Our education system is an utter shit show

[Noonelikesasloppytrifle]

I don't think people outside of education realise what an utter mess our education system is in and how bad it actually is.

I have 4 DC with one still in primary and the rest at secondary or 6th form. I have worked in various educational settings and have been a Governor. I am currently working in a large secondary ( 1500 students) in a pastoral role having moved from another area of the public sector which is also in a mess. My DC all attended state primaries. Two of them are now privately educated with the other 2 attending state grammars and one moving to a sixth form college.

I have been really shocked by how bad it is in the school I work at. It has clearly been managed badly for a number of years (former head went on long-term sick, followed by maternity, followed by sick leave) so they were rudderless for a while. They have just joined a MAT who all want the same behaviour policies with a blanket discipline regime and no regard to the individual needs of the kids. There are a mix of behavioural problems but they are all lumped together so those kids who have SEMH issues are punished for not attending lessons when the classroom environment is so toxic for them that they can't cope. There is no resource for it to be dealt with in any other way.

The curriculum and assessment schedule has completely disenfranchised a whole raft of kids. At the start of year seven they're already aware that scraping a 4 in most subjects would be their best outcome but they're forced to sit in classes where the only attainment measure is an exam at the end and we wonder why we see so many challenging behaviours in lessons. There are barely any TA's so often 30 students with one teacher and some very difficult kids to deal with.

This week at my school they had so many staff off sick that for three days we had 5 classes put together in the main hall. It was either that or close the school.

The staff all appear to dislike each other. Teachers don't like SLT or pastoral but also exhibit a sense of entitlement. It's certainly not an "we're all in it together" type of attitude.

School are expected to solve all the ills of society. On a daily basis we're dealing with the impact of poor parenting, lack of boundaries, the poor diet and social media etc etc. There is so little resource to deal with this properly

I know that not all schools are like this. My 16 yr old DC (at Grammar) does not report the same issues at their school that I do at mine. However, I do know that our other nearest secondary is experiencing the same thing as us and they have a similar demographic (rural county).

I feel so sad for the kids coming out of this system, particularly those without the network around them to provide support and direction.

I think a lot of us could manage okay if the would just do the GCSEs the way the ABRSM does grade 5 music theory exams. The ABRSM switched to fully online theory exams during the covid lockdowns and it's made things much simpler. It means that kids can now sit their theory exam from home, invigilated by webcam.

If Pearson could do GCSE exams the same way, it would really simplify things enormously. Espcially now, when the schools are really struggling, kids are falling out of the system right and left, and there is likely to be a slow start before a new government can do anything about it.

Sorry but you are wrong. A bright child will not do well in any school. They need support to learn and thrive. My son (gifted in maths) had a breakdown because the school refused to provide academic challenge. It was the worst 3 years of my life watching him spiral downwards to the breakdown.

It needs to be acknowledged that not all children are academic. Some will never achieve maths/English gcse but they could be great at vocational jobs which require different skills.

Against School, by John Taylor Gatto (mcgill.ca)

[[//Weapons of Mass Instruction [By: Gatto, John Taylor] [January, 2010]: Amazon.co.uk: Gatto, John Taylor: Books]]

Dumbing Us Down: The Hidden Curriculum of Compulsory Schooling by John Taylor Gatto | Goodreads

Educating Your Child in Modern Times: How to Raise an Intelligent, Sovereign & Ethical Human Being by John Taylor Gatto | Goodreads

What scares me is all these failed children with poor education experiences will be in the workforce over the next decade.

DP is a secondary teacher desperate to get out of education because the system is screwed, some of the kids can be utterly horrific and the parents are often worse. It’s a thankless career that appears to be just getting worse each year.

The schools don't have the flexibility they used to. It's all about progress 8 and Ebacc.

I've said this before, progress 8 leans heavily towards science, you can take 3 or 4 science GCSEs but most schools only have time table space for one art subject.

I do not see the point of putting a student through 8 GCSEs that they will come out with grades 1-3.

It would be better for them to take 4 or 5 and have more teaching time.

At the more academic end of the scale many schools used to have an 'express stream' allowing children to take their GCSEs a year early and studying A Levels over 3 years. Now if a school put a child in early for a GCSE or two then they don't appear in the league tables. That's why children sitting additional maths do that GCSE first and maths at the usual time.

And vocational qualifications need to be back on the timetable.

I think there should be a national distance learning school. Something similar to the OU where you can pick subjects to study.

It would be useful for home schoolers who want access to academic exams. Children who want to take a subject their school doesn't do could also use it,

@sashh thanks so much for posting this. It clarifies such a lot for me. It makes total sense to me to sit the GCSEs over two different years, if only to take the pressure off the final months, and now I understand why they don't do it.

I 100% agree about having a national distance learning school. I think we are very close to that already because so many kids have left state schooling and are learning remotely through private providers.

https://kingsinterhigh.co.uk/ and https://wolseyhalloxford.org.uk/ seem to be the leading lights in this area but there are huge numbers of other providers.

At the moment the missing piece in the puzzle is exam access. People have to traipse long distances and jump through complex expensive hoops to get access to exams. It would be much easier if exam providers could switch to the same model as the ABRSM use for their Grade 5 online theory exams, with webcam invigilation, done from home.

Here is an explanation of progress 8 for other readers like me who did not know.

Yes, funding for education under the Tories has been deliberately bad.

But why complain about it here? MN thinks ‘knowing what a woman is’ is more important than education for children.

Dh works for a local authority in children’s services.

Crisis meetings recently about the school in the LA, how bad they are, the awful things that are happening.

Same meeting, the EHE team taking on a new model to make home education such a ballache and so difficult to do that parents will be deterred from doing it - obviously, I am paraphrasing that, but they state that they want to deter parents from home education at all costs.

So they know the schools are terrible. But they don’t want people to home Ed.

We home educate for what it’s worth. Dh kept his mouth shut, the EHE team were vitriolic about home educating parents.

I do not understand the need for all the GCSEs.

I went to one of the top state grammar schools in the country in the mid 90s. We did maths, English, the three sciences, a humanity, a language and R.E (religious school). That was it.

My son a few years ago did all sorts of bollocks on top, it was too much. When he went to college and then onto degree apprenticeship , all anyone cared about was if he passed maths and English.

Wait until they get to secondary! Currently in this country we tend to do primary better than secondary and there isn't the same level of staffing crisis in primary, yet.
It isn't true that a bright child will do well anywhere, they need support, resources, well staffed and safe environments as much as the less bright kids. They may do OK in poorer schools but they probably won't reach their full potential. If your child is GCSE year but has had 2 years of constant supply teachers for maths rather than 1 consistent subject speciallst then obviously this is going to impact them.

I know, no one needs more than 5 GCSEs. That doesn't mean they can't do more if they want and are able but we are turning children off education.

And there is nothing wrong with vocational qualifications.

Take Jamie Oliver - not everyone likes him but there is no doubt he is a success. I think he left school with 1 or 2 GCSEs.

Surel someone like him would have benefitted doing some form of cookery course?

Thanks for saying about this. I'm a bit stunned to hear that tbh.

The sad thing about your comment is that both of these things are important.

Women’s rights and children’s rights should be equally protected. It’s a crime that we as women are trying to protect ourselves and our children so much in 2024. I’m not sure MN is more one or the other?

It’s country wide. LAs are under instruction to make home educating as difficult as possible.

They know they have no powers to enter homes so they are doing it under the guise of safeguarding. ETA - sorry, not doing it, they can’t, by law. But they apply so much pressure , find any reason to involve social care and any reason to pick fault with home Ed provision so they can force school.

Yet, in the meetings that dh attends, it’s all talk of pupils being harmed by teachers and more frequently, each other. Some serious shit goes on in schools which is well hidden.

But no, demonise the home educators, easier target.

Dh finds a lot of the wording and attitudes really concerning. We haven’t been contacted about our youngest yet and she’s not of compulsory school age anyway, but dh finds it laughable that he would go into work everyday, hear the horrendous things that go on in schools in our LA and then be expected to choose that over our plans to home Ed put youngest.

Education and the Death of Love by Roy Stephens was published in 1978. It is an extraordinary book.

This is really interesting @Chunkycookie because since my son had to stop going to school with EBSA we've been under pressure to EHE. Even from the council attendance officer. Fortunately we are having an EHCP assessment now.

Oh believe me, in those situations, sometimes the LA just want you to take all the responsibility so they don’t have to do anything. Far cheaper for them.

That’s the area I have just finished working in as I couldn’t stand it. Children are let down left, right and centre.

But departments don’t communicate with each other. on one hand, colleagues would sometimes push home Ed, then when they did, the home Ed team would be arses, basically.

Thanks, yes, that really explains a lot. When I go to meetings, I feel as though the professionals all come from different planets and they all seem to be under massive pressure from some unseen force behind them. Nobody seems to be able to break free of the unseen forces to think about the welfare of the child. It's really odd looking in from outside, as I am doing just now.

I completely agree schools should be for education. SEN needs obviously should be met.
But surely can parents not be taught how to be parents? This is basically in relation to toileting, having children prepared to learn, behaviour issues.
And let teachers do their job as academic educators?

Parents were being taught via the Sure Start scheme. This government killed it off, being entirely unable to think long term or understand the word "prevention.".

The force is always money. Spend as little as possible. So many LAs are going bust, more to come. Turnover of staff is alway huge too. No one knows what anyone else is doing, data systems don’t work properly. Dh and I have spent two decades each working for various LAs, they are all a shambles.