Universal Credit- turning 18?

[Lifeoflove]

My Daughter turns 18 soon and in her last year of college (leaves June 24). She has mental health issues, so currently received standard care PIP. Her struggles mean she is unable to get a job. I currently get UC and CB but realise that I will lose CB as soon as she finishes college. What will happen to UC as she is then an adult? But not earning and will not be able to. Worried as will also lose the 25% discount on CT also. Has anyone been through this? Where can I get further information?
thank you ☺️

Severe mental impairment does not exclude an individual from voting as long as they can make their own choice. DD1 is certified with SMI but is still able to vote if she wants to.

'College' can be everything from life skills courses to A levels. DD1 goes to college. She has transport with an escort, 1:1 support in class, and 2:1 support on trips (even walking to the local library).

I think in the medium term some volunteer work would be good for her morale. There is no point expecting somebody to hold down a job if they are too impaired.

For example a friend of mine is on benefits but still leads quite a happy life as he works one small day at a charity shop and another small day at the local furniture store related to the said charity shop.

Not everybody is cut out for a job but they still have a place in the world and still have something to give.

No, but the point of the exemption is to do with no taxation without representation i.e. if you are too impaired to vote, you don't pay council tax. As a GP, that's the sort of threshold we look at to sign these forms.

I think you need to look again at your criteria and who told you to apply that reasoning to issue SMI certificates.

https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/running-electoral-registration-england/eligibility-register-vote/how-does-mental-capacity-affect-right-register-vote

"A lack of mental capacity is not a legal incapacity to vote.1 Persons who meet the other registration qualifications are eligible for registration regardless of their mental capacity.

Voting rights
While electors with any level or no level of mental capacity may be registered to vote, the decision as to whether and how to vote at an election must be made by the elector themselves and not by any other person on their behalf. Those who care for or who otherwise make decisions on behalf of a person may not make decisions on voting."

People can be severely mentally impaired and still retain the ability to vote. It shouldn't be used as a criteria for deciding whether to issue SMI certificates.

Yes but there are absolutely no criteria given against which doctors should judge the council tax exemption, so most use the ability to do things like vote, drive, care for oneself etc.

You might want to take a look at Department Of Health March 1993 PL/CO(93)1 Local Government Finance Act 1992: Council Tax Discount For People with Severe Mental Impairment

1. In making a judgement on whether someone is severely mentally impaired it may be helpful for doctors to know the reason for discount from the council tax. The aim of the council tax is to give taxpayers a direct stake in the spending decisions of local authorities. Clearly this kind of accountability is much less successful in the case of someone who is severely mentally impaired to the extent that he or she does not have an understanding of local issues.

1. Doctors may wish to be aware that being classified as severely mentally impaired for the purpose of the Local Government Finance Act 1992 does not affect the right to vote or to be included in the electoral register which is compiled separately and with different qualifying criteria.

There you go. Depression not likely to be included qnd signing tjese only for dementia etc is about right

It’s tough when they leave education even without other issues. It can take time for them to get full time work and in the mean time the parent loses all financial support but often still needs to provide support and run the household.

My daughter also finishes college this year and isn’t keen to do another year. I’ve made it clear she has to make the shortfall up from wages/UC because she will be financially independent at that point. The money I get from UC will drop quite a bit which is going to be tough. I already work full time but I’m a single parent so only one wage supporting everyone.

I just wanted to wish you luck, and say I was in a similar position to your daughter at her age. I left 6 form with good grades, went to uni but really struggled to the point I had to move back home, was in hospital etc, I managed to finish my degree but with lots of support. I did get a job, I worked for local government and worked my way up, they were very accommodating of my mental health issues. I worked until I had my son 8 years ago, then I became very poorly and had to stop for a while, I went back when he was 2-6 then had to give up as he had his own issues and I was being called down to the school every day! I receive pip high rates for both, have a Cpn and can go into hospital if I become unwell. I am looking at getting a part time job now son is in specialist school. Admin based, not frontline public facing. Even though some days it is really hard, work has been amazing for me and given me purpose, I feel like I contribute to our household and although I needed to be off work when I needed to be, I got a lot of support from all of the organisations I have worked in. Larger companies tend to have occupational health departments who are really helpful. Hope all goes ok.

I agree that depression on its own is not likely to be included. But there are all sorts of conditions that might qualify.

My DM has Bipolar disorder and depression. She is now severely mentally impaired (in my view) following a psychiatric inpatient stay 7 years ago. She can't be left alone at home, requires support with all ADLs, can't leave the house on her own. 'Depression' has many presentations. We haven't needed to get a SMI certificate because she's a pensioner now. She is able to vote.

My DD is certified SMI. On paper she has ASD, Moderate Learning Disability, and a brain malformation. Although she only has Moderate Learning Disability, the combination of her conditions makes her severely disabled. She can't be left alone, can't leave the house unattended, etc. She is able to vote, although her choice is unlikely to be informed.

Let's face it, though, most people just shove a cross in a box and have no idea who they are voting for.

I'd strongly encourage her to do something and not just go on a benefit. My neice did this at 18 (suffered from "anxiety" so her parents didn't push her. She's about to turn 23 and had so much potential, but now has zero prospects and all she does is sit at home all day.

Yes I agree but paid work may feel pressuring and volunteer work would definitely be good for the morale and give her experience confidence and a purpose.

I too know somebody whose daughter sits at home all day and is on Pip. Genuine mental health grounds. Such a terrible waste and only about 30.I

On a much more positive note somebody else's daughter who is 20 with mental health issues is really coming on leaps and bounds now and her moods are much more stable. A while back her plight seemed really bleak.

Just goes to show there can be hope and a future.

Because college has a lot of support in place which an employer wouldn’t.

Thete also isn’t enough provision and support for volunteering. There’s some great options but a bit of a post code lottery.

Not necessarily. You have to teach kids coping mechanisms. It’s no good getting stuck into this ‘depression bubble’ at such a young age. Is it depression or is it a lack of coping mechanisms with kids these days? Perhaps a Saturday job would help, somewhere simple to start with. Showing the rewards of pay for work and building confidence, friendships and a life for themselves.

The poor thing. I understand why you would be protective given her MH struggles.

Good idea for her to stay on at college- she's probably not ready for the job market from the sounds of it.

There's a good chance that as she matures and gets more MH help, she will be able to work. This would be ideal, even if part time. Working can really be a confidence boost and staying busy can help reduce anxiety levels. The last thing you want is for her to go straight on benefits with no plan on how she's going to tackle the work situation. This won't do much for her self-esteem and every day the prospect of working will seem more impossible.

Separate to the benefits issue, for which DD, or her appointee if she has one, should apply for UC when she is no longer an eligible young person for your UC claim/CB ends, does DD have an EHCP? If so, EHCPs can continue until 25, or 26 in some cases. DD can remain in college or other education. It doesn’t have to be what is typically seen as education. If not, you should request an EHCNA.

qnd signing tjese only for dementia etc is about right

No, it’s not. There’s more than dementia that can be classed as SMI.

Dementia, severe LD, severe delusional disorders, bipolar etc.

Generally speaking not depression/anxiety unless at such a severe level that is requiring admission, section etc.

So not just dementia etc. then. A LD doesn’t have to be severe to be classed as SMI either. As @Lougle posted, some with MLD will also be classed as SMI.

I get council tax exemption for my mental health condition. Not depression anxiety or bipolar though

The only reason I'm making this point so strongly is that the very people with SMI are those that will find it very hard to advocate for themselves if their doctor doesn't recognise their status as having SMI. Many GPs don't know much about it. I was initially told that I had to pay for a doctor's report (not true), that I had to send a copy of DD1's short summary of care to the council (not true), etc.

I am sympathetic to doctors because they aren't given comprehensive guidance and they are putting their name against a permanent certificate. However, it's really important that doctors understand that very, very few people are legally prevented from voting, so this shouldn't be used as a criteria to judge SMI.

DD1 is 18 now and specialists still argue over how to describe her brain malformation. They also can't decide whether her presentation is due to her LDs, her ASD, her brain malformation or all 3. She has Moderate Learning Disability, officially, because she can read to an extent and can write some words, can walk and talk. However, she presents as severe in that she can't manage any ADLs independently because she lacks executive function. She's very complex.

Absolutely, and we are sympathetic in those cases.

But you wouldn't believe how many people with the mildest of depression and anxiety get pretty cross when we refuse to sign their council tax forms................

But that obviously doesn’t apply to the OP. Someone “with the mildest of depression and anxiety“ doesn’t get PIP, doesn’t remain under CAMHS (they wouldn’t even get a referral accepted most of the time), and given the pressure on the SEN system is unlikely to get a lot of support at college.

That must be frustrating. I'll admit I only knew it was a thing because @Headfirstintothewild told me about it a few months ago.

Perhaps patients are reading it as 'severe impairment of intelligence or social functioning' rather than 'severe impairment of intelligence and social functioning'?

I notice that Turn2Us have incorrectly stated it as 'or'.https://www.turn2us.org.uk/get-support/information-for-your-situation/council-tax-discounts/people-with-disabilities#:~:text=Severe%20mental%20impairment%20means%20a,you%20are%20severely%20mentally%20impaired.

It might be that your patients are thinking 'I can't function socially the way I used to and feel terrible... Perhaps I qualify.'