to think that the norm of having a 2 working parent household, is fairly responisble for making housing cost so high

[carriedaxmaspud]

fair enough if both parent swant to work, its their choice, we are all differnt and want to do different things,
but seems to me that now the norm is for both parents to work, thats whats made house prices and rents go through the roof

i mean ther prices can only go up to what people can afford, so if buting a house was based on one persons wage not 2, the house prices would never have reached the outrageous prices they have.

hairy - yeah, the 'if more women stayed at home we'd be fine' argument is pants. Maybe if the City employed more women at senior levels it would be less macho and we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place...

too right Edam. At risk of sounding sexist, women do a better job of senior management IMHO!!!

the norm has always been for both parents to work - if you were working poor.

ffs arse bollocks arse arse PHHHHHHHHHHHHHHFTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT arghhhhhhh

this 1950's AMERICAN utopia shit really fucks me off.

Xenia what a blooming excellent post!

My family history shows much the same pattern (except I'm at twenty six young men in a three bed semi - that is quite something!)

edam- you think if women had the same bonuses dangled infront of them then they wouldn't go all out to get it.

bravo Xenia

although my call centre job pays our mortgage :)

Even 10 years ago housing was more affordable. The average single person on the average national wages at the time could afford at least a 1 bed flat if not a 2 bed flat in a reasonable area. Since then there has been a property boom where a lot of people have thought buying houses to rent out is/was a get rich quick scheme, and this was aided by cheap mortgages. 10-12 years ago generally speaking mortgages multiples were 3x 1 income plus 1 of a 2nd income, or 2.75x 2 incomes. Then self-certification came in, or people affording mortgages working out at 6x!!!! their incomes. It was unsustainable and the bubble burst.

I don't think dual income households are to blame. Like someone else said, probably fits into the overall picture somewhere but there's an awful lot of other bigger and more likely reasons at the front of the queue first.

What has that go to do with anything OP? Are we worthless as call centre workers or checkout staff? YOU are the only one making a distinction about types of work and YOU are the one blaming the end of some non-existent good time on working women.

bonnie that was a reply to xenias comment.
"If women can't afford morggages perhaps they shoudl have chosen better careers. No one forces you to choose to work in a call centre. Get an education."

as i said not everyone can be a top surgeon or ceo.

why don't you read before you post

your op is nonsensical and whimsy.
why not consider
-supply and demand
-planning constraints
-green belt policies
-previous economic growth drove demand
-impact of interest rates

i didn't say it was the only reason, did i!

Doh!so what would you do?compulsory domestic drudgery no more women working to see if that affects house prices

and fwiw i dont see you bigging up any other factors in your op

Lots and lots of reasons behind the whole housing thing.

but as a family where one aprent has to be at home for caring reasons (albeit trying to get going working from home so other can work elsewhere) it does cause a lot of issues that society cannot seem to cope with.

if all you see it as is "compulsory domestic drudgery" i actually relly feel for you as i think your missing very something special

anyway as jolly as this is

got to dash as its my xmas do tonight

goodbye.
and goodluck!

and if you see housing prices so simplistically you are missing bleedin obvious

i have never missed anything special,not even a precious moment

Really SM? It depends on the career and what you do of course but I know I did- a few Christmas plays and the like I wish I could have made.

No flexibility at all in what I did though so that was that.

i mean i have never missed out by working.i want to pay mortgage and contribute for family and have financial autonomy. my own money

i chose excellent nurseries and other paid support to maintain me at work.

I did read, she was responding to you banging on earlier.

And it is compulsory domestic drudgery if you are forced to do it. Lets not pretend scrubbing toilets and folding laundry is anyones joie de vivre.

In some ways I agree with the op.

When I got married 15 years ago we easily afforded a small 2 bed house which cost £75,000 based on my DH's salary (about £16,000). We did not include my salary as I knew that when we had children I would stop working for about a year and then probably only work part time. This may provide shrieks of horror on Mumsnet but in the real world this is quite a normal thing to do, even though I am a feminist and have a degree! No Xenia, I do not want to retrain to be a heart surgeon.

We lived on my DH's salary and saved all my income, using it as a deposit a few years later for a larger house.

This would be a luxury and would be impossible to do now due to high house prices. Our first house recently sold for £280,000 which is too high for even combined salaries of first time buyers.

lol bpc,think you'll find most people are banging out that op is nonsensical

and two working adults aren't responsible for rising house prices

but yes in response to the op,what is her solution. compulsory 1 wage families.enforced wee wifey status

Well if women stopped working, there would be about 8 million jobs unfilled, so we would need a lot of immigrants to do the work, so there would not be enough houses and houses would be even more sought after and push prices up even more.

House price inflation is mostly due to: lack of housing supply, and Margaret Thatcher saying everyone should be a homeowner and making everyone think that way, then the banks enabling this by lending silly amounts of money...

if women stopped working there would be huge skills gulf.working women contribute hugely.engine of the economy.jobs would still need done and men shouldn't automatically be able or want to step in either

yabu. The ridiculous rise of house prices in this country was nothing to do with two parents working.

bonnie,
just to make it easier for you as you seem to be having trouble reading the thread

xenia said

" Xenia Wed 15-Dec-10 16:05:43
Tondy... is right. In 1901 my grandfather lived with 26 other young men in a 3 bed semi. Presumably they slept in shifts. That as the 1901 census. My grandmother worked. Her mother worked. If you didn't work you starved. There is no golden time when life was easy. In 1983we bought our first house. There was no maternity pay (I hadn't worked long enough to get it) so I took 2 weeks holiday and then went back full time when my first child was 2 weeks old. the cost of our childcare was more than one of our wages. Interest rates were 12%. The basic rate of tax was 33%.

We are in a recession now as we have had over the yars so times are hard for people but they were never much better in the past. My parents waited 13 years of marriage before having children so they could afford them. My grandfather married at well over 40 because he could not afford a family until then.

What we do need to guard against is sexism and threads about if only women were chained to sinks the world would be a better place is something that belongs in rural Sudan not the UK in 2010. If women can't afford morggages perhaps they shoudl have chosen better careers. No one forces you to choose to work in a call centre. Get an education. Qualify to be a leading surgeon. Think about these things as teenagers. Don't just go for the lowest paid job possible because you think that's a morally b etter position. Consider your ability to fund your family. Don't assum eyou will live off male earnings for life."

to which i replied
"carriedaxmaspud Wed 15-Dec-10 16:11:14
well someone has to work in the call centres not EVERYONE can be a ceo or top surgeon, the bins need collecting the shops need staffing the children need teachers and the hospitals need nurses etc.

we can't all be in top ceo type jobs surely you get that"

so whos the one slagging off certain jobs???

and you reply
"BonniePrinceBilly Wed 15-Dec-10 17:14:50
What has that go to do with anything OP? Are we worthless as call centre workers or checkout staff? YOU are the only one making a distinction about types of work and YOU are the one blaming the end of some non-existent good time on working women."

you are clearly not reading the thread bonnie.

i am clearly not saying call centers staff are worthless, i'm saying not everyone can do what xenia suggests as not everyone can be a ceo etc, and that the call centres etc still need to be staffed etc

anyway i really am going now.

and ive already said thats not the only reason and we can reverse it now

so stop making stuff up
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