Adult Adoptee Looking for Support

[Humsta]

I've seen some old threads on this topic but they seem inactive so hopefully a new one will stimulate some advice.

I am a 39 year old adoptee who has two children and is generally seen as successful in life. I have meet both my biological parents, with different consequences and sadly both my adoptive parents have died, one when I was 19 and the other when I was 30.

Most of the time I feel I'm an independent adult but every so often I seem to have phases of negativity centering around relationships and expecting too much from people/feeling dissapointed by them. Having reached this age I'd like to try and get these emotional issues resolved as I feel I can get angry with my other half and children far too quickly and that I'd be a better person if I could put these feelings in a box once and for all, or at least develop better coping mechanisms.

I have a relationship with my birth mother but my feelings have changed towards her over the years as I've had my own family, from feeling total forgiveness to getting more resentful that she really doesn't seem to realise the impact she's had on my life. I have spoken to her about it in the past but think ultimately I've expected her to be my mother, and as life goes on I realise she never really will be and at best is a friend. I know this is better than nothing but it's hard reconciling what I thought our relationship would be (her spending her life trying to make it up to me) compared to what it actually is (She's very nice when I call but ultimately gets on with her own life and I could not hear from her for weeks/months at a time). I know she doesn't owe me anything and I must have been someone she let go of along time ago but basically I don't want this shite dragging me down emotionally anymore., life's too short!

I'm looking for a counsellor but feel unless they are really experienced in adoption it could take a long time to get nowhere. Does anyone recommend anyone or know of any groups in the UK where I could find support, perhaps even give it to others in a similar situation to me?

Any thoughts appreciated :-)

On this site (reflection of life!) it's quite hard to find the adoption section, it's there under a search but I can't see where adoption fits into the different categories? I'll keep looking. I don't want to exclude anyone from the triangle (I love this new to me phrase ) but do feel a much greater understanding from fellow adoptees....however I don't think we've reached double figures yet and surely MN would like a lot more interest for a dedicate section.

Regarding the term, for me it's more semantics because being in touch with my different sets of parents if I'm chatting I sometimes have to clarify who is who. Had they still been alive it would never have been how I introduced my adopted parents in person, I would just have said this is my mum and dad.

Found it...under becoming a parent and this a parenting website so that's understandable if not ideal. I'd prefer a section under talk I think...even if it was barren!

Kewcumber but don't understand the point you are making, I am sorry. I was making the point that for me, adoption is present tense, not past tense one off event, responding to your point. Are you correcting my language? I would always say adoptive parents, tbh, right or wrong. Totally agree it is semantics.

Gosh it's spiky here in adoption today...

everyone.

PS I wouldn't want to exclude anyone either. There is no reason at all why there couldn't be some crossover. I am sure adoptees would provide advice if asked! And vice versa. It is extremely interesting for me to read what is currently happening with adoption.

Hi there I'm an adult adoptee with three children of my own.

I knew my birth mum but sadly lost her when I was a teenager. I've never met my biological father.

Sadly I'm estranged from my adoptive parents for complex reasons.

I really identify with the feelings expressed here. On the whole I'm happy and successful. My own children and dh are my world. But I'm still periodically plagued by self-doubt, inadequacy and rigid thinking.

I was expected to feel grateful to my adoptive parents and that's what I resent most. That I was made to feel I should be indebted to them and lucky someone took me on. It felt like love came with conditions.

Hi stugtank and thanks for your input. Could you add your name to this thread Adult Adoptees - Dedicated Section Under Talk Topics
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/2615209-Adult-Adoptees-Dedicated-Section-Under-Talk-Topics because I'm not sure whether NMs would monitor both? I hope we can find a compromise that suits everybody.

I just wanted to clarify that when I referred to a crossover I meant between 2 separate sections. There is growing support for a separate section (hurrah!) but this does not mean that everyone posting will only stick to one or other.

As an adopted mother I feel that newly adoptive parents / adoptive parents could possibly learn from adoptees and their experiences. I for one have many moments of self doubt as to whether I'm 'doing it right' (don't we all). But particularly I have picked up on many comments regarding 'being made to feel lucky' - I'm interested in finding out in what respect made you feel your adopted parents made you feel that way? Though actions / spoken words? That's of course if you don't mind me asking. I genuinely feel that if I could relate to some real life experiences I may have a better clue at what I'm doing ensure (as much as humanly possibly) to do the right thing for my child.

I think there is a lot to be learnt from the groups all being as 'one' so to speak. But completely understand others perspectives on possibly different areas. That said agreed with (I think Kew) that the traffic that comes through here is quite small compared to other areas of the MN Site, so further segregation may reduce that even more.

Hi Tippy6312, bare with me and I'll try to explain how I feel, others after me might put it better.

I would say my adopted parents never told me that I should feel lucky and they also never made any kind of threats about sending me back - they were very stable in that sense. I think the issue would be that I knew I was lucky to be adopted because my mother gave me up and at least I was in a family, but that didn't quite tally with my feelings of being rather unlucky that I wasn't kept in the first place. So perhaps it was more that my expectations of my feelings didn't live up to my actually feelings - does that make any sense?

If I can butt into the "lucky" thing - DS certainly knows I am the lucky one because I tell him that. Sometimes you have to articulate it very clearly particularly when some interfering old busy body has just told your child that they are "lucky" re being adopted.

I have had the conversation with DS that it's me who was lucky because I got to have him instead of someone else equally nice or maybe even nicer! That there was no way he wouldn't have had a very lovely family in any event because he was such a lovely child that I was just lucky it was me.

It's easier to say because I believe it.

Humsta -I have to the well meaning adults (out of earshot of DS) who come out with the "lucky" line that "Lucky" is growing up in calm and safety with your birth parents and would they think it was lucky if their child had been removed and given to a different family.

I understand that they mean lucky in the sense things could have been worse but I think adopted children should have the same benchmark for "luck" as any other child and should not be grateful that things weren't worse.

It is possible to feel unlucky without stamping all over the good things in your life - the two things are perfectly compatible eg

• my mum was unlucky to have developed a cancer with a poor prognosis, she was lucky to have survived it, she was unlucky to have side effects from the treatments, she was lucky to live long enough to know DS who was adopted just as her cancer treatment finished. We are all lucky she is still alive and living happily with the side effects which are managable.

You can feel lucky that you have good parents or unlucky that you didn't - I see that as being something that holds with any parents. You certainly shouldn't feel grateful they adopted you, they did it for their own reasons which you had no choice about, no need for gratitude ("boolocks to that" was I think my phrase of choice on a similar thread). I would be very happy if one day DS feels glad that it was me who adopted him and not someone else but if he also feels sad that the adoption was necessary I would absolutely understand that - that was not within my control and I don't take it personally.

Life dealt you a shit hand very early on and you're quite entitled to feel that you wish it hadn't. Also you can feel proud that you have taken the shit hand and, with the help of the people around you, have made a life that you are happy with.

boolocks???

Bollocks of course

Thank you Humsta, that makes sense. So it's almost like a feeling within as opposed to outright statements.
The reason I ask, as Kew has touched on, as our little one gets the 'lucky' comment from every Tom Dick and Harry. It's frustrating. Mostly out of ear shot, but sometimes not. I just wondered / worry that statements such as that may eventually make him feel the same way.

It must feel like a huge burden, to feel that you 'ought' to feel lucky, but inside you don't. But presumably to not want to voice that, as that would 'dishearten' those around you that you feel you should be grateful to?

It's just trying to think of ways to ensure our children don't feel that way. As in they may be lucky in the sense that any child may be, 'wow you're lucky to have that new toy....' kind of thing. But certainly not lucky to have been removed from one place, and placed somewhere else. No child should feel 'lucky' to have parents, it's almost a given. It's difficult when wider family (in my instance) and practical strangers feel the need to comment on how 'Lucky' DS is.

What do you feel may have (if anything) helped from your adopted parents to rid of these underlying feelings? Again thank you so much for explaining.

I find the adoptee/adopter dialogue on here really interesting because for me it illustrates how different adoption today is from the process I went through in the 1960s. So in some ways we are talking about different things.

I was removed from my birth parents because they were not married when I was conceived. There was no other reason for the decision. They were stable, financially secure and in a long term relationship. They married before my adoption was legalised and went on to have other children together. Seen in the cold light of day it is an outrage - for which I can thank the Roman Catholic church. I think human beings across all cultures understand instinctively that there is something fundamentally wrong with removing a child from his kith and kin to be raised by strangers. That is why adoption is so fascinating for the general public and why over the years it has formed the basis of fiction from Tarzan and the Jungle book to Harry Potter to Greek tragedy.

Even without the devastating early life experiences of today's adoptees - and despite what looks to any outside observer as a very successful and fulfilled life - it has left me with a huge sense of loss. I have never felt anything other than unlucky. It has left a kind of empty hollow at the core of my psyche. I sometimes feel like a non person. I know this is irrational - and I think most friends and aquaintances would be astonished if they knew how I felt. But I have met other adoptees who understand what I mean. And I do not think that feeling ever goes away.

I think some of the problems that adoptees of my generation have may be exacerbated by the parenting they received in their adoptive homes. We were often placed with infertile couples who had never come to terms with their own infertility and were sold the adoptive children as substitutes for children of their own. In my case, my adoptive parents got five children, none of whom were siblings, and when things did not turn out the way they expected they could not cope. Add a dose of religious fervour, all the secrets and lies, and you really do get a toxic mix.

Todays adopters are a different group. They are carefully vetted and go into the process with their eyes open. And there are far fewer secrets. That must be a good thing for them and for the children they adopt.

Kewcumber and Tippy I am not sure how Humsta sees it, but I am confused as I don't think she mentioned anyone else saying how lucky she was? Are these just your concerns?

If so, and if it helps, I was told I was lucky frequently by strangers and it didn't bother me. I also got told I was lucky to have such shiny hair and that got about the same amount of my attention. What bothered me was how I felt. Like Lago I felt like a non person very often. Tippy my advice would be to pay attention to how your adopted children feel, always, and validate it. You can't take away any pain they feel but you can make it better. And please don't take it personally if they want more contact with their other parents, if that is possible. I was quite capable of loving both, albeit in different ways, and I am sure your children will be the same.

I am not sure I agree that adopters or adoption is very different nowadays though. Reading the other threads on here it seems to be the same mix and many of the same attitudes as years gone by. There appears to be more awareness of issues relating to attachment and trauma but that applies in relation to all children, I think.

Stugtank said she felt as though she was supposed to feel lucky for being adopted.

It's something I hear a lot as well about my ac. As well as 'oh you're doing a fantastic job with her!' Brilliant. Some people are just stupid though innit?

Lago times have definitely changed but I think it still feels the same to be the adoptee, perhaps the healing is quicker now. Did you ever meet your birth parents?

Tippy I don't have advice as to how to avoid it because the adoption can't be avoided but I think if you as the parent can be aware, at least you can constantly counteract it. Like you say, when well meaning family member say aren't you lucky.....what?? Certainly my Dad and I had a good enough bond to know that a kn@b head was a kn@b head, so what I mean by that is you don't have to belittle the person saying it but you can certainly reiterate to your child in private that it isn't how you see it and it isn't black and white, but know yourself that your child might not even understand if the comment makes them feel bad, personally I was always super aware but never shared a feeling, that's how I remember it.

I would also say the best times we had in our family was when we had fun - that was hard in the recession plus other non-me factors (yes there were some!) but I'd say children need to laugh and not be serious, play with the family, that's what I wish we'd had more of, and my dad agreed in later years, he missed out because of his strictness..but that's probably not much to do with adoption either.

Here here Narnia

Humsta

I met my birth mother for the first time in my 30s. Sadly my birth father had died some years earlier but I also met my birth siblings. We got on well from the start and are still in regular contact. The relationship may be helped by the fact we are in different countries so it is not too intense. It was all a huge surprise for me as I had always been told my mother was a single student who could not have kept me. Nothing could have been further from the truth. I think my adoptive parents were lied to as well and genuinely believed the story.

It took me too long to get round to tracing them. Living outside UK meant it was difficult to get access to relevant information. The RC adoption Society also put endless obstacles in the way - insisting on several appointments with a social worker for counselling before they shared information with me. This required me to take time off work to fly back to UK for patronising meetings with an unbelievably unprofessional social worker. She cancelled one appointment after I had arrived at the offices because she had double booked. Obviously not capable of running a diary. On the other occasions she was late, badly prepared, and wittered on about her problems before boring me with repeated statements of the b* obvious. I am still angry about it now. I eventually by passed her by getting the papers sent to London where the social worker just handed them all over.

Some of my adoptive siblings also traced their birth families and another also found her parents had married and she had a set of full siblings. Again the only reason for the adoption was the conception outside marriage.

I cannot help but feel that we were fed a load of lies by the RC church who had a nice little business in trading babies from unmarried Catholic girls to infertile Catholic couples. I am now old enough to realise that the priests and nuns involved in the trade were themselves probably forced into the Church by societal pressures and probably believed that what they were doing was right. You can't judge them by today's values. But it does not excuse what they did.

You can't judge them by today's values - no intellectually we all know that... but it's kinda hard not to isn't it.

Lago it's bloody outrageous, thank God that western society has moved on, although there will always be bad people in the world doing things in the name of something else.

What is ironic is that these agencies supposed to be helping someone who's already got huge rejection issues - continually reinforce that message. Perhaps it is part of their history they try to brush under the carpet.

Good for you for persevering and getting yourself in a place you can objectively look back on your life. Yes, as adoptees we have suffered but I also think as adults we tend to be strong, resilient and self-reliant in the wider world.

The obstacles from the RC Adoption Society sound bloody outrageous too! Especially as you were abroad! The wittering social worker description made me laugh though.

I wonder how many children were involved. And if anyone has ever tried to sue them.... They are still operating in terms of records clearly, but also still organising adoptions?

I think all the RC adoption agencies in Britain withdrew from adoptions when they were told they had to be prepared to consider same sex couples as adopters.

Nice