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Original poster

Govt stealth policy to eradicate SAH parenting

309 replies

JRHartley72 · 22/03/2023 06:59

The Guardian is reporting this morning that buried deep in Jeremy Hunt's budget last week is a new policy which will force parents on UC to return to work when their children turn three. As charities and campaigners say, it's like they just don't want us to raise our own children any more!

www.theguardian.com/society/2023/mar/22/jeremy-hunt-universal-credit-benefits-mothers-30-hour-weeks

OP posts:
BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 22/03/2023 07:59

Some of you seem to think that if you say wraparound childcare is available, that means it must be. Which is very silly of you. Availability of childcare is a big issue in this country, and it's got worse recently, not better. I'm worried about how this plan will work if, as I suspect, it's rolled out before childcare provision is expanded. Actually I don't see how the expansion plans are going to work either. The stuff about wanting all schools to provide wraparound sounds like pie in the sky.

JustStudying · 22/03/2023 08:00

BearKey · 22/03/2023 07:43

I don't often comment, but I feel strongly about this. UC is not there so that you can take the government's money (or actually the money from the working people who pay tax) and be a stay at home parents by choice. It's there to help those who work but on a low wage, or who genuinely can't work and need help.

If you are capable of being a sahm because your family finances without UC allows you too, then good for you. If not then unfortunately like millions of other parents still raising their children, you need to work. That is what the new nursery hours are there to support you doing. There is not an unlimited UC fund for those who purposely choose not to work.

Exactly, and UC isn't just available for people on minimum wage. I earn 34k a year, take home 1900, my rent is 950 and childcare 950 which is my whole wage. Universal credit is used to pay bills and I get a small amount of child maintenance. I work hard, so don't feel ashamed one bit to be using UC. I don't think I'd feel the same if I didn't work at all. It's a struggle but I still work because I know it's important, I'll have a pension which I've been building up since I was 18, and when my son goes to school I can finally pay off my overdraft. I would have been better off not working because I would have been far higher up the list for a council house, and would have got a lot more UC, but it didn't sit right with me just not working.

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:03

Peoples view of this will depend on how available childcare is in their area and how well their type of job matches childcare. People struggle to envisage that someone with the skills and experience as a carer in the community might not just slot into an office job thats all flexible and standard hours. Or that because their school offers wrap around, they all do and you dont get a choice of school in every area so you cant just pick the one with wrap around.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Benefits
mrshenny · 22/03/2023 08:03

I honestly thought that, at least certain benefits you couldn't claim once your kid turned 3 and that you're expected to work. Hasn't it always been that way?

Snoken · 22/03/2023 08:04

I agree with pretty much everybody on this thread. If you want to not work but are fit to do so you need to fund that yourself. What the country needs is more people in employment, what the children needs are parents who can support them independently. The relience on benefits in the UK is huge and they can't throw money at lowering the cost of childcare and at the same time fund those who don't want to work even though they could.

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 22/03/2023 08:04

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:03

Peoples view of this will depend on how available childcare is in their area and how well their type of job matches childcare. People struggle to envisage that someone with the skills and experience as a carer in the community might not just slot into an office job thats all flexible and standard hours. Or that because their school offers wrap around, they all do and you dont get a choice of school in every area so you cant just pick the one with wrap around.

Yep! And the idea that childcare provision is going to increase to match demand fits in that same box too.

HamstersAreMyLife · 22/03/2023 08:04

Treacletoots · 22/03/2023 07:45

@HamstersAreMyLife

That's terrible! 8-4 is not wrap around care. Our local primary schools ALL offer 730-6 wrap around provision.

I honestly believe nothing changes if nothing changes and until its absolutely necessary, I.e. a shift change in people choosing to work rather than not, then there will still be a lack of childcare in some areas.

I'd hope that when introducing these changes the government will also consider what else is required to make the policy work, and hopefully that means improving availability of childcare.

Other countries seem to manage it, we just need a reason to push forward this change, and this could just be that change needed.

It is crazy isn't it! Although it's both a staffing and space issue so if there is a massive culture change the staffing part of this may well resolve itself. Bizarrely here childcare drops off at school age so we get a spike then of people leaving or changing work because they no longer have the long nursery hours, something in the system is going very wrong.

I agree this needs to be looked at in the round, increasing funding to make wrap around and other childcare feasible but as someone earlier posted also looking at absent parent contributions and enforcement. It feels like so much is wrong and other countries do this really well, so there must be bits of that we can learn from, perhaps this is a first step

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:04

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:03

Peoples view of this will depend on how available childcare is in their area and how well their type of job matches childcare. People struggle to envisage that someone with the skills and experience as a carer in the community might not just slot into an office job thats all flexible and standard hours. Or that because their school offers wrap around, they all do and you dont get a choice of school in every area so you cant just pick the one with wrap around.

I think they said wrap around will have to be offered

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:05

StrictlyJowita · 22/03/2023 07:50

Yeah there's no way the childcare and jobs are going to be available

There are four admin my immediate family and we all work in different industries where they are short staffed and can't fill roles. (NHS, teaching, finance and restaurant)

Two of my family members have had to employ people from out of the UK.

For 30 hours?

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:06

Just a thought. How many of these SAHP are also providing the support needed to elderly parents?

But yeah on the whole I think its a good idea to get back into work anyway

Wisteriaroundthedoor · 22/03/2023 08:07

Anyone can stay home and “raise their kids” if they can afford it op. But am I fuck paying for it. My taxes can go to all the other things needed, like hospitals and education and policing.

If you can’t afford the luxury of staying home . Get a fucking job. Demanding everyone else pays for you is not ok.

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:11

mrshenny · 22/03/2023 08:03

I honestly thought that, at least certain benefits you couldn't claim once your kid turned 3 and that you're expected to work. Hasn't it always been that way?

You were expected to work 16 hours for 3-5 and then 25 when they start school. The proposal is now that will be 30 hours i assume based on the free nursery funding, but not allowing for the school holidays or travel time.

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:13

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:11

You were expected to work 16 hours for 3-5 and then 25 when they start school. The proposal is now that will be 30 hours i assume based on the free nursery funding, but not allowing for the school holidays or travel time.

Show quote history

Oh god they didn't think that through did they.

BearKey · 22/03/2023 08:13

Wisteriaroundthedoor · 22/03/2023 08:07

Anyone can stay home and “raise their kids” if they can afford it op. But am I fuck paying for it. My taxes can go to all the other things needed, like hospitals and education and policing.

If you can’t afford the luxury of staying home . Get a fucking job. Demanding everyone else pays for you is not ok.

I really wish you could 'like' status's on MN 😀

stickygotstuck · 22/03/2023 08:15

wiffin · 22/03/2023 07:39

I could see this working if:

There is sufficient good quality affordable childcare.

Absent parents are actually required to financially support their children properly and this is enforced.

There is proper consideration of ND and disabled children.

So I won't hold my breath.

Agree with this.

magicthree · 22/03/2023 08:15

I think there's absolutely no excuse for anyone to be a SAH parent once their children have reached school age.

Why is there no excuse? If someone can afford not to work, and doesn't want to work, then why should they? Having a job isn't the be all and end all for everyone.

Wisteriaroundthedoor · 22/03/2023 08:15

just meant the Govt doesn't want anyone to stay at home to look after their child.It's taking away parental choice, no?

more clumsy wording op? Still too early for you? Parental choice still exists. If you can afford it crack on. The government will take no issue.

but if you think everyone else should work and pay for who ever fancies it to say home then you’ve another thought coming.

i honestly can’t believe the things you’re writing.

Clymene · 22/03/2023 08:16

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:06

Just a thought. How many of these SAHP are also providing the support needed to elderly parents?

But yeah on the whole I think its a good idea to get back into work anyway

Very few I'd think. Most people with preschool children are in their 20s and 30s. You'd have to be older parents raised by older parents.

UseOfWeapons · 22/03/2023 08:16

Wisteriaroundthedoor · 22/03/2023 08:07

Anyone can stay home and “raise their kids” if they can afford it op. But am I fuck paying for it. My taxes can go to all the other things needed, like hospitals and education and policing.

If you can’t afford the luxury of staying home . Get a fucking job. Demanding everyone else pays for you is not ok.

👍👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:17

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:04

I think they said wrap around will have to be offered

Show quote history

Its really difficult to staff. I run a breakfast club and we have to cap places as we simply cant get staff who want to work for 1.30 in the morning, and we cant tack it on to TA roles because the TAs tend to have children at other schools so they cant get their child to their school breakfast club, then get to us in time.
The afterschool is marginally easier to staff as its 3-6.30 so is more of a job.

Churnchurn · 22/03/2023 08:17

magicthree · 22/03/2023 08:15

I think there's absolutely no excuse for anyone to be a SAH parent once their children have reached school age.

Why is there no excuse? If someone can afford not to work, and doesn't want to work, then why should they? Having a job isn't the be all and end all for everyone.

The key phrase there is ‘can afford not to work’ which is fine. What’s not fine is when people choose not to work and claim benefits in order to fund that lifestyle choice

Fluffodils · 22/03/2023 08:17

Spendonsend · 22/03/2023 08:17

Its really difficult to staff. I run a breakfast club and we have to cap places as we simply cant get staff who want to work for 1.30 in the morning, and we cant tack it on to TA roles because the TAs tend to have children at other schools so they cant get their child to their school breakfast club, then get to us in time.
The afterschool is marginally easier to staff as its 3-6.30 so is more of a job.

Show quote history

Yeah they haven't actually got any idea of the practicalities have they!

PlateBilledDuckyPerson · 22/03/2023 08:18

JustStudying · 22/03/2023 08:00

Exactly, and UC isn't just available for people on minimum wage. I earn 34k a year, take home 1900, my rent is 950 and childcare 950 which is my whole wage. Universal credit is used to pay bills and I get a small amount of child maintenance. I work hard, so don't feel ashamed one bit to be using UC. I don't think I'd feel the same if I didn't work at all. It's a struggle but I still work because I know it's important, I'll have a pension which I've been building up since I was 18, and when my son goes to school I can finally pay off my overdraft. I would have been better off not working because I would have been far higher up the list for a council house, and would have got a lot more UC, but it didn't sit right with me just not working.

Show quote history

How is your take home only £1900 on £34k - are you sure your tax code is right?

BentleyRhythmAce · 22/03/2023 08:19

Wisteriaroundthedoor · 22/03/2023 08:07

Anyone can stay home and “raise their kids” if they can afford it op. But am I fuck paying for it. My taxes can go to all the other things needed, like hospitals and education and policing.

If you can’t afford the luxury of staying home . Get a fucking job. Demanding everyone else pays for you is not ok.

Exactly! Do what you want, if you're paying for it.

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 22/03/2023 08:22

mrshenny · 22/03/2023 08:03

I honestly thought that, at least certain benefits you couldn't claim once your kid turned 3 and that you're expected to work. Hasn't it always been that way?

It was always the case with UC that they'd pay for one parent to be at home with the child until aged 3 and you were then supposed to start looking. Theoretically people could be sanctioned or made to take jobs in this scenario but in practice it barely happened because nobody was that bothered.

What's changed is that we now have a shortage of workers and the government are shitting themselves. They've identified people who are fit enough to work but currently claiming top up benefits to SAH around children as a group who can be leaned on to address this problem. It's obviously easier to force them than it is some other groups like retired over 55s who are living off their own funds, because anyone who needs full or partial state support to make ends meet is easier to coerce.

However, the missing part of this picture is that childcare in the UK is patchy, expensive and sometimes simply not there. None of the proposals for how this is going to be fixed are very persuasive.