Does my bum look unprofessional in this?

He turned up once with his pyjamas on under his trousers (before I joined, but there are reliable witnesses). I have no idea how he didn't notice.

Trillian - like idea of tech guy half in pyjamas, question is which half?!

agree this is a really interesting thread. my old company was a small consultancy with a young staff. we had a dress code which was quite formal because of meeting stuffy clients. The reality was that ties were not worn, women tended to wear tops and skirts/ trousers rather than full suits etc. But if people looked scruffy then it was commented on.

A new and utterly talented graduate joined us and just refused to wear a suit. She was rather bohemian in look but stunningly intelligent and switched on (and quite pretty, this may have helped I imagine) and so although comments were made she didn't cave in and it had no repercussions for her career with us. Clients loved her and clearly didn't notice her clothes or felt she was a breath of fresh air. Later on she got headhunted to join a more hip and youthful consultancy in a move upwards. I can't imagine things would have worked out the same way in a more traditional or City company - one difference probably being that as we were small we didn't have an HR dept and no-one could really be bothered to enforce the "rules". larger companies do get a bit overly-bureaucratic and petty about these things ime.

Re heels, I would wear them with skirts because otherwise I felt short and dowdy. Heels gave me more confidence. All part of our cultural indoctrination of looks/ fashion / men-pleasing perhaps?

Bump because I think this is really interesting and I want to hear from people with experience of working in a greater variety of places.

i got around this (having to wear skirts) by insisting everyone wore an identical uniform (chinos and golf shirts)

it made the women in my teams life immesurably easier as we were based on site. the men were mostly just excited about free golf shirts.

I used to work somewhere where if a woman turned up in anything other than a proper shirt under their suit they would be asked to change.

And 15 years ago I couldn't have worn trousers in Court.

I've lost count of the number of times it has been assumed that I am the admin assistant/secretary/girl who is going to take the notes, presumably because I am young blond and attractive (or was back in the days when I worked).

Regarding womens suits being fitted and mens being baggy - isn't that only if they don't fit so well? I'm sure a well-fitting mens suit jacket should, when done up, emphasise the shoulders and make the waist look smaller.

A man's suit on a woman would be baggy, but only because the woman would be the wrong shape to fill it.

My office is v casual (not public-facing at all) - I work with a lot of tech guys and they all wear jeans with shirts or t-shirts. There is a story that one day one of them turned up half wearing pyjamas.

i work in a 'creative' and 'academic' environment so i can pretty much wear anything - i would always throw on a trouser suit for meeting trustees or presentations and i would wear a nice knee length dress or smarter trousers for press events and marketing 'do's but i can wear jeans on a normal day.

it's very equal between men and women in that atmosphere, although to be honest men rarely wear jeans but can wear cords and chinos and casual shirts.

Try Jones or M&S ones with proper rubber or thick leather soles.

(or Pretty Ballerina/ French Sole if you're minted)

I have some but they have very thin soles so they wear out fast and my feet get cold, wet and I can't walk across gravel without wincing.

MsR- cant you just wear ballet flats?

I can't for the life of me find a nice looking pair of flat shoes that are comfortable and acceptable for work (i.e. not trainers). I blame the patriarchy.

Just never a woman come even close to it. There may be some, and personally I am also a fan of a simple work wardrobe, but I cant imagine a woman taking it to that extreme.

(i.e. not just 5 similar black suits, but 5 absolutely identical suits).

I did used to wear pretty much top to toe black when I worked in the City- so I could get dressed in 2 mins and at least know everything would match!

Why not?

Loving Stubbornhubbys fashion dispatches from the frontline of the city!

My Dh has gone one further in the "effortless city dressing"stakes. He has had 10 identical shirts made to go with his 4 identical suits and 2 pairs of identical shoes, so he basically wears the same thing every single day, which he loves as it means getting dressed involves absolutely no effort at all.

In his office he stores 2 identical navy v neck jumpers in case the air con is a bit aggresive, and a selection of fairly similar looking ties.

Cannot imagine a women ever doing that.

I think the dress code thing can work both ways. I agree that women can struggle to be seen as professional however dress codes for women can be more relaxed than those for men which I don't think helps the cause.

Our office is quite casual in the grand scheme of things, no-one wears a suit and I am wearing a fairly typical ensemble of cotton tunic, linen trousers and sandals today. Men tend to wear trousers and open necked shirts, no tie.

A colleague is wearing a plain white cotton t-shirt, skirt and flip flops. All nicely presented and she looks fine, the tshirt is clean, ironed, no cleavage and her flip flops are leather and look expensive. However if a man turned up in a tshirt and flip flops I suspect he would be roundly 'd by The Powers That Be. (Possibly even more so if he teamed his tshirt and flipflops with a skirt)

Blimey I'm glad I don't have to think abut what footwear or clothes I wear for work.
This week I've gone to work in a pair of high gladiator sandals. denim shorts and a firetrap t shirt, also worn a Fat Face dress and flip flops, jeans and converse, a Betty Jackson skirt and DKNY top as well as Berghaus trousers and a North Face T shirt and looked perfectly normal everytime!!

I think much about this issue is summed up nicely by this quote -

"When a man gets up to speak, people listen then look.
When a woman gets up, people look, then, if they like what they see, they listen"

• Pauline Frederick

i think workplaces differ takver. I work in the city and I expect we are pretty conservative all in all.

i think what is common in ALL workplaces is that to succeed you should

• work out what the norms are, and
• conform to the smarter end of those norms

I have to have a slight heel in work. God forbid that anyone would realise how short I actually am!

Do you think it has got worse in recent years? I haven't had a 'proper' job for years, but when I did (up til 98) a trouser suit and lace up brogue style (? leather, flat, smart) shoes was definitely totally acceptable/normal women's office wear. As I recall the suits weren't any more 'fitted' than the equivalent male variety. (Or perhaps economists are so desperately unfashionable that some attempt at smartness is considered them most anyone can ask of them?)

The only 'dress code' in our office beyond that was that the better you were at your job, the more informally you could dress when not seeing clients.

where I work flat shoes are completly acceptable IMO

but yes many women wear heels.