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AIBU?

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Original poster

AIBU to be shocked at new survey re children and books?

178 replies

mrscoleridge · 08/12/2011 17:17

New survey out seems to suggest that 4 million children do not have a book at home. AIBU to think this is completely unbelievable especially when cost is mentioned. I thought libraries were free and that you can pick up books for next to nothing on ebay/charity shops/second hand on Amazon etc. Our literacy rate is near the bottom of the table in Europe and no wonder; bet lots of theses households have Xbox and all that twaddle etc.

OP posts:
WoofingAroundTheXmasTree · 09/12/2011 17:38

DS (8) would much rather read a book than tidy his room/do his homework/get dressed in the morning like me

We also have Xbox etc.

LeQueen · 09/12/2011 17:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

exoticfruits · 09/12/2011 17:43

It doesn't surprise me in the slightest, which is a depressing thought. My DCs got library tickets as babies. I don't see how anyone can be a parent and not use the library. It gives the DC chance to choose the books they want.

Laquitar · 09/12/2011 17:53

Sardine and Cory have made excellent points. I'm sure the rest of the posters could understand those points if they wanted to. Instead they choose to ignore them because it feels soooo good to say ' Oh those poor children! Mine are so lucky, we ve got 100s books and we read every minute of the day. My heart bleeds for the rest of kids who have poor or idiot parents' Hmm

Ffs if you read so much then surely you should know how surveys are done and that they usually have an agenda.

Candid · 09/12/2011 17:57

When ds1 started school I was chatting to his teacher about reading and we were generally discussing the importance of reading.
She admitted to me very quietly that there are children that start school every year in her class that have never seen a book in their life and don't even know how to open one.
I must admit I was shocked at that but it seems to be fairly common. The school is not in a deprived area btw.

LaFilleSurLePont · 09/12/2011 17:57

An apparent lack of books doesn't necessarily mean that people don't read,Duchesse. I love books but I don't need to have them scattered around the house to prove it.

All of my books are upstairs,where guests almost never venture. I don't like to have them out on display as to me it's the equivalent of having my underwear drawer contents on display,my book collection is a very personal and private thing for me,plus if I have them downstairs people might want to borrow them,and I hate people borrowing my books,because I almost never get them back.

You might see just one or two books if you visit,or perhaps my Kindle,but I certainly have a plethora of reading material.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 09/12/2011 18:04

laquitar

I don't think your post really addresses the point of the thread. Yes, the survey may be flawed but nevertheless there is an issue with children not having access to books / a culture of reading at home. There is a risk that the lack of opportunity to read will affect their educational attainment. If there is also a link between books in the house and a higher level of parental education / social status / middle classness Hmm then a failure to deal with the the lack of opportunity to read may help entrench the already worrying lack of social mobility in this country.

Being able to read to a reasonable standard is a core skill.

Laquitar · 09/12/2011 18:15

LaFille when i lived in a small flat with no study i had no choice but to fill the living room with bookcases. Do you know what happenedz? One morning i made coffee before work, the books were in front of me so i picked one and nextthing i knew it was 10 am and i was still there! I had to phone work at make up a story about train problems Blush. Once i got a bigger house i was glad to put books in the study only and nowhere else. Otherwise i wouldn't get on with life. For the same reason i don't display chocolate in my living room and i don't count my choc bars!

I also agree with your points about some books being personal and about people asking to borrow them.

Candid sorry but i don't believe that teacher. Every child can turn a page.

Laquitar · 09/12/2011 18:20

I agree it is Chaz but i never met a child who has no books. Never. Ok there must be some but this figure is too high to believe it.

lljkk · 09/12/2011 18:24

The numbers programme on Radio 4, More Or Less, covered this story today & pointed out some... er, flaws in the survey assumptions and the way it's interpretted by others. They specifically addressed the issue of whether reading levels were associated with lack of access (conclusion=probably not).

SlinkingOutsideInSocks · 09/12/2011 18:51

Some deeply disingenuous posts on this thread, along the lines of, 'I just can't belieeeeeeve there are houses without books!!!!!' Shock

Come on. Do people genuinely think that the whole world is like our little cossetted, middle class MN bubble?

OP - YABU. What have free books in libraries and cheap second-hand books got to do with anything if the whole culture of reading is as foreign as the planet Mars to vast swathes of families. The cost of books has absolutely nothing to do with it. :(

giveitago · 09/12/2011 18:52

still no idea what biff is and just worked out what year 5 year is (based on a my ds in year 1)!

Oh jeez - this post is to boast about how WE love literature. And horror about the kids that don't. Shame. s of kids without books.

Liquitar - I know lots of kids without books. Very intelligent kids. Just without books to hand.

LineRunnerCrouchingReindeer · 09/12/2011 19:17

Slinking Agreed; which is why it is the direct link to adult functional illiteracy (especially with regard to mothers) that I think would change the culture of books/no books In The Home.

IndigoBell · 09/12/2011 19:30

But it's academic attainment we want to change (surely) - not books in the home.

gabid · 09/12/2011 19:47

Would interest me how they did that research. How do you define a book? Does the phone book count and who would actually admit to not having a book at home?

gabid · 09/12/2011 20:18

giveitago - you seem to be suggesting that parents being non English native speakers is a barrier to literacy.

I disagree, again, the key is education. If the parents (native English speakers or not) are reasonably well educated they will read and talk to their children a lot. Even if they don't speak or read to their children in English, the children will pick up English in nursery/school, and their English language skills are not any worse than their peers' - and they are bilingual! My DCs are bilingual and their teacher couldn't have guessed! And I know plenty of others in the same position.

LineRunnerCrouchingReindeer · 09/12/2011 20:23

A child who doesn't have books in the home probably doesn't have a mother who values reading. She doesn't value reading because she doesn't enjoy it, because she can't manage it well. If she learns to read to a point that she can enjoy stories and narratives, then she will share that with her DCs and they will all more likely have books in the house and read them.

In some parts of England adult functional illiteracy reaches 35%+ of white British adults.

mathanxiety · 09/12/2011 20:31

Well, DS could have answered that survey and said there are so many books at home it's sometimes hard to find a place to sit down. However, he has always refused to read for pleasure, sticking only to set texts for school, and hitting the PS whatever for fun and relaxation.

Report about a study indicating that having books in a home has the same effect on children as having university educated parents. The positive effect of books in a home is even more pronounced for lower income children than others. Apparently academic attainment follows the presence of books (as measured by years spent in school afaics)

gabid · 09/12/2011 20:53

mathsanxiety - hm, not sure about this. 500 books in your home can only help a child's education if someone in the house reads them or talks about them though, surely. And if someone chooses to have that many books in their house they must like reading at least and in turn will read to their children. And you don't need to be University educated to enjoy reading.

On the other hand, I think even if you furnished some peoples houses with 500 books, they either wouldn't look at them or use they for other purposes, which wouldn't help their children's literacy.

We have free libraries, with a lot more than 500 books in every village almost, that doesen't seem to improve literacy though?

daveywarbeck · 09/12/2011 21:00

When I was a child we only had books from the library. But I had five or six books from the library every week, as did (and still does) my mother. So we would have been a household without books according to this survey, but that would tell you nothing about the reading going on in the house.

andaPontyinaPearTreeeeee · 09/12/2011 21:07

I think it's difficult for those of us who love reading (or at least who are comfortable with books) to actually comprehend that not everyone feels the same... I remember watching a programme where a teacher (Phil Beadle?) taught illiterate adults to read, I was so sad to see them struggle - adult illiteracy is not something I've ever encountered.

I work in a library and a new mum friend mentioned she is going to join at last - her DDs do have some books but my colleagues were shocked that someone with a 10yo had never joined and didn't really know what was offered.

bebanjo · 09/12/2011 21:55

once agen it looks like all the money is going to the wrong people, i have had 3 lots of books from book start that i nether wanted or needed, DD has her own book case so would not be missing out. why did these family's not get there book start books?

suebfg · 09/12/2011 22:02

Nah, it's nothing to do with money. There's no excuse for not having access to books - you can borrow for free at the library or pick them up for 25p from the charity shops.

usualsuspect · 09/12/2011 22:08

I don't think having 5 million books at home has any thing to do with how much people read tbh

I don't think having 5 million books at home makes you a better parent either

But don't let that stop the smugness on this thread

cairnterrier · 09/12/2011 22:10

Slightly off topic - DS has a bedtime story every night and we go to the library every couple of weeks or so to pick new ones. Reading all the posts above where people say that their DCs know books by heart, I'm just wondering if I should be doing some repetition of the books that he has rather than always getting new ones.

Oh and does anyone else's 2yr old walk around continually whilst they're trying to read a story to them?