Sandyford Clinic in Scotland closing doors to new patients

There seem to be a lot of relevant groups who identify as Cass not applying to them. This is the fundamental issue with a group who have a powerful, faith based belief that reality is what you identify as it being. Which is fine, multi faith society, but this particular faith? Kind of makes belief in it incompatible with holding a position of responsibility.

Sandyford (and NHS NSS) feel Cass doesn’t apply to them because they think they have a more stringent process than the Tavi.

load of rubbish, but no one independent is looking at it

I can’t imagine anyone want to train all those years (psychiatry or clinical psychology) to work in a clinic where there is no opportunity for differential diagnosis.

That’s before you get to the questionable ethics and the difficult patient group.

Hardly any wonder the GICs struggle to both recruit and retain staff.

As for why Cass doesn’t apply, I reckon that’s just a convenient administrative excuse - Cass was commissioned by NHS England and health is devolved. I expect all the same issues are present at Sandyford (although perhaps without the ‘but we’re international pioneers!’ grandiosity?)

NHS Wales and NI both had contracts with GIDS. I wonder what they will do now?
Adult services in NI are already pretty much non-functional, I heard?

The staff issie is because the patient group are quite difficult to deal with . It isn’t proper medicine or care -
patient tells you what to do and you do it or risk being complained about or worse. Who’d want that job?

Yeah, I really think these kids are better off not going to these places. And frankly, if they are seen by mental health professionals, it probably should not be the ones who became involved in gender counselling (with rare exceptions.) I think those people are clearly lacking something in their understanding.

And that isn’t why the Tavistock service was closed either. What a weird reading of the Cass report.

They can’t recruit, but aren’t willing to do anything but blame ‘transphobia’. There’s no sense that they are vaguely capable of reflecting upon anything at all.

Then there’s the hyperbole about 1000 transphobic articles a week about the client base. These are clinicians supposed to be working in an evidence-driven way.

I read this earlier. The public domain audit trail they're leaving behind is mind boggling.

'the Sandyford source told The Sunday National that every person on the team had read Cass’s report “multiple times” and that it did not apply equally to the Scottish service.
“We’re always being compared to the Tavistock,” they said. “The spin is that we’re just the same as the Tavistock and it was shut down for all these horrible things, but the reality is the Tavistock was shut down for the same reason that we’re struggling, which is we don’t have the staff and the resource to support the people that are being referred to the service.”'

Doesn't explian how or why Cass doesn't apply to the Scottish service.

They are so dismissive of Cass.

But then they did have the endocrinologists mark their own homework…

(from the NHS NSS SBAR on the Cass Review)

This ^^

The service needs radical overhauling but to just abandon the service users is an appalling response.

'“Gender services is a complex specialty which demands a particular set of clinical skills and other qualities from staff, and it is true that we are facing specific challenges around recruitment in some areas.' - NHS spokesperson.

What are those 'other qualities'?

thenational.scot/news/23377189.sandyford-gender-services-staff-scared-due-anti-trans-climate/

'“THE climate we’re in right now, the entire team is scared.”
Staff at the Sandyford sexual health clinic in Glasgow – the only place in Scotland where young people can receive gender-related care – have growing concerns about the rhetoric in the debate around trans rights and the impact it will have on services, a source told The Sunday National.'
...
'One post in the gender team, the source said, has been advertised three times over a year without even a single applicant.
“It’s crazy. There’s just no resource and nobody there,” they said, adding that campaigns against the legitimacy of gender identity care were making the problem worse.
“Imagine if you were to sell it without even knowing what the service was,” they said.
“There’s this massive waiting list and there’s going to be loads of scrutiny on you and people are going to be actively campaigning for your service to close down and there’s 1000 newspaper articles written about your client base every week. When you put it like that, nobody is going to want to do it.”'

That is one possibility. Or another possibility is that people don't buy gender identity theory, or medicalising children, and that's why they're not keen on applying for the job.

Gillick has been stretched beyond all meaning due to Stonewall/Mermaids law.

School said they had changed DD’s name /sex on the school register without informing parents due to her ‘Gillick Competency’ - we asked who had made the Gillick assessment and for a copy of the paperwork.
They backed down immediately (of course as soon as DD turned 16 she was able to change her name legally without parental permission so it only delayed it but it was interesting to see school recoil when asked for proof). School is in England, is a Stonewall Bronze Champion and staff have had Mermaids training.

Agree with @rogdmum - that the apparent backtrack re: pausing the waitlist was almost inevitable once the press had run off with it. Bet the TQ orgs of Scotland were furious!

it’ll be the ’counsellors’ who do the ‘information gathering sessions’ who determine the Gillick status

I wonder who is allowed to decide Gillick status. I can see references to judges, "medical professionals" and "healthcare professionals" and it seems to vary for different procedure. So this is something else that might need to be tightened up for overseas gender treatments. Apparently Marianne Oakes has "qualified as a therapeutic counsellor" but that's not a medical qualification and it doesn't mean necessarily understanding the full physical and medical implications. (sorry if that's a derail)

I don’t think it is particularly odd. The overriding message in internal NHS Scotland (NSS, Sandyford etc) correspondence and reports is that families must be reassured that it is effectively business as usual at Sandyford- eg in the NSS Cass summary document, it is emphasised:

”There is a degree of anxiety already existing with young people and their families, it would be helpful to have some reassuring lines prepared and agreed about the continuation of services in Scotland.”

I suspect Sandyford briefly closed their waiting list as the service is overwhelmed. I suspect they did not expect this to be picked up by the press, but it did and what ensued was misinformation that the service was closed. I suspect their statement and reopening of the waiting list is damage control to reassure families <who are still under the deluded belief that Sandyford operates an evidence based approach>

Just came to post the same link.

All a bit odd.

Sandyford have said it was misinformation in the press and the waiting list has not been shut:

“We wish to assure you that the gender service for both young people and adults at Sandyford is very much open and we continue to accept referral to our waiting list. We are aware there has been some misinformation circulated in the press.

The service is under significant pressure due to the demand and we are experiencing staffing challenges so it does mean our waiting list will most likely increase. We are at the moment undertaking some recruitment into the service, but that will take several weeks before it will have an impact on our waiting times.

We apologise for an inconvenience or distress this may cause”

www.scottishtrans.org/sandyford-young-persons-gender-service-continuing-to-accept-new-patients/

High time. The sand castle is tumbling down.

There are lots of complaints re: UK pharmacists saying no to GenderGP prescriptions in online trans spaces!

Under 18s have to have paper prescriptions in the post after RPS intervened (adults can still use the online pharmacies that partner with GenderGP)
www.pharmacyregulation.org/sites/default/files/document/20210209_response_to_gendergp_.pdf

(apologies for the derail from Sandyford specific chat!)

Fingers crossed!
it’ll be the ’counsellors’ who do the ‘information gathering sessions’ who determine the Gillick status - the Romanian doctor who signs the EEA prescriptions is pretty much invisible.

care.gendergp.com/911665-What-happens-during-an-Information-Gathering-Session

Marianne Oaks is the most visible of their (freelance) counsellors: www.gendergp.com/my-story-marianne-oakes/

From the guidance for pharmacists that @CryptoFascistMadameCholet linked

"This does not affect your right to exercise your professional discretion to refuse to dispense a prescription if any of the following apply:
it would not ordinarily be dispensed in the UK
there are doubts over its authenticity
there are concerns about the clinical appropriateness of the medicine(s) for that patient
it would cause any issues of health and safety"

Perhaps there need to be more restrictions on UK pharmacies dispensing hormones to under 16s on an overseas prescription? It's likely to be complicated (contraception etc) but maybe not impossible.

GenderGP will already give a year’s worth of hormones to any kid with unsupportive parents who GGP decides is Gillick Competent

Hm. Yes GenderGP do operate in the UK. Are they allowed to determine Gillick competence for UK kids since their doctors aren't necessarily in the UK? GenderGP (and any other overseas services prescribing hormones to children) might be another scandal waiting to break especially now that Susie Green has joined them.