To ask how defending Lawyers/Solicitors sleep at night.

[lollilou]

When they are defending someone who is accused of a horrible crime and that they know are guilty yet have to come up with a defense to try to get a not guilty verdict? It must happen a lot, how could you live with yourself in that situation? What if the accused gets off then commits another crime?

I have a friend who is a defence lawyer, and I asked her this question. FWIW she does litigation work, so defends dodgy plumbers and the likes, rather than the truly evil murderers etc.

Her response was insightful, she said she aids in achieving a fair trial, and often won't push for a not guilty verdict, but just a lesser sentence. In her experience, a lot of cases are settled out of court, which can be mutually beneficial.

"There are numerous reasons - which the govt is trying to address - but that just points to a failing system, not being able to access therapy, length of time to get to court, family pressure, indirect harassment, MH issues brought on by abuse, suicide, false reporting if I remember accounts for around 6.8% but I haven't checked that."

None of which are anything to do with defence lawyers.

The CPS requirement for a 70% chance of a successful prosecution?"

I can deal with that pretty easily. It doesn't exist.

If you dont want to be tarred with same brush - why defend them? It's a total cop out to say my views don't count - it's a way to ease your own conscience.

That's what we were told - but you may be right - the OIC couldnhave passed misinformation I guess.

YABVVU.

(re 70%)

"Why defend them?"

I find it difficult to understand why, if you've read the many cogent, calm and informed responses on this thread from defence practitioners, you are still asking this question.

Mustbe- conviction rates for rape once it gets to court are actually pretty respectable, what happens prior to that is not the fault of barristers or solicitors.

Rape conviction rates in court rose to 62.5% last Guardian article
Obviously there's been a lot of attrition before that.

Mustbe- you keep saying this barrister was lying about matters of fact, just because something is written down, doesn't make it true. You say one thing the defendant clearly said another, why should either be taken as fact, without challenge?

Oh shit, you're right, I shall protest against an imperfect system by resigning forthwith and take my self off to weave a hair shirt to appease my conscience. Or not.

My conscience, does not need easing, thank you very much. Once again you are assuming that all defendants are guilty, all lawyers know this and they all carry on regardless at the expense of the victims. They aren't and don't. Maybe some, but not me. I would never accuse you of lying about your experiences. It's is incredibly rude to make assumptions about my moral turpitude.

Anyway, I can't imagine that you will ever, set against your personal experiences ever feel any confidence in those that work within the system and I would be wasting my time trying to convince you I have integrity. But please don't assume your sample size of one I'd reflective of an entire profession.

Must sleep now, assuming my conscience allows it.

Dilys yes I understood them to be 58% in court (57% for general crime), I've been trawling trying to find the source. (think it was Stern) What I can't get a breakdown for - from anywhere - is what proportion of that 58% (or 62.5) arise from a guilty plea. Anecdotally I am told is a high proportion - but base facts - can't get to them.

But that doesn't change that fact that relatively few reported crimes result in conviction or that there is a fundamental issues with that

The guilty pleas will be in many cases on the advice of those defence lawyers you seem to detest!

London the defendant said nothing about it - he was never asked to confirm or deny.

The only thing I am saying is a fact is that the police were called to my house on a specific occasion - that is a fact, a matter of official police record - black and White, documented, with relevant log number - confirmed (not in court was never asked) by OIC.

I detest anyone who stands by a child raping abuser - it isn't limited to barristers

Well clearly someone disputed what you believe to be fact!

Rosemary I May have only attended one trial but I could probably write a well researched and composed thesis on this topic.

I have spent over a year researching - and I don't mean on wikipedia - no it doesn't make mend qualified as you - but I am not stupid enough to base such strong views merely on our own experiences.

Sadly enough for me - I was considering moving into the field of victim support before this ever hit our family - I was well aware of the flaws in the system before we ever became a part of it - which believe me - doesn't help.

And what about if tonight you were identified and accused of libelling or slandering a man who has been found not guilty by the courts. Would you want a solicitor to advise you at the police station?

Yes the barrister - to a child - the barrister told my child "so your mother lied to you" because they weren't present.

Strangely - they didn't put this to any of the adult witnesses - including OIC or even the defendant - just to a child they could bully and intimidate.

I haven't posted anything that hasn't been in the press.

Well I did - but I had it removed - I have had very specific advice on what I can and cannot say.

And for the record - he hasn't been found not guilty as yet.

Londonone, libel is a civil matter, the police wouldn't get involved.

I detest anyone who stands by a child raping abuser - it isn't limited to barristers

But you don't know that they are until they are convicted in a court of law. To get a conviction they must have representation. Some one has to do that job.

I am really very sorry you have been through such a hellish time but I really don't understand why you have such hatred to all defence lawyers.

The only thing the police could get involved in is "harassment" and I have nothing to do with him, his friends or his family, the fact wenas as a family believe he is guilty is a matter of public record.