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TulipTiptoer · 21/06/2025 15:49

SerendipityJane · 21/06/2025 12:22

As I said, the world knows that Trump can't rely on the US Army to run his little dictatorship.

It's one of the reasons the Nazis had to create the SS - because they couldn't rely on the regular army to do their political bidding.

I can see it now: TrumpTroopers

Has it already started. Four shoo-ins jump through the ranks without basic training

www.wired.com/story/what-lt-col-boz-and-big-techs-enlisted-execs-will-do-in-the-army/

AcrossthePond55 · 21/06/2025 16:03

logicisall · 21/06/2025 13:41

For a country that's had 100 years to study where the Nazis went wrong, it's hard to believe many Americans actually learned anything.

That's the problem with living in a democracy. As those who experienced WWII pass away, the succeding generations take their freedom from oppression for granted and eventually forget the horrors of the past. My friends and I were discussing this recently. #Lest we forget.

I think also the fact that WWII didn't really touch US shores contributes to the shit show we're seeing today. There were deaths in far off places and there were small forays on the east and west coasts that came to naught. But by and large life went on as usual with small privations. US citizens weren't hiding in subways or shelters whilst bombs rained overhead, they weren't shipping their children off to unknown people in the countryside. What rationing there was was more of an annoyance than a deprivation. And what hardships there were stateside were borne with patriotic fervor.

Then when the 'boys (and girls) came home' not only did 'life as before' resume rapidly but it started a period of unprecedented plenty in the US. I think it taught my parents' generation and mine (Boomer that I am) that the US was pretty much impervious to the nebulous and unknown 'bad things' that happen in unknown and 'less good' places. That we would always be triumphant and a land of plenty. And so came the complacency and sense of superiority we see today.

Lord knows I was taught in the '60s & '70s that the US knew it all better, did it better, and was better than any other nation. And my sons were taught about the same in the '90s & '00s. Even the disasters of Viet Nam and Watergate didn't change the national psyche all that much. And many of today's conservatives were yesterday's hippies, mostly thanks to the greed of the 80s and Reagan.

What we are seeing now is absolutely 'Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind'. And we did it to ourselves. Now many of us who saw the cracks but took it for granted that we were protected by the Constitution and our system of checks and balances are finding ourselves trying to paddle a canoe upstream in a raging river.

I haven't given up hope and I still believe we can survive. But it's going to come at an unbelievable cost.

SerendipityJane · 21/06/2025 16:09

AcrossthePond55 · 21/06/2025 16:03

I think also the fact that WWII didn't really touch US shores contributes to the shit show we're seeing today. There were deaths in far off places and there were small forays on the east and west coasts that came to naught. But by and large life went on as usual with small privations. US citizens weren't hiding in subways or shelters whilst bombs rained overhead, they weren't shipping their children off to unknown people in the countryside. What rationing there was was more of an annoyance than a deprivation. And what hardships there were stateside were borne with patriotic fervor.

Then when the 'boys (and girls) came home' not only did 'life as before' resume rapidly but it started a period of unprecedented plenty in the US. I think it taught my parents' generation and mine (Boomer that I am) that the US was pretty much impervious to the nebulous and unknown 'bad things' that happen in unknown and 'less good' places. That we would always be triumphant and a land of plenty. And so came the complacency and sense of superiority we see today.

Lord knows I was taught in the '60s & '70s that the US knew it all better, did it better, and was better than any other nation. And my sons were taught about the same in the '90s & '00s. Even the disasters of Viet Nam and Watergate didn't change the national psyche all that much. And many of today's conservatives were yesterday's hippies, mostly thanks to the greed of the 80s and Reagan.

What we are seeing now is absolutely 'Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind'. And we did it to ourselves. Now many of us who saw the cracks but took it for granted that we were protected by the Constitution and our system of checks and balances are finding ourselves trying to paddle a canoe upstream in a raging river.

I haven't given up hope and I still believe we can survive. But it's going to come at an unbelievable cost.

The US and the UKs experience of WW2 differ from each other, but they also both differ from the rest of Europe and the Pacific.

The US never really had to face the Blitz. Just geography, but it means there's a slight disconnect with the UK.

Neither the UK nor the US were occupied - or even at any serious risk of occupied. Which means a conjoined disconnect with occupied Europe.

However the main difference is the US came out of WW2 in profit. So what's not to like ? Sure a few dead soldiers, but that's what they do isn't it ? May as well get rich from it. And that attitude does feel a tad inherited. I wonder where they got id from ?

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

SerendipityJane · 21/06/2025 16:56

Meanwhile, who wants to see a Tesla Robot dancing ?

Go on - you know you do.

I'm mildly disappointed we weren't treated to a pair dancing together.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/mh1CsIaFF3o

Before you continue to YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/mh1CsIaFF3o?feature=share

Spandauer · 21/06/2025 17:33

He's left the golf course.

From NYT just now.
Live Updates: U.S. Moves B-2 Bombers as Iran and Israel Exchange Strikes.
^^
President Trump was expected to meet with his National Security Council on Saturday evening to discuss whether to enter the conflict. Military assets are often positioned to provide the president and commanders options even if they are not ultimately deployed.

Several U.S. Air Force B-2 bombers appeared to have taken off from a base in the United States and were headed across the Pacific, as President Trump was set to return to the White House on Saturday afternoon to meet with his national security team on whether to join Israel’s attacks on Iranian nuclear sites.
Flight tracker data showed the B-2 aircraft, which can carry the 30,000-pound bunker-buster bombs Mr. Trump is considering deploying against Iran’s underground nuclear facilities in Fordo, taking off from Whiteman Air Force Base in Missouri.

OP posts:
SerendipityJane · 21/06/2025 18:08

Whiteman Air Force Base in Missouri.

If ever a name was apt ....

notimagain · 21/06/2025 18:24

For info Whiteman was a Pearl Harbor casualty...

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Allison_Whiteman

AcrossthePond55 · 21/06/2025 18:59

'Reports have it' that the planes are headed for Guam. Why Guam I have no idea other than that it's in the middle of nowhere and it'd be much harder to keep an eye on any preparations or monitor activity. They also have the ability to stop aircraft from being 'trackable' on websites so I guess any 'attacks' could be started in secrecy.

There's a base near us that has a refueling squadron that includes the Stratotanker but no 'scuttlebutt' about anything there being deployed.

AcrossthePond55 · 21/06/2025 19:04

For those of you interested in tracking, it's Andersen AFB in Guam.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andersen_Air_Force_Base

Andersen Air Force Base - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andersen_Air_Force_Base

YankTank · 21/06/2025 19:29

Serpentstooth · 21/06/2025 12:50

USA has 2028 Olympics? More 1930s parallels. Maybe Bigly Draft Dodger's birthday stroll is the model to pursue for the opening ceremony? Did you see him have the effrontery to salute the shambling troops. I'm not given to random violence but I could have happily slapped him. What an insult to the army. He's intolerable. Surely he can't last much longer?

This reallllly pisses me off as someone whose father was forced to serve in the Vietnam War (my grandfather didn’t have the connections to fake a bone spur diagnosis for my father), and as someone whose grandfather fought the Nazis. He should NOT be saluting. He was never in the armed forces. And he calls them suckers and losers.

notimagain · 21/06/2025 19:55

Why Guam I have no idea other than that it's in the middle of nowhere and it'd be much harder to keep an eye on any preparations or monitor activity.

(Speculation:)...Guam gives options and keeps uncertainty in play.

It's a good a place as any to hold the force if the plan ultimately is to plod on to Diego Garcia which is relatively close to Iran and somewhere where they really can go dark/be unobserved.

OTOH is somewhere relatively quick/easy to return from to the US if diplomacy works,.

OTOH is close enough to Iran for a direct strike if the politics falls apart rapidly, but more of a stretch than Diego Garcia

logicisall · 21/06/2025 20:08

@AcrossthePond55 The Guam news is disturbing, and true. Everything seems to be coming together for a major war expansion and warranted or not, the UK will be dragged into it.

It's been reported in The Telegraph
US B-2 stealth bombers have left America, heading towards Guam, as Donald Trump continues to mull striking Iran’s Fordow underground nuclear facility.
As many as four aircraft took off from the Whiteman Air Force base in Missouri on Saturday morning accompanied by four refuelling tankers, according to flight tracking data.
Two US officials confirmed that they are heading west towards the US Naval Base Guam in the Pacific Ocean. From there, they could head to the US base on Diego Garcia, in the Chagos Islands, which is within striking distance of Iran.

https://archive.ph/8QTOo

Serpentstooth · 21/06/2025 20:10

Just watching UTube about the Russian who's in charge of vetting the White House Staff. Hasn't been vetted himself because, er, hmm, why would that be? No wonder the quality of policy forming is so low; intelligence and knowledge not a requirement but an actual disadvantage. Trump has handed his country to Russia, no wonder you've got Spetznaz running around rounding up people they don't like the look of. Who'd have thought Stalin and Lenin would be spending their afterlife laughing at the President of the USA. Along with the rest of the world. At least Yeltsin had the excuse of being drunk.

logicisall · 21/06/2025 20:20

And article from The Times on the movement of B-2 stealth bombers
https://archive.ph/koqHK

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 21/06/2025 20:24

Serpentstooth · 21/06/2025 20:10

Just watching UTube about the Russian who's in charge of vetting the White House Staff. Hasn't been vetted himself because, er, hmm, why would that be? No wonder the quality of policy forming is so low; intelligence and knowledge not a requirement but an actual disadvantage. Trump has handed his country to Russia, no wonder you've got Spetznaz running around rounding up people they don't like the look of. Who'd have thought Stalin and Lenin would be spending their afterlife laughing at the President of the USA. Along with the rest of the world. At least Yeltsin had the excuse of being drunk.

There are a lot of Russian internet accounts that same person seems to have had. Were they mentioned upthread, or did I come across them somewhere else?

logicisall · 21/06/2025 20:30

I mentioned it upthread. It's dodgy AF.

PerkingFaintly · 21/06/2025 20:33

I linked upthread to the material from Brian Krebs re all those internet accounts.

NB I've only read the Kos's reporting on this, taken supposedly from a posting on Krebs' LinkedIn account.

I have no idea if Krebs usually breaks stuff on his LinkedIn account! He has a blog on security stuff so if this really is his I'd expect to see something on there.

https://krebsonsecurity.com/

Currently the most recent entry on the blog is something different but also very interesting:

Inside a Dark Adtech Empire Fed by Fake CAPTCHAs
June 12, 2025
Late last year, security researchers made a startling discovery: Kremlin-backed disinformation campaigns were bypassing moderation on social media platforms by leveraging the same malicious advertising technology that powers a sprawling ecosystem of online hucksters and website hackers. A new report on the fallout from that investigation finds this dark ad tech industry is far more resilient and incestuous than previously known. [

Krebs on Security – In-depth security news and investigation

https://krebsonsecurity.com

TokyoSushi · 21/06/2025 22:08

Hello! I’ve been out all day, what’s going on? Bombers are heading to Guam and Don has left the golf course for the WH?

Sounds like things might be shaping up?

TokyoSushi · 21/06/2025 22:10

Just looked up Guam on Google maps, for about the hundredth time over the years, is that a bit of a strange location to move the bombers to? It’s a long way from, well, anywhere?

Serpentstooth · 21/06/2025 22:37

LBC news says Israel has told Bigly it won't wait 2 weeks for him to make his mind up about Iran. So now he's got to find a way to mollify Netanyahu (and hang on to the) Gaza development he's believes will be his reward ) without bombing Iran. Not betting on that. QTime to head for the bunkers.

Spandauer · 21/06/2025 22:49

The UK’s Attorney General Lord Hermer has advised that allowing the US to use Diego Garcia as a base for any bombing campaign would be a potential breach of international law because it goes beyond the self-defence definition under Article 51 of the UN charter. (Times)
https://bsky.app/profile/chadbourn.bsky.social/post/3ls53dg7sik2n

From same Bluesky account/ journalist:
...it now seems that Vance is pushing back on the US joining the Israel-Iran war. Seems to be a split forming in the White House.

edit to add:
“The bombers apparently refueled after launching from Missouri, suggesting they launched without full fuel tanks due to a heavy onboard payload, which could be bunker-buster bombs,” Fox reports.

Bluesky

https://bsky.app/profile/chadbourn.bsky.social/post/3ls53dg7sik2n

OP posts:
AcrossthePond55 · 22/06/2025 01:25

CNN flash on my laptop. We've bombed (edit) nuclear sites in Iran.

Looking for article now.

Edit:
https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/israel-iran-conflict-06-21-25-intl-hnk

He plans to address the nation at 10pm EDT. No chance I'm going to watch that.

cryptide · 22/06/2025 02:44

I wonde how much MAGA will continue to support Trump if he gets on to conscription, or if there's retaliation within the US.. Much as they love talking up how tough they are, they're not actually that keen on putting themselves in the firing line and getting hurt.

logicisall · 22/06/2025 04:03

Seeing that Houthis in Yemen have said that they will attack shipping, things are definitely up. DC in Iran adjacent country said that flights were cancelled yesterday.

logicisall · 22/06/2025 04:09

There's a hunt on in the UK for the person who leaked the info Attorney General Lord Hermer gave to the gov't re the illegality of assisting US in Diego Garcia. Starmer is probably wishing he could turn back time and completed offloading Chagos completely last month!

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