Would I be unreasonable to ask for a breakdown of costs for a quote from a tradesman?

[DueinSeptember]

I've just had a quote for some work on my house from a plasterer. There's a few rooms to plaster and a laminate floor to lay.

It's come to about £1k more than I was expecting. He text me today to tell me the price.

Would it be unreasonable to text back and ask for a breakdown of cost room by room?

How would you word the text.

I'd like to go with him as he's done work for my family and know he's reliable and does a good job but it's just the price I was a bit shocked by.

I just had a quotation for the whole sum and was told that once I accepted the quotation, then I would get the breakdown and references. But the point to me was, even if the amount was in budget, I couldn't compare it to other quotes and I couldn't work out if I was happy with how the work was being costed.

Thanks everyone, I may get a few more quotes and then decide.

Someone once got stroppy because dh added VAT on to their breakdown. Dh's quotations always say plus VAT.

He often gives a 10% discount if you pay on completion in cash. It then can be banked that day.

A lot of people get grumpy about prices that they get given as they can get the part cheaper, but have forgotten to factor in labour and how long it can take dh to drain a system, remove the part, replace the part then refill the system before testing.

We had one bloke refuse to pay after authorising dh to go ahead, so dh took the part back out of the boiler and left. Bloke was raging as he thought he would be getting a free part!

From a business point of view this is a classic customer 'trick' .Ask for a price for a large job, and then expect 25% of the work to cost 25% of the price.It doesn't work like that!!

A lot of tradesmen now work on day rates, I know my DH does, and he explains this to customers from the outset. He will obviously cut his day rate in half for a half days work, but doesn't usually quote an hourly rate.

What he does say is that if a job takes him longer than what he has quoted for, providing that it is not down to some mega disaster occurring, he will not up the charge to cover his extra time....

I agree about the drain down time for plumbers, especially on antiquated heating systems etc, or like at our house where there is no bloody drain tap !!

@oopsi, a lot of people don't realise that the preparation stage is often the most time consuming, and you don't actually see anything coming together until 75% job is complete......

How does the tradesman know how much to charge if s/he doesn't have a clue how much the job will cost, Fred?

Since you go on to say they don't want questions, do you mean that they don't want us to know how a quote is broken down in order that we don't question it? Aren't we entitled to know if we are getting the best possible value for money?

If you're saying that a tradesman quotes for a job without knowing how much the materials will cost, that's a bit worrying. I would expect them to know.

There isn't actually anything wrong with wanting to know what you are paying for materials and what for labour. Unless you know that, how can you know if you are being charged a fair price?

Actually, I tend to get them to quote, find out what they're telling me materials are and then say ok, that's fine, but don't worry about the materials, you tell me what you need and I'll provide them myself.

I find that by identifying the labour element first, as part of the overall price quoted, then removing the materials element by providing them myself - I actually save money. Even though they have access to trade discounts and everything.

I do the same with cars - how much for this job, how much of that is parts, how much is labour, that's great, I'll bring in my own parts, my brother in law works for an spares place, so I get a great discount.

Gnomedeplume has summed up my thoughts. Yes by all means ask for the quote to be split into rooms but customers that ask for a breakdown of everything and then start querying the price of materials and the labour are a PITA. They wouldn't go into Tesco and start quibbling the price of everything would they?

I see it more like taking your trolley round the aisles, looking at each item and seeing the price, deciding whether you are happy to pay that price, if you are, you put it in the trolley, if you're not, you choose something else and when you get to the checkout, you know how much you are going to have to pay.

I don't think I'd like to go into tesco, hand my list over at the door, have them tell me that the total will be £X, take it or leave it, and refuse to tell me how much each item actually cost.

For all I know, they charged me £60 for a jar of coffee.

Yes I totally agree with that Hec, what I'm meaning is someone saying 'What? X costs Y amount. Can't you use a cheaper supplier and your labour charge is a bit high' rather than someone getting a breakdown and deciding it's more than they are prepared to pay.

HecateTrivia Because they know roughly how much plaster etc. they'll need for the size of rooms provided - but they won't have measured accurately every nook and cranny, so can't know exactly how much. It costs them more - because of the time taken to get an accurate quantity - than it does to estimate from their experience and take the hit if they under estimate. If they over estimate of course they'll be more expensive than the other quotes so won't get the job.

They also will have very good ideas of total cost of materials, but not a breakdown, because they buy everything as a whole for a job and not individual items. It's not like your tesco's example because each item in there is optional, with the trade it's not, so you can't pick and choose not to have the various materials. With car repair it's more similar as the mechanic has a less generic job (parts needed are different in each job and the same part costs different for each job) so that is more parts+labour.

And no there's absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to know! It's just time consuming for the guy providing the information, so they need to need the job and prepared to invest the time in getting it. Otherwise they're out of pocket for the couple of hours of effort.

Whilst I'm in a radically different trade to the above, I also prefer both giving and receiving quotes based on simple day rates and materials seperately, but it's time consuming preparing so I can see why people don't want to do it.

Yes, you're right. It was a bit different. I was just trying to illustrate that an overall cost isn't good enough in order to determine if you're getting value for money and you have to know what you're paying in order to decide whether to pay it.

I wouldn't presume to tell them which type of material to use. I wouldn't go to a surgeon and demand they used X instrument and not Y, or go to a teacher and demand they taught maths this way and not that. So I wouldn't go to a plasterer and demand that they use the material that's a quid cheaper, when I know nothing about plastering.

But you should know that they aren't trying to charge you eighty six quid for a paintbrush, or five hundred quid an hour for labour!

To get a quote by text isnt that professional really. My DP is a "tradesman" and i always produce him estimates, mostly with a breakdown, unless it is a pissy small job when its not necesary.

He will often charge an hourly rate if customers want various small or non-standard jobs, this works very well to prevent the problem of customers saying "oh, while your here could you just.........." and then not expecting to pay any extra for it - i know this seems incredible, but it happened so much that i insisted on this and also if jobs are done on a price i will include in the estimate that no extra work will be carried out without the price being agreed upon first - we have been tripped up so many times.

If we are doing a job with multiple rooms we woudl always break down per room/job - its better for us, then the client can see what they are paying for.

And NO we do not negotiate on the cost, the price is the price, we have a living to make so why would we piss about putting in an over inflated price just so we can negotiate, that would be a total waste of our time because the customers will just look elsewhere.

I am pretty sure this guy wont mind providing a breakdown if you ask him, he will have had to do that himself anyway to come up with the price, unless he has applied the "rule of thumb" which is pretty crap thing to do.

Thanks for all the advice.

The job was two parts, plastering and laying laminate floor.

He's come back and has said that the plastering is £2000 and the flooring is £1000 plus £300 for materials.

The plastering part is not too badly priced but the floor is a lot more than I expected as I had a carpenter do some work for me last year and he quoted a lot less - about half inc materials (but unfortunately not now working due to injury, otherwise I'd book him in a flash as he was amazing).

I'll consider the plastering work as he is a plasterer by trade, but won't get the floor done by him. I'll ask for a written quote so I've got some proof instead of a text too.

I may get a few carpenters to quote for the floor and see what they say.

RE the plastering - My DP generally charges £500 per room (depending on size). Funnily enough he is a carpenter by trade but plastering is one of those jobs that are easier to price. It seems a fair price that you have been charged if it is 3/4 rooms.

Re the laminate - £300 doesn't sound very much for materials but the labour seems excessive in comparison. Saying that, this job woudl be influenced by, is the room going to be clear of furniture? are there many alcoves and cuts that will have to be made? Is it push and click laminate? or will it have to be stuck down? For comparison my DP charges between £150 to £200 a day (depending on area) and i would imagine an average size room would take no more than 3 days to do, providing its not alcove central.

if it is £300 materials for the entire job, i suggest he has sucked this out of his thumb

Hi boring nickname - thanks for the feedback.

Yes, I think the material cost was for the plastering and the skirting (I reckon about £100 worth for the skirting) for the floors.

The £1000 was just for the labour costs for the floor. It's a click laminate, Quickstep. I feel it's a lot for the floor in comparison to the other work I've had before. I know another carpenter who went to school with me and he lives up the road so may give him a call to quote.

The plastering, it's in line with what I was thinking (ish), it's for 2 bedrooms, 1 kitchen ceiling and a hall,stairs and landing. So it's not too bad.

oh, yes, the materials sound right for what you say - maybe he is a bit unsure on the laminate and erring on the side of caution? It is one of those jobs that can be easier to do a large square room than a small room with lots of cuts