I wanted or until I remarried. My Will left my half share to my son only and my exh had a life interest in the house.

It was the only way to protect my half of our joint Estate for the benefit of my son. And it was the only way to protect my ex husband's half for the benefit of all of his children.

he should leave a % to your daughters, absolutely

I'm very relieved you are going to a solicitor. This just has disaster potential written all over it. And because you only have 6 months to challenge a will, if it emerges later than that that SM has no intention of ever giving DDs any money, it will be too late.

Another horrible scenario: SM decides to financially support one DD but not the other. Can you imagine the damage to the sibling relationship?

I am that your ex won't set up a trust.

What is going to happen when your Ex-H dies to the DD that lives with him? I assume she'll move back in with you?

you havent read all the thread Mini.. OP has covered that bit

This must be sorted out officially. My cousins dad remarried after his first wife died, he then died and left everything to new wife (only been married a year). New wife turned into absolute bitch, didn't want to know the kids, turfed them out of childhood home (they were 18 and 20). They got nothing then the new wife died and her son from previous marriage got the lot. My cousins didn't even get some of their late mothers stuff that was in the house contents. I really hope this doesn't happen to your kids.

Could you ask for it to be put in trust?

Sorry I just realised I hadn't read the thread properly!

But surely XH's money and the SM's money is, together, family money. That's what Mumsnet always says: "it's not his money and her money, it's family money."

Wouldn't it be awful if SM was supposed to empty her joint account and give half of it to the girls?

Often wouldn´t everything be left to the children with provision for the SM to live in the house, for example?

Thats what I think too Balloon.

If the SM had just walked into his life, married him, and the money was previously there and all his, then it would be different.

When I met my husband, he was living at his parents, as his ex had the family home and was living in it with her new husband. The kids were all under 18 at that point and living with her.

When she sold the house, my husband didnt see a penny of it. (He just couldnt be bothered to argue it with her).. long story. Even though he had originally paid the deposit, and paid the mortgage for years.

We bought a house together, have used my inheritance to pay off a large chunk of the mortgage and there is no way I would want to lose my home if he were to die. When I did, assuming he goes first, it goes to his kids then.. and not before.

I would ask a solicitor for advice but then do nothing until your ex dies and see what happens.
I certainly wouldn't view half of your ex's assets as belonging to his children as even if you were both still married and he died by the time the other spouse died all the money could have been spent on care home fees, home helps etc.
When my father dies I wouldn't be surprised if there was very little to inherit as old age is expensive.
In this case it would be best if he had decided to put money in a trust to see them through university but a solicitor will clarify whether or not you can force this to happen as he hasn't done this.
Challenging the will before you have discussed things with his current wife after his death seems premature.
If my husband died I'd expect to have a discussion with his adult children about money and if the children were younger with his ex-wife. If they went straight for challenging wills when he'd only been dead 5 minutes I'd see them as money grabbing and wouldn't be inclined to give them more than I had to in my grief stricken state.
I would be very cautious here, you could easily make things worse.

Definitely see a solicitor OP. My mum died 3 years ago without a will. She didn't have a lot of money but she did own half the house with my step dad (it was a council house bought by both of them but the rent was paid on the house for some 10 years before my step dad and her got together). My step dad raised us since I was 9 and my brother was 5. I thought we were very close.

Within a year of my mum dying he married a lady 20 years younger than him who is now his next of kin. As far as I know he has no will either so this lady and her 4 children will inherit my mum's house.

My mum will turn in her grave about this but thems the breaks of having no will. I am positive my mum would have trusted my step dad to ensure that her share would go to my brother and me. I would have trusted him too! I would never have believed things would turn out this way.

Glad that you're going to see a solicitor about this, for two reasons. One is so that you're clear exactly what the legal position is. The other is so that, if the lawyer advises you that it would be best for your Ex to make provision in his will for the children, the request is coming from somebody neutral rather than directly from you.

It might be possible for your Ex to set up a trust that your daughters have access to at a particular age, and to name his wife and the solicitor as trustees - that way the money belongs to the children but their SM would have some control over its release.

It's not good as it stands because is so woolly. Is SM's idea of 'doing the right thing' the same as yours? Or DD1's? Or DD2's? Or even exH's?
It needs to be more precise and actually written into the will. You could phrase it as doing SM a favour by removing doubt - she won't know how much is 'right' but having £xxx written into the will absolves her of that decision.

Oh dear ....

I've been peripherally involved in a couple of cases re wills, and your exH is not doing the right thing AT ALL.

you really need to get it sorted out now, and in your daughters' interests. They're his daughters too, and he should be providing for them in his will. It is quite appalling frankly, that he isn't.

There's a famous fictional example here -the start of Jane Austen's Sense and Sensibiliity. Read that and weep ...

Basically there are two things to consider

1. your DDs are his dependants (yours too, obviously, but it's his estate were talking about).

2. AFAIK, neither you nor your daughters would be permitted by law to contest his current wife's will.

So, worse case scenario -- your ex leaves a substantial estate to his current wife. She remarries, or dies intestate. By law, your will is voided when you marry and your spouse is assumed to be your major heir. So the SM could leave all "her" estate to whomever she pleased, and neither you nor your daughters could do a thing.

I saw this happen to a family friend. Her parents divorced. Her father remarried, and they didn't think about his will. He was pretty well off so it was a reasonable estate. He died and left everything to his 2nd wife. Again his children didn't do anything they didn't realise they should have. She died and lo and behold! In her will, envy thing had been left to her children (there were no children of the 2nd marriage). So her children got the substantial estate of my friend's father, and my friend and her brother got absolutely nothing. They had no grounds on which to contest the 2nd wife's will. They found out too late-- that they should have contested their father's will. They were likely to have been awarded half the estate between them.

Now, if there's not much to leave, well maybe it's no big deal. If its just his interest in a house shared with his second wife. But your daughters would be considered by the law (as I understand it) to be their father's dependents, and so should be provided for clearly, and fairly.

I'm talking purely about the money above, but don't underestimate the emotional impact on your daughters. My mother was left out of h father's will, because she married very well (in my father's family it's all trusts and big estates) and he thught she didn't need anything from him. But she was devastated. Luckily my aunts are all wonderful sisters and split the estate 4 ways. But whenever I think of doing something other than that which is absolutely fair with my will, in relation to heirs etc, I think if seeing my mothers face on hearing about her father's will.

IMO, "fair" in this case would be at least half your exH's estate to his daughters, if not more. Alternatively all his estate in a trust, which his current wife administs and has the use of the income for herself, but the capital eventually goes to his daughters (that's the arrangement I'm familiar with). But young children, starting out in life, need it more than an adult frankly.

Whoops, crossings out went wrong - that sentence should be read, not crossed out!