I’m an executive recruiter AMA

[MyCatsRuleTheHouse]

Mostly in the third and public sector spaces.

We generally work on Chief Executive and non-executive board roles (Chair of Board and Trustee/Non-Executive Director), but also Exec Directors and some Heads of.

TheMendedDrum I tend not to be very blunt, but I won’t encourage someone to go for something if I think they’re not right for it and I will say why. But I’m very relationships focused, at the top there are fewer and fewer people who can do a job and I want people to feel well treated. They might not be right for this job but they may well be right for another I’m working on in future, and I want them to pick up the phone next time I call. It’s also no benefit to me to take a someone’s application to a client just to have to tell them it’s a no later, that’s not nice no matter how many times you do it. So I’ll be honest but never rude or abrupt.

We have a very extensive database built up over many years, so will often start there as it’s simpler and we will have people’s contact details already, but then span out to organisations websites, LinkedIn (the more detailed the LinkedIn the better) etc, and we tend to call lots of people just to ask their advice on who we should be approaching about a role, or where might have the right people and why.

What sort of background do most of the NEDs you recruit have?

Varies depending on the NED role tbh. Boards need a balance of knowledge, ie. an HR person, a finance person, maybe someone with experience in the area the organision works in (like children’s services in a children’s charity) or something like digital if an organisation is going through digital transformation. Generally it will be people who have been top of their game in that area in their exec roles - so HR director or FD of a major organsion, usually of comparible size and complexity to the organisation we’re hiring into. Often we’re looking for people who already have NED experience and understand good governance, and leading an organision

Isnt it the truth that Execs and CEOs operate in a kind of bubble,an exclusive gentlemens' club where they move seamlessly from one directorship to another?

Take as an example the CEO of BT Gavin Patterson. He has presided over a company that has gone from a strong and stable position to one fraughts ith difficulties whos share price has crashed dramatically under his leadership . He then announces cutting 13000 jobs. Luckily the major shareholders (investment cos) decided it was time to cut his job. No doubt he will leave with a big fat golden handshake and further he will soon be headhunted and take up another seat on the gravy train.

Contrast this with an ordinary worker. A minor slip,they are disciplined and booted out with no pay

www.cwu.org/news/swansea-victory-solidarity-wins-justice/

Thanks mycats

I have another Q if you don't mind

Is an NED role an effective way of "contributing"? I often think I'd like to "do more" but never know how best to help with the skill set I gave (legal)

Women in particular can be over cautious

I am fed up of other people telling me I’d be brilliant at all sorts of roles and that I should grab opportunities. Just because other people can see I’d be very good at certain roles (I agree) doesn’t mean I would find them interesting or fulfilling!

Isnt it the truth that Execs and CEOs operate in a kind of bubble,an exclusive gentlemens' club where they move seamlessly from one directorship to another?

@Limpopobongo

I agree with this to quite a large extent and am interested in the OPs views.

My disheartening experience as I have become more senior is that the people who make it to the top are often there because of their ability to be political - and very rarely because they are actually any good. The people who are good often leave because they can't deal with the crap and they often stand up for what they believe in and get shunted out.

So I think you then get Boards choosen from a pool of people who are actually not necessarily that good at the content of what they do and also often don't have a strong ethical framework.

I have seen Boards in a number of organisations oversee the organisations implode - with zero accountability. I refer you to the Global Financial Crisis....

So I think the good people who would be excellent in the board role never get a look in...

So true, aaarrr. So depressing.

Limpopobongo I really can’t speak for the private sector as I have experience there, but it’s certainly not the case in the not for profit world. Knowing someone might get you an interview, but I’ve never known anyone be appointed on that basis.

user1499173618 if someone isn’t interested in a job that’s fine, at this level I’m not out to be a salesperson. The caution I mention is when someone, often women, are saying it’s an ideal job but are still far more hesitant to go for it and need more reassurance that they’re right, whereas men are generally (in my experience anyway) more willing to just have a punt at it.

WonderfulWonders I think it’s a great way to give back, you can have an impact on hundreds or even thousands of lives through getting a charity working well. Senior legal backgrounds are often sought as well.

aaaarrrrgggghhh - so true! I'd love my job if it wasn't for the egos that have to be protected. In certain cases i dont even think those egos want to be protected but the overall culture dictates it.

OP - do you do specific work to keep your database refreshed with new people or is it the same old crowd each time?

TheDuckSaysMoo I’m always hoping to add more people, the more the better. A search just from our database is unusual and in my opinion not a very well done one, the more new people added the better. But we generally only add people in the context of a search, we don’t go out just to find people to add on the off chance they might be right for something, I haven’t got the time to do that tbh.

Do you ever find roles for ex-teachers? I've read that recruiters / headhunters find it difficult to find jobs for them...

HappyKatieA Some of the people I’ve appointed have been teachers in the past, but at the level I work at it would be very unusual for someone to come straight from a teaching job. It’s unlikely someone would go straight from a teaching/headteacher role into a chief executive or director role, they would have built a second career already and that’s the bit I’d be looking at.

Fab, thank you 😊

This is a really interesting thread. I am thing about moving into the NED world and have just applied for a role on an independent remuneration panel. I'm doing the ICSA qualification too and work in a senior governance type role

Can I be on your books?

Millybingbong glad it’s interesting! One thing as this level is we don’t solicit for people to come to us, and we don’t find roles for people, we find people for our clients. But if you’re building a portfolio keep an open mind and we might end up coming to you! (A nice up to date LinkedIn in always appreciated!)

Thanks for the response. I do have an updated LinkedIn and do occasionally get approached so all is well there.

Why is it now normal practice for recruitment agents and employers to only contact the successful candidate? Why are are unsuccessful candidates left in limbo as to whether they actually got the arsing job at all? Seriously, after all those interviews, especially at senior management level, you'd at least expect up follow up call/email to say you'd been unsuccessful.

I really can’t speak for other recruiters, we never do that and always contact everyone regardless of outcome whatever stage of the process it is. I think it’s very bad form from those that do that, they can’t care about building good relationships for the future.

Interesting thread OP, thanks.

I think LinkedIn in both a blessing and a curse. I've made some great connections but I've turned off job notifications as I got so sick of recruiters contacting me to offer me entry/intermediate level jobs when my profile makes it quite clear that I have extensive industry experience and work at a senior/executive level. I also work in the public sector and the pay scale I am on in is easily available to anyone who might want to do a Google search. Why invite me to apply for jobs that I'm overqualified for that pay £20K less than I earn now?

Not your fault OP I know, but some recruiters really need to do better.

I attend board meetings and audit committees and would certainly be interested in becoming a NED in the next few years. The NEDs I have worked with have always added value and have provided that extra level of scrutiny over the operation and governance of the organisation that is critical. My old boss has just been appointed NED Chair of an audit committee and he finds it incredibly rewarding. And he doesn't get paid!

Do you see a gender pay gap and if so at what level difference- and why?

I work in the third sector and have never yet encountered a compotent director, senior manager or board member. They reach that level through politics and once there, drift from org to org, overseeing utter shambles. I have no idea what these "rare skills" you mention could be. Unless they are skills such as megalomania, ignorance and an inability to use Excel.

Having said that, my org has a new CE who has come from the private sector and hopefully he will kick everyone's arse into gear.

What's the general attitude about people sending thank you emails after their interview? I have been recommended by friends but it makes me feel desperate.. I'm sure the hiring staff don't like being bombarded with 50 emails about the same day? Any options?