I develop drugs using animal research AMA

[1dayonly]

My work involves R+D, safety studies and I am a member of several national and international welfare working groups (including the EU ones until March).
Ask me anything

Are you in Newcastle??
I am not, but the ground breaking work they do there on animal wellbeing, diagnosis and pain management has significantly impacted on the work I and my colleagues do everyday.

Have your views on animal testing changed at all since you started?

I work in biopharmaceuticals as well but developing the processes to make the drugs not testing them. I would say two things. Firstly toxicology tests have to be performed on animals before a drug can be tested in humans. Every drug on the market has been tested on animals. The thalidomide scandal was caused by inadequate animal testing, it's essential for the safety of our families.

Secondly

Secondly! rats are the most commonly used animal but more rats are killed as pest control than are killed for testing drugs.

What was your career path? Undergrad, post grad etc
And what do you earn?

Have your views on animal testing changed at all since you started?
Yes.
I started off trying to be the one who ended animal research. Now I'm in there doing it every day, while being very judgy of the world around me who don't think about these things or even think to ask.

What was your career path? Undergrad, post grad etc. And what do you earn?
My career path would be completely outing. I have post doctoral qualifications.

What an interesting thread. I use an IL17 inhibitor and it's been life changing. If it wasn't for people like yourself, my life would be very different.

Do you think animal testing will always be necessary? Are there viable alternatives in the pipeline?

I believe that people are more important than animals.
It’s peope like yourself, with this attitude that is destroying our planet.

Do you think animal testing will always be necessary? Are there viable alternatives in the pipeline?

I can't answer that question. My work involves refinement and reduction but the replacement is outside my sphere of influence. I hope that we can avoid it in the future, but the way the world is going I really don't think most people care.

To those posters who are against animal testing - do you and your children take no medicine or drugs at all? Because surely, you can't allow yourself to use medicine if you are so against it?

I imagine that every species views their own as more important, it's instinct to protect our own.

Would I needlessly hurt an animal? No.

Would I give my kid a medicine that's been tested on and killed an animal? In a heartbeat.

I believe that people are more important than animals.
It’s peope like yourself, with this attitude that is destroying our planet.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree. I think that capitalism, commercialism and environmental irresponsibility are more damaging to the planet than me developing pharmaceuticals in a lab.

How much do you earn a year?

Hi OP as a nurse, a mother, and someone dependant on medications, thank you for doing what you do, I literally wouldn't be alive without you doing what you do!

BUT

I'm also vegetarian. Whilst I know animal testing for medicine is a necessity, I also know animals are euthanised once the teat is complete. Can you please offer me reassurances about how this is done and what action you take if it fails to euthanise an animal quickly to minimise suffering?

To those posters who are against animal testing - do you and your children take no medicine or drugs at all? Because surely, you can't allow yourself to use medicine if you are so against it?

I have to say that I don't think that's fair. Once a new drug reaches Phase 3 clinical testing and the animal work is all done, there is nothing to be gained for the animals by not getting the benefit. The development is finished. I don't begrudge a drug I've worked on to anyone who needs it.

It's not like fur where they'll kill more animals for the next coat.
It's not like Botox where every single batch is individually tested: 40,000 mice a year you know.
It's not like meat, or dairy, or leather.

Mind you, the idea that a meat eater would have a go at someone using animals to save lives is a bit rich, so I'm presuming that they are all vegan.

I'm also vegetarian. Whilst I know animal testing for medicine is a necessity, I also know animals are euthanised once the teat is complete. Can you please offer me reassurances about how this is done and what action you take if it fails to euthanise an animal quickly to minimise suffering?
I'm vegan. I wasn't when I began my career. It became a bit of a logic spiral.
Almost all animals euthanized under ASPA are done so using a schedule 1 method, which means it is done using a method from a prescribed list. The animals are killed by a method suitable for the species (from the schedule 1 list) and then death is confirmed by a secondary method.
Methods routinely used in slaughterhouses in the UK are not humane enough to make it on to the schedule 1 list.
The euthanasia at the end of toxicology studies is so that all the organs and tissues can be examined and sampled to look for sub-clinical changes related to the test item (so changes in the liver which have not impacted on animal health yet...and so on. We get more data from after the animal has been put down than we do in life for some species.
Pharmacology, metabolism, adme studies don't involve pathology and very often the animals can be used on another study or even rehomed.

No judgement here. I understand why drugs are tested on animals!

My question, please don't take any offence. (I will try to word sensitively)

When a test makes an animal so poorly it dies, do you get upset or do you take a professional stance?

How long on average do u 'know' the animals for? Do you get a bond with any of them? Animals have strong personalities so I think I would create bonds, then Id feel guilty of the work.

How much do you earn a year?
I did say AMA, not that I'd answer.

Thanks OP, and can you go into more detail re the methods used?

Totally agree with you about slaughterhouses by the way! That's why I don't eat meat - the rate of pre stunning failure is ridiculously high!

When a test makes an animal so poorly it dies, do you get upset or do you take a professional stance?
If an animal dies we have failed to do our job. We monitor the animals very closely and would aim to remove from treatment, to treat or to euthanize an animal before it was suffering to an extent. Where an animal does become unwell the care technical staff do get very upset. Likewise at the end of the study when the animals go off to necropsy. I am at a level where I don't have much 1:1 time with the animals any more so it's more a 'what can we do to make this better' reaction from me. I also have a huge box of tissues in the office.

How long on average do u 'know' the animals for? Do you get a bond with any of them? Animals have strong personalities so I think I would create bonds, then Id feel guilty of the work
Lots of the bigger animals have names and have a close bond with their carers. The length of time they are here varies hugely. A few weeks to years.

Thanks OP, and can you go into more detail re the methods used?
Differs significantly by species. Most common though is fatal overdose of anaesthetic followed by cessation of heartbeat. There's always a double method.
Slaughterhouses don't use anaesthetic because of meat contamination. Our animals aren't going to be eaten, whereas a stun bolt though the head might affect the brain pathology!

Thank you for answering my question.
I know you won't get much thanks on here for the job you do, but I will thank you. DDs dad would be dead if it wasn't for successful medication. Even with medication he is extremely ill, every day she has with her dad alive is a blessing to her. If he was on no medication he would have died when she was just 6 weeks old.
11 years later she has a daddy who she loves more than anything in the world, thanks to medication. Yes, he will die soon, possibly before the end of next year, but at least she hold memories she can cherish!
Animal testing isn't perfect, if only there was a way we could test without animals, the fact is, we can't, another fact is we have all had medication thar was tested on animals... when it suits us, we ignore that fact!

Thanks OP, this is fascinating and the work you do, although I can imagine at times distressing, is saving a lot of lives.