What on earth is it like to live in New Zealand

[ApplesandOat]

Honestly been looking at videos etc on YouTube about New Zealand but I've decided to go on here and ask people who might have actually spent some time there.

Tell me all about it!

Unless you are very "outdoorsy" hiker/cyclist or other sports mad, then it can feel boring. There isn't a lot to do. Summer is lovely going to the beach at the weekend etc.. Winter is cold!! Houses mostly not built for winter, it's like NZ is in denial about the weather.

I lived there for just over a year, perhaps you might not enough to judge, but it was long enough for me. On the positive side wages tend to be better, tax is less, although food and goods are expensive. Oh and not much choice in the shops either (for anything including food). Beautiful Country though, I would definitely recommend for a holiday.

As an ethnic minority kiwi, I can confirm that GraduationDay is 100% correct. I've never been confronted with such racism anywhere else in the world.

New Zealand may be paradise, but not if you're brown.

A old friend now lives in NZ and she says it’s very dull and hard to get a decent conversation, it’s all very pragmatic and sporty. I don’t know how true this actually is.

You called me a prat because you, correctly or incorrectly, perceived me as a ‘foreigner’ (whatever that means to you) and from then on I wasn’t allowed to have any other opinion about NZ and NZers than a gushing, grateful, positive one. The dominant cultural narrative for pakeha in NZ is that we are Anglo Saxon and we still have a deep affinity with those origins - of course we do - we’re still a Commonwealth country. It’s in so much of how we see ourselves as a country. And my perception is, rightly or wrongly, that immigrants from the UK are regarded more warmly and ascribed more automatic status than immigrants from, for example, continental Europe or Asia. Maybe your perception is different but that’s no reason to immediately call me a prat or assume I’m a foreigner who just doesn’t know anything. There is nothing racist or xenophobic about anything I’ve said, at least definitely not intentionally. I just know from intimate experience in the field of negotiating cultural difference, that local people often find it extremely difficult to truly accept those they perceive as ‘outsiders’ into their fold. That’s very evident in many parts of NZ though of course there are exceptions and you may be one. I applaud you if you are. Immigration is just a tough game, extremely hard on children, and people who consider it should be prepared for that. As long as they are, please, give it a go. I have nothing against it and NZ is only richer for it.

You called me a prat because you, correctly or incorrectly, perceived me as a ‘foreigner’ (whatever that means to you) and from then on I wasn’t allowed to have any other opinion about NZ and NZers than a gushing, grateful, positive one.

No, I called you a prat for the reason I stated, which is why I’m still arguing with you, rather than hurriedly retracting it because you’re not a “foreigner”.

I really disagree that Pakeha New Zealanders still see themselves as Anglo-Saxons; maybe Boomers/retirees but from Gen X down I think people are deeply disassociated from those “origins” and don’t heavily identify with the UK at all.

Many people I know have never been there and have no intention of going (I’ve been to continental Europe and Asia many times but never bothered with the UK).

Shared language fluency is far more of a factor in ease and depth of integration rather than whether someone has an “accent” or a “tan”, which is common to many countries, not just New Zealand.

I really think you are more the exception than the norm, and know so many people who would be horrified by your characterisation of what New Zealanders supposedly think.

Respectfully, I don’t think you will ever really know what those people who you regard as foreign who you graciously invite to your parties actually really think about NZ and NZers. Because you are one, and they will be far too kind, grateful and polite (and maybe a little bit afraid) to tell you the bad and the ugly bits that they have experienced as immigrants in NZ. Something about the defensive tone you immediately took with me tells me that’s the case. Immigrants learn very quickly to self censor. Trust me on that. But if you really want to connect, I’d advise you to be more open to the bad and the ugly, as well as the good.

I am not from NZ nor UK but have lived in both countries for more than 10 years each. For me personally the good things about NZ are:

Sunshine, beautiful rich blue sky, yes it can rain often in Auckland but it comes and goes quickly, you still have so much more sunshine and nice temprature than UK, and a long warm summer

Amazing wildlife, I used to wake up with tuis singing outside my windows, I have spotted colour parrots coming and going in my garden

Easy to grow your own vegies, they just thrive without much attention needed due to the climate

Clean environment, I hardly needed to wash my car

friendly people, people are laid back, the gap between the rich and poor is much smaller than UK

Amazing beaches, landscapes you can access a lot of stunning places in such a small country, campimg is also very safe

Better health care system than UK in my opinion, never had to wait long to access health care

Lower taxes, from memory 33% for high earners

Student loans and living allowancea were offered at 0% interest rate for life if living in NZ, not sure if its still the case now but at least it was when I was there

House buying process is so so so much more efficient than UK

Paid sick days, I had 10 paid sick days a year plus annual leave when I worked there

Great vineyards and NZ wines but European wines are expensive and not many choices

What not so good are

Food are expensive and lack of choices, specially European food products

If you love shopping its bot a great country, lots of brands arent available

People can be narrow mineded, specially the ones who have never been out of NZ

A lot of national pride, you see the word "proudly" everywhere, too much for me

No proper lunch for school kids, everyone brings a packed lunch and often eat outside sitting on the ground

too isolated, far from anywhere, even to Australia is still a good 3 hour flight

Respectfully, I don’t think you will ever really know what those people who you regard as foreign who you graciously invite to your parties actually really think about NZ and NZers

Your condescending assumption that my relationship with my “foreign” friends (and I say that in inverted commas as I actually see them as New Zealanders just like me, no matter where they started from) extends only as far as “graciously” inviting them to parties says it all, really.

Our friendships are real ones, parties, yes but also long chats over coffee or dinner, helping each other out with kids, walks and trips to the beach, holidays away, fundraising events at school together, meeting extended family who are visiting, etc etc etc.

Despite what you think, I do know things they don’t like or struggle with about New Zealand; I don’t think it’s a perfect country and neither do they but your characterization of it as wholly closed and suspicious is wildly off. Please don’t presume to lecture me about what my friends of many years’ standing “really” think.

@pukekokekup 's personal observations of what is good and not so good about NZ seems pretty fair to me.

I can't say whether NZ is like stepping back into the fifties is true, because I wasn't alive in the fifties. I suspect quite a few of the people that say this weren't, either. It's a standing joke in our family (currently emigrated to the UK, about how the first time DH and I did come to the UK to live (1999), within two days I'd been very patronisingly told how of course, the UK was a very advanced nation. Not on the basis of it's bloody plumbing, banking, property transactions, and women's rights, it wasn't!

I once asked a notably upfront and outspoken young Chinese woman who worked with DH how she found NZ. She gave it to me both bloody barrels, and good on her for doing so. She'd been spat at, shoved, shouted at from cars to go back to where she came from. I was so fucking angry on her behalf. Even more so, because that just reinforced what I'd been told by my Korean friend - and another ethnic Chinese/New Zealand for 7 generations friend. It sickens me that people are treated this way because of their skin colour/perceived ethnicity in NZ. This is not who we tell ourselves that we are.

On the other hand I don't think we particularly identify with the UK any longer, or particularly welcome Brits. In fact, I know a lot of Brits back home who feel we should be a lot more welcoming because they come from the UK. Yeah, nah. I think that as adults it's always harder to make friends in a new country. They have their lives, families and friend groups sorted out, and it can be hard to find an 'in'. That's natural and understandable, whether you're going from the UK to NZ, or NZ to the UK. You're not 'owed' friendship and socialisation, you have to work at it, when you emigrate.

It tends to be easier if you're sporty, because it creates a natural 'in' for socialising and creating friendships. Also, NZ'ers tend to do more of their socialising at home, rather than the pub, or restaurants, in contrast, perhaps, to the UK, and I think that might be a space thing. It does mean however, that you've got to have got to a friendship point or a situation whereby you will comfortably invite someone around to your home and your family.

I have lived half my life in NZ & half in England.

You can buy all the plastic China has ever manufactured very cheaply in NZ - its drowning in the stuff.

Houses are cold & mostly without central heating. You are more likely to live in a timber framed & clad house than a brick house. I had a flatmate from Edmonton Alberta where it reaches 40C below & she couldnt get over how cold sub tropical Auckland was.

NZ is very beautiful.

People tend to be bored and this leads to much drug abuse, heavy drinking & alcholism. Not sure if more than other countries - but it feels widespread & normal.

Prostitution is legal and its very common for men to stop for paid sex on the way home from work.

There is a big violent & hugely misogynistic gang culture. The gangs are also linked to widespread "P" abuse. "P" is what NZer's call methamphetamine. Methamphetamine abuse is widespread and has many negative knock on effects. You will see really high out of it people on the street. Its not at all uncommon.
https://www.parliament.nz/media/7832/methamphetamine_in_new-zealand_-a_snapshot_of_recent_trends.pdf

Although according to this sympathetic write up on NZ gangs "many have now outlawed gang rape" - yay! https://teara.govt.nz/en/gangs

NZ proudly describes itself as a class free country - this is bullshit. Ecomonic classes are very clearly noticable & meaningful.

Its woke as fuck but in a blind leading the blind, sheeplike "don't ask questions" way, rather than a way that might make actual improvements for people. NZ looks to Canada for modelling & guidance in this respect.

In contrast to the wokery, NZ is also brutally and unapologetically macho. Surprising perhaps considering over 50% of NZ's MP's are women and it has had several female PM's and Governor Generals. None of these women have ever done anything for womens rights, or to improve anything for NZ women. Maori women still have the worst health outcomes of any group - this was the case when I was born in the 60's and is still the case now.

They have a 2 tier justice system - if you are from a certain group and commit a crime you will have "cultural consideration" factored into your sentencing. So for example when a Maori baby is murdered (this is sadly a widespread current issue and Maori babies are disproportionaly killed by their adults/parents/careers (usually male)) the PERPETRATOR will get "cultural consideration" due to "colonisation" and a lessor sentance. The baby victim is not given the same courtesty or consideration.
https://www.equaljusticeproject.co.nz/articles/here-to-stay-the-role-of-cultural-reports-in-sentencing2021

https://teara.govt.nz/en/graph/29237/child-homicide-rates-for-maori-and-non-maori

Internal politics are becoming increasingly volitile (along race lines mainly) and this is likely to get worse over the next few decades.

There is no meaningful Fourth Estate in NZ.

Food is great. NZ is very pretty.

NZ is very expensive & housing issues/high prices etc are on a par with UK.

Before buying a house check when it was built and if it could be affected by "leaky building" syndrome. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaky_homes_crisis

"I once asked a notably upfront and outspoken young Chinese woman who worked with DH how she found NZ. She gave it to me both bloody barrels, and good on her for doing so. She'd been spat at, shoved, shouted at from cars to go back to where she came from. I was so fucking angry on her behalf. Even more so, because that just reinforced what I'd been told by my Korean friend - and another ethnic Chinese/New Zealand for 7 generations friend. It sickens me that people are treated this way because of their skin colour/perceived ethnicity in NZ. This is not who we tell ourselves that we are."

NZ does have a large Asian population - or at least Auckland does.

Racism in NZ seems to operate on a "when did you arrive" heirachy.

Maori were treated badly by colonisers.
In the 70's there was a lot of immigration from South Pacific Island nations (many of whom have NZ passports), and then everyone (including the Maori) hated on them. (BTW Auckland is the largest polynesian city in the world.)
The Polynesians got some slack when Asian migration increased in recent years - India,China, Hong Kong arrivals. Everyone - including Pakeha, Maori, Polynesians - started hating on the Asians.

Its a very clear trend of everyones focus going to the most recent immigrants.

While the scenarios posted above 100% does/can/will happen, in many ways people get on really well. Your workplace is likely to be culturally diverse, you will meet people from many different ethnicities. And that can be a really postive and enjoyable aspect of life in NZ. Mind you, I'm neither Korean or Chinese.

I spent a year in New Zealand during the noughties. In my experience, the people were lovely and friendly, but it was difficult to get past a superficial level of friendliness. I never got the impression that they didn't like me or looked down on me. It was more that they all seemed to settle down very close to where they had grown up, so they already had all their siblings/cousins/school friends living round the corner and they didn't really "need" new friends.

I wasn't aware of much crime when I was there, but I see on Facebook that my NZ friends often complain about crime now, particularly ram raids and home invasions.

Quickly off the top of my head .......

My Mums car was stolen 2 years ago and used in a ram raid on a bottle store.

My best friend in NZ had the guy working in her local corner store down the road from her house, tragically murdered by teenage robbers looking to steal cigarattes. They got very little cash, just smokes. and a few years in jail.

Both my brother and sister have been robbed at gunpoint - my sister held up and robbed by someone weilding an AK47, and my brother was working in a petrol station and was held up by someone with a handgun.

I have been at a friends house, chatting on the sofa, when 5 huge gang members walked in, helped themself to a bunch of stuff and left with the stereo etc. We were simply thankful & relieved not to be physically harmed.

Almost everyone I know has been burgled at one point. Before I left aged 26 I had been burgled 3 times.

These people don't live in "bad" neighbourhoods - respectable working class areas.

@TheSeaOfTranquility re "difficult to get past a superficial level of friendliness" maybe that is an immigration thing. I have experienced this in UK too.

Is it always windy???

some parts are. It's an island surrounded by massive oceans - a bit like Britain but without Europe land mass on one side.

NZ does have the best apples in the world though - got to give them that.

Where the hell in NZ do you live? Christ it’s nothing like the NZ I know.
AK47??? Yeah. This is not a common event in NZ.
it’s true there is a higher rate of petty crime there. But far fewer violent crimes committed outside of the circles of the perpetrators.

every event is a big event and on the news whereas in the UK you hear only about select crimes.

But you don’t have to believe me. The stats are online. It’s one of the safest countries in the world.

the AK47 armed robbery was in central Auckland. The guy turned up to a fancy dress function dressed as Rambo - but he had a real gun. Robbed everyone.
Garage robbery was in Waikato.
I lived mostly in Auckland - burgled in 3 different houses in central Auckland.

I am very sceptical about NZ having a low crime rate. My experience of crime in NZ is far from "low". Much more crime than I have ever experienced in UK.

Gangs are much more visible in NZ. I've never seen a motorcycle gang in UK.

See stuff I've heard online is that the biker gangs just target each other? And leave the general public alone?

this is true to a certain extent. Though I did have a personal encounter with them.

but they are hugely wealthy organised crime organisations that the police tend to steer clear of & leave alone. So they get to do what they want.

They manufacture and control most of the illegal drugs including methamphatamine that is devestating to those who take it & involves criminal action at many levels.

So the effects of their actions are felt by many.

My friend works at a wedding venue - gang hired it "undercover" - the hosts thought it was a normal 40th. It was carnage. Carnage not reported here.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/large-police-presence-monitoring-tribesmen-gangs-40th-anniversary-celebrations-at-kumeu-vineyard/Z7N5TXGF3ZGQFC27OHAZPHDWBA/

Why don't the police just arrest them?

quite

I value stats and reports by organisations that specifically monitor and measure these things and who have no skin in the game over some random person who goes by their ‘feels’ on the matter.

No. The only place that gets exceptionally windy sometimes is Wellington. It's nickname is Windy Welly. But the rest of the country.. no.

Their houses are bloody freezing. Sitting there in Auckland in our ski gear at a friend's house, frosted breath, freezing. 6 days we stayed and I was utterly miserable. Why the heck don't they heat their houses?

Come to Swansea. Every sunny Sunday they'll be out down Mumbles seafront digging in to their ice cream cones.

British motorcycle gangs exist, they're just really not scary.