A degree in counselling? Worth it? Posting for traffic

[Peruviandog]

DD has a strong desire to become a counsellor, she is looking at doing a BA counselling and therapeutic practice course at the university of South Wales.

We’ve looked at the course content and I’m a bit surprised that there are only 12 hours a week of lectures. Looking at the stats, the pay as a qualified counsellor isn’t that great and lots of people appear to be working in retail after their degree which doesnt fill me with a lot of confidence that she will actually find this a worthwhile degree.

Has anyone trained as a counsellor? Are there many opportunities? Any advice or insights? I didn’t go to university so have no idea whether 12 hours a week is normal or whether this will be a ‘soft’ degree that won’t be worth the cost long term.

Any input would be gratefully received- thanks

@Peruviandog

Her A Levels are in Law, RE and English. She didn’t take any science subjects as they weren’t all that strong. She loves Law and loves the ethics element of RE. Counselling or therapy seems to be what she’s really leaning towards. Any ideas for other courses that may be suitable? I mentioned speech therapy and she really liked the idea of that too but again these are health sciences and she has no A Levels in science subjects.

I was on the verge of accepting an offer to do psychology and speech therapy at university (I ended up doing just psychology). Science a-levels are not requirement and it's actually a BA degree. My a-levels are in English Language, English Literature, sociology and law!

Speech therapy is a great idea and HUGELY fulfilling.

I wondered if in future with this new research into post trauma memories ( and how it has been found to be more traumatic to unearth memories and causes more damage) if the need for counselling will be much reduced.

There is work available in the NHS and not just in CBT. Psychodynamic and systemic therapies are also employed by NHS. I have also seen art therapists but these are fewer in number. Local authorities are also known to employ therapists in children's services.

As others have suggested, if she wants to earn a living, she should consider training in a core profession, such as mental health nursing, occupational therapy, or social work. If she is not sure which of these may interest her she may like to consider looking for some work experience. It is a competitive field and support worker roles also usually require unpaid work experience to get a foot in the door.

I would not recommend studying psychology as it is one of the most studied degrees and career opportunities and further training as a psychologist are few, she would need to do further training which is highly competitive to get into, even when self funded. If she wants to work in this field a teaching qualification will also open fewer doors than mental health nursing, social work or OT. So in conclusion I would recommend training in one of these professions then going down the IAPT higher level practitioner route where her counselling training will be paid for and she will actually get work.

Just to be clear OP. Even if speech therapy is a BSc none need science ALevels. I applied to them all with my very not science a levels!

Thanks again all, we’ve just been looking at a social work degree - she’s interested in all the course modules which is great but most courses require you to have had at least 12 weeks of hands on caring, either paid or voluntary. She really wouldn’t want to work doing personal care for elderly or disabled people so maybe that job role isn’t for her. How people can even get that type of experience anyway I’m not sure? Surely places don’t take on 17 year olds temporarily and certainly not in these times of covid risk in care homes.

@Crakeandoryx

No. I am a trained counsellor and it was pointless. Very few jobs, no.money in it, volunteers cover the roles. Private practice is unreliable unless you're city based and have PhD.

Its costs more to train than you get back in work.

I agree. Also a trained and experienced Counsellor. I did a Psychology degree at Edinburgh and went on to do a Counselling Diploma at Strathclyde University (BACP accredited). Of my cohort of 28 only 2 got NHS work and 2 more worked reliably in private practice. You CAN go into IAPT later but there is not much work outside the lower ranks of IAPT which are incredibly badly designed and organised. I recently studied at Newcastle University directly under the chap who 'wrote the book' re IAPT and it was dreadful. I saw enough of it in practice too be very very wary of practicing in that system.

I am a social worker in child protection. I got my pre course experience volunteering for a helpline and doing mentoring with young people. It doesn’t face to be face to count and a lot of the courses are quite open minded about what counts as valid experience. I got offers from all the courses I applied to, despite working full time in marketing at the time.

This website might be useful:

www.effective-mind-control.com/self-improvement-plan.html

Basically, you make a spreadsheet and write out every thought and fear you have then sort them by category. It helps the mind to organise your thoughts and clears out worries.

Care work doesn't have to be with elderly people, she could volunteer in a special school or with a youth organisation as PP has suggested. Does she have a particular area of interest?

I have a degree in counselling and psychotherapy

I would advise her to look at mental health nursing, psychology, OT or social work

What I studied has been useful but not as useful as the above degrees and very difficult to get work as a therapist. I work mh now

I’m glad I moved on I prefer a more varied role in my work

In connection to the comments about how few folk on a course actually end up in the field - how many want to? From experience, many students on counsellor training courses are older women who end up on them after some existential probing. Studying might provide an alternative to having therapy, a self-help move that delivers an answer to all those questions about personal identity, purpose and meaning.

@whatisthislifesofullofcare
re 'middle aged women who end up on them after some existential probing' - well, yes and no.. My course was one of the VERY few accredited by the BACP at the time (1997). Mostly middle aged women.
I remember an odd interview where I explained that the reason I wished to move into the field from general Psych degree was that I had had some Counselling of my own and it had been so powerful I wished to train to help others. Far from being approving they were worried that I might think it was counselling for ME that I was buying into. I was very clear that I had been through that experience and that I thought everyone who wished to train should have some experience of 'being in the other chair' and not just for rather foolish 'role play' (which is heavily used in the IAPT system). Most of the lecturers had never had any experience of 'being in the other chair' and were scathing about those who had. It's a balance I think

@Peruviandog

Thanks again all, we’ve just been looking at a social work degree - she’s interested in all the course modules which is great but most courses require you to have had at least 12 weeks of hands on caring, either paid or voluntary. She really wouldn’t want to work doing personal care for elderly or disabled people so maybe that job role isn’t for her. How people can even get that type of experience anyway I’m not sure? Surely places don’t take on 17 year olds temporarily and certainly not in these times of covid risk in care homes.

I think there’s lots of other stuff rather than personal care type work which idiots say counts as caring. But get her to attend a virtual uni open day and check with the unis whatbthey want. Women’s refuges, sure start type children’s centres that sort of stuff? It woukd all have transferable skills. I appreciate during covid times it could be difficult but what online support is there and can she volunteer to help with that....if it counted? Volunteer in a vaccinnation centre? Would that count?

Things have moved on since 1997! There is a mandatory requirement for personal therapy which is not counselling "for" any particular personal problems. Having experience of being a client is very useful and expected nowadays.

Don’t judge the course by the number of hours – essay and theory based courses require a lot of self-study and independent research whereas science subjects demand a lot of lab time. This will apply across the board irrespective of the institution.

As others have said, it’s not necessary to do counselling as a first degree to get into the profession – most do a post-grad – and this could unnecessarily narrow her options early on (although of course the counselling degree would also confer transferable Skills and knowledge to some degree too).

I would also suggest she explore Psychology as this leaves quite a broad range of options open to her later on, in a range of sectors. Lots of psychology grads go into industry and marketing, for example, and it also involves some scientific process such as quantitative research skills, conducting rigorous experiments, etc.

Linguistics might also be of interest, and, like psychology, there are pathways from that into speech therapy and therapeutic disciplines later on ( e.g. www.qmu.ac.uk/study-here/postgraduate-study/2020-postgraduate-courses/pgdip-msc-speech-and-language-therapy-pre-registration/ )

I’d always suggest looking into a joint BA which includes a language too – they generally offer the opportunity of a supported year abroad in industry, or as a teacher, or studying (although Erasmus has now gone :/ ) and open up a whole extra dimension of opportunities and experiences. You don’t always need an a level in a language as some offer ab initio modules in the first year.

@growinggreyer
Yes I realise that (I looked into it some years later)
but it is good to have it posted by you on here too.
I think the idea that a client has counselling 'for' personal 'problems' is part of what worried me. Yes a person may attend with a particular issue in mind but actually it can be helpful as a way of looking at yourself / the world once you start. This has perhaps been badly understood as 'mindfulness' and popularised on everything from post it pads to waterbottles in the West in the last few years but there is a 'mindful' mindset which is a way of being which is not centered around any particular pressing problem that can be explored by therapists and clients alike. IAPT in my (recent!) experience is very much about 'other-ing' the client and labelling them and no experience of Counselling is required or indeed seen as desirable in that setting, which has also been mentioned upthread.

I would look at a Psychology degree - it can take you to many different directions and she can see what she wants to do when she finds out more about different elements (including psychotherapy and counselling)

I really wouldn’t recommend Mental Health nursing based on what you’ve said about her (have done it). It’s much more physical/medical and miles away from counselling.

lovelemoncurd. It is certainly not always useful or therapeutic for clients to talk directly about their traumatic memories. Trauma-focussed therapies work in a variety of ways from helping people regulate their physical and emotional trauma responses to technique-based therapies such as EMDR. That doesn’t mean less therapy is indicated necessarily, just that we now know more about the effects of trauma and what helps someone overcome its debilitating impact.

I’m not sure I was into any existential probing when I began my training

Based on your last post I would 100% say no. I don't think she has enough life experience. I'd recommend another degree course, and she can come to therapy when she has more experience.

I'm a Clinical Psychologist and earn a good salary. But, the path is about 10 years long, on average and starts with an approved BSc. I would never (in a million years!) take on 50k of debt to be a counsellor. She'll take years to recoup the investment and 17 is far too young, in my opinion.

I trained and work as a counsellor, I retrained in my 30s after working in a different field in a corporate environment. I work full time for myself and trained to work with couples as well as individuals, I see around 20 clients per week and charge £50-£70 per hour (I also volunteer at a charity) I think so much depends on where you live and what your niche is. I live in a fairly affluent county, paid counselling roles here are almost always in schools and pay pro rata. Im based at a GP surgery and get referrals through that as well as advertising and word of mouth.
I agree that it’s perhaps more suited to someone who is a little older, I enjoy it but it can be very isolating.

@growinggreyer - yes, there is a PT requirement and having had therapy in the past is not a barrier to entry now.

@52andblue - there are, imo, younger folk on the courses for the reasons you mention, and perhaps it is they who are the ones who do go on to make it a career. But I don’t think that takes away from my point, which was in response to a comment that many do not go on to have a career, that imo many counselling student do not attend with the principal aim of making a career out of it.

Work experience for social work could be so varied. Youth work or befriending might be good. Even if she did want to become a counsellor then experience of working with people is essential. In normal times there might be summer camps that take on people which could be a good bit of temporary work.

I worked as a nursing assistant on the nurse bank through my university days.

@TracyTomatoes

You can't judge a degree by the number of hours though. My academic degree from a top ten university was 10hrs a week in the 1st year and 6 by the last year. No reflection on the rigour of the degree I passed.

I also wanted to point this out. 12 hours contact time per week is pretty standard for a full-time degree, it doesn't mean it won't be any good.

Psychology would be a good choice. As would social work or education- thinking of a pastoral support role.