Page 2 | Has anyone seen Saltburn? (warning - spoilers!)

thelostfreak · 2023-12-29T12:43:17+00:00

I saw Saltburn last night and really enjoyed some of the well-written and subtle nuances conveyed around the behaviours and habits of the upper classes especially concerning inclusion/exclusion of others and the rules of engaging in those circles. I think the story Saltburn tells is quite a common experience for many university-educated people albeit to a lesser or greater extent (being clever and socially mobile enough to be educated alongside the privileged, and to see their world, but not rich, connected, unstable or old money enough to be entirely let in.) What I find unfortunate in stories like this (The Talented Mr Ripley et al) is that the writer feels the story is not compelling enough without making the "working class" character into a psychopathic con man who kills everyone at the end. The real complexity of being a "working to middle class" person given a peek/included in an "upper class/old money" world, is that you are generally quite grounded and psychologically stable compared to those you are surrounded by. It's the struggle of being true to yourself in these scenarios which is the story I wish someone would tell. Does anyone feel the same? (I put class references in inverted commas as I believe everybody defines class differently and don't want to be prescriptive or presume I see class in the way that you do)

thatsjustthewayitisok · 15/01/2024 22:26

@MarkWithaC who is Theo?

BatshitIsTheOnlyExplanation · 15/01/2024 22:32

The thing is, the guy who presented himself as "lower class" with alcoholic parents and the place being a mess, was tapping into what the rich kids expected of someone with a Merseyside accent. His parents were middle class, he just lived an alternative persona (hence all the lies)

Mindovermatter247 · 15/01/2024 22:33

I’ve watched up until the so called vampire scene as people are naming it… contemplating wether I want to watch the rest, I’ve watched a lot of disturbing movies in my time but for some reason I just can’t get over the bath scene 🤭

newnamethanks · 15/01/2024 22:45

Diversion from Saltburn, I think you've missed the point of Ripley. He's unique.

mewkins · 16/01/2024 08:36

midnightfeastfeats · 15/01/2024 22:16

@mewkins

No motive for him doing that and are we supposed to believe there was a grand plan when all of the deaths kind of only happened by chance. I don't even buy that Oliver would have inherited the estate why the dad's sister and Farleigh were still alive

I think some of the motive was a step at a time -like when Farleigh told him he would always be back but this was Olivers one summer, I think it provoked him.

The massive weakness of the whole thing was the presentation of him as manipulative when in fact most of it was just lucky or very weak.

Puncturing the tyre - it was just so daft because if it was a slow leak, its possible Felix would have got there in time or would just abandon the bike lock it up and walk the rest of the way - I mean Oxford isn't exactly crossing the Sahara dessert. If it was a full on fast leak, it would have been deflated by the time he got there. Plus I don't believe given Felix's character, he would have cared about being late and missing a tutorial or whatever he was going to. So it wasn't some marvellous scheme of manipulation - it was far more likely to fail.

The poisoning of Felix just didn't ring true at all. He was obsessed with him so would have tried other ways to wheedle back in rather than kill him. There's no way they wouldn't have had a post mortem and the girl India would have placed Oliver at the scene.

I wasn't at all clear whether Sir James Catton was supposed to have killed himself too because the wife said in the coffee shop 'I'm surprised it took him so long' - did that mean 'to die of grief' or 'to kill himself'? wasn't clear. If I can be arsed I might stop it on the obituary shot and see if you can read any of it in any detail!

The death of the wife was utterly ridiculous. No motive for him doing that and are we supposed to believe there was a grand plan when all of the deaths kind of only happened by chance. I don't even buy that Oliver would have inherited the estate why the dad's sister and Farleigh were still aliveWhat was he supposed to have done to her to give her some degenerative illness to need caring for? like you can just do that unnoticed in a house full of staff. And the whipping out of the breathing tube - there is no way that wouldn't cause injury, he wouldn't be able to get it back in, and there's no plausible explanation for that. How was he supposed to have found out where she was in that coffee shop as well?

And as you said, estates like that are usually entailed. There is NO WAY that the next in line male heir wouldn't be on the first fucking flight from Australia to claim their big country pile.

So much ridiculousness.

His best route in to get the house would be to kill Felix, shag the sister some more ,make her fall in love with him (she was kind of on the way before it all went wrong), marry her, get her pregnant until they had a boy and a spare and then kill her.

I'm happy to have found someone who agrees 😁 it feels a bit like it could have been a series rather than a film and then we would have seen more of the excellent parents and Felix and Oliver would both have more developed characters.

To me it felt like a cross between Ripley and the Royal Tenembaums. Maybe what we were missing was more sublety and Gwyneth Paltrow 😆

MarkWithaC · 16/01/2024 09:16

thatsjustthewayitisok · 15/01/2024 22:26

@MarkWithaC who is Theo?

So sorry, I meant Felix/Jacob Elordi. Brain blip!

midnightfeastfeats · 16/01/2024 10:03

@mewkins

yes definitely agree. I mean as a film it had some very good points. I found it quite 'disturbing' in the sense of I've thought about it a lot since I saw it - in that way it reminds me of Midsommmer if you've seen that. I didn't like it at all as a film but it really niggled at me mentally for a long time afterwards. I suppose that could be classed as good 'art' anyway - something that makes you think.

With Saltburn, what it made me think about is mostly about the university social dynamics which I actually think is all about perception. I don't think there are actually 'popular' and 'unpopular' at all I think there are just groups or mini- tribes sometimes very mini-tribes that have their own self perception and act in a particular way and others project on to them. So the 'popular' ones tend to be wealthier and more self confident - so they behave more loudly, more entitled, and are more visible becaues they wear expensive clothes others at that age want. Their own self perception is 'we are the popular ones, look at us.' but they are just another group. The same is true of the 'sporty' ones - 'we are talented at sport, we are the popular ones, you want to be like us you lardarses'. The geeky ones on the other hand view themselves as sad and friendless when in fact they aren't - they have each other as friends. The difference is due to lack of self confidence they self-perceive as sad and geeky AND they then look at the popular or sporty groups and THINK they are more popular and 'better' - which is just their own projections and supports those groups self projections. The geeks are just another group. It's all very interesting and I think very self fulfilling.

One of the things I did like in Saltburn was Rosamund Pike who I've never liked as an actress and I'd always thought was dreadful & one of these privileged nepo babies (parents are opera singers, went to private school, wealthy background, couldn't get into drama school I read somewhere). Gone Girl was dire. Thought she was really good in this and I saw an interview with EF who said she'd always thought Pike was underrated as a comic actress. Definitely agree. I know she had some good lines but she was really good. Very surprised and I was obviously wrong about her as an actress.

Richard E Grant I found a bit too one dimensional and weak really. The suit of armour line (about lets make it faancy dress, i can wear my suit of armour) was badly delivered and he was a bit too cartoonish so the more serious moving moments of his charactera (Felix's death and trying to pay Oliver off) just didn't ring true. Unlike with Pike who's character was fully rounded through her acting. It shows the difference in the quality of them as actors.

Overall though it is very plot problemed @mewkins !

ohdamnitjanet · 16/01/2024 10:07

LunaNorth · 29/12/2023 23:10

Richard E Grant just gets better and better. He doesn’t even need to speak. He’s a wonderful actor, I love him.

Rosamund Pike is great, too.

I really enjoyed everything but the very end. I don’t know if everything needed explaining as plainly as it was.

I really enjoyed it too - but I definitely did need some of the explanations!

mewkins · 16/01/2024 10:12

midnightfeastfeats · 16/01/2024 10:03

@mewkins

yes definitely agree. I mean as a film it had some very good points. I found it quite 'disturbing' in the sense of I've thought about it a lot since I saw it - in that way it reminds me of Midsommmer if you've seen that. I didn't like it at all as a film but it really niggled at me mentally for a long time afterwards. I suppose that could be classed as good 'art' anyway - something that makes you think.

With Saltburn, what it made me think about is mostly about the university social dynamics which I actually think is all about perception. I don't think there are actually 'popular' and 'unpopular' at all I think there are just groups or mini- tribes sometimes very mini-tribes that have their own self perception and act in a particular way and others project on to them. So the 'popular' ones tend to be wealthier and more self confident - so they behave more loudly, more entitled, and are more visible becaues they wear expensive clothes others at that age want. Their own self perception is 'we are the popular ones, look at us.' but they are just another group. The same is true of the 'sporty' ones - 'we are talented at sport, we are the popular ones, you want to be like us you lardarses'. The geeky ones on the other hand view themselves as sad and friendless when in fact they aren't - they have each other as friends. The difference is due to lack of self confidence they self-perceive as sad and geeky AND they then look at the popular or sporty groups and THINK they are more popular and 'better' - which is just their own projections and supports those groups self projections. The geeks are just another group. It's all very interesting and I think very self fulfilling.

One of the things I did like in Saltburn was Rosamund Pike who I've never liked as an actress and I'd always thought was dreadful & one of these privileged nepo babies (parents are opera singers, went to private school, wealthy background, couldn't get into drama school I read somewhere). Gone Girl was dire. Thought she was really good in this and I saw an interview with EF who said she'd always thought Pike was underrated as a comic actress. Definitely agree. I know she had some good lines but she was really good. Very surprised and I was obviously wrong about her as an actress.

Richard E Grant I found a bit too one dimensional and weak really. The suit of armour line (about lets make it faancy dress, i can wear my suit of armour) was badly delivered and he was a bit too cartoonish so the more serious moving moments of his charactera (Felix's death and trying to pay Oliver off) just didn't ring true. Unlike with Pike who's character was fully rounded through her acting. It shows the difference in the quality of them as actors.

Overall though it is very plot problemed @mewkins !

Pike was definitely channelling her inner Joanna Lumley for the role.

I thought Richard E Grant was good re. Felix's death but then I've listen to a few interviews with him recently about the death of his wife and I think it struck a chord (I guess Saltburn was filmed not long after).

I guess the university stuff grated. I went to a not too shabby uni over 25 years ago and there was absolutely none of that divisiveness. I guess it was during Labour's time and it was pretty embarrassing to be seen as rich. Much more kudos if you looked and acted 'authentically'. No idea about Oxford though.

I've not watched Gone Girl- I read the book which started well and ended very badly 😁

I do hate gaping holes in plots.

midnightfeastfeats · 16/01/2024 10:36

I think it must have been about 9 months or something. His wife died in September 2021 and I think Saltburn was filmed in that very hot summer of 2022 which is why it looks so glorious!

I wonder how many films would have been better or worse due to accidents of the weather on filming days! I suppose now its all CGId if the weather is off but I'm sure you get a better result if the bright sunny day is actually a really bright sunny day.