So banning the Burka - freeing women from opression or taking away free choice...?

this is pathetic, and predictable and a waste of time.

nobody is making apologetics for child rapists. get a grip.

the Virgin Mary didn't have sex, though. Well, whether she did or whether she didn't, that's NOT how Jesus was alleged to have arrived here.

And, again, that (allegedly) was 2010 years ago. Nobody really thinks it's ok for a 30 year old man to be fucking a 12 year old, just because he's the only man she'll ever get fucked by?

Sex with underage children is illegal pretty much everywhere, however the 'age' at which underage applies varies

map showing age of consent variations

Spain has the age of consent at 13, despite having a very 'western' culture

Under Sharia law, men and women are not equal. Two women must testify to hold the same weight as one man.

now, 600 years ago, Sharia law was amongst the least unfair cultures towards women - the west certainly did not give women any property rights or ANY place in a court.

But the West has caught up with fairness, and people who are supporting Sharia law are skirting around the fact that it just isn't fair.

Oh, umayma, I think I already said that I think there's a lot of things in the Bible that are not applicable in today's society.

Farmer

Do you seriously think it's ok for 10 year olds to have sex with older men just because they already got their period?

Really?

there are 12 and 13 yr olds having babies over here, they've probably slept with a handful of guys before they reach this age.

someone sleeps with their husband once they've reached puberty in arabia. and there is a big fuss.

nobody makes a fuss about the Virgin Mary giving birth to God at 14? or was she 12?

I get it, farmerjones, but no, I can't think that the rule that allows a child to be married off is adequate.

And, umayma, is it like this, really? You just ask the child if she wants to marry an adult and she says no and that's it? Come on.
And even if she said yes? You think an 11 year old can make an informed decision?

I, for one, am glad, that in western countries sex with underage children is a crime.

do not impose your own cultural mores on everyone else.

your post has me fuming.

dittany, you are missing the point.
she is NOT A CHILD.
biologically, she is a woman. and is treated as one. ie, able to get married.

winny, my own culltural upbringing makes me feel that way too. and there are plenty of 16 year olds i would worry about as well. but, thats my problem in not understanding a different cultural norm. it doesnt mean that the rules of that culture arent adequate for it.
onset of menarche is the minimum age. just like 16 doesnt mean that all girls and boys go out and get married at 16 in this culture.

*that's why...not way

Thanks, farmerjones, but I still believe an 11 year old is a child, period or not.

oh, really? Ok, then, maybe I got the verse number wrong...

I did read a lot of scary stuff about marriage, though- verses about how men are better than women, how they can punish them if they 'rebel', how girls are 'given' in marriage etc etc- exact quotes.

I am definitely not trying to offend you, but I just disagree with applying the same attitudes and laws as ages ago and that's way I was trying to find verses that no person that believes men and women are equal could possibly think still have a place in the society today.

Anyway, perhaps I will make it my project for tomorrow and come back here with exact quotes and then we'll see?

winny, every culture has an age of consent. usually arbitraily decided. in the uk, its sixteen. ther eis no biological reason for it to be 16, it just is. in canada it is 14, as it was in scotland.
in the arab world, it was menarche. the onset of periods meant a girl became a woman, and therefore could be married. so, if that happened at 16, or at 11, whatever, it was based on biology. not some random choice.

must go to bed, and not get sucked ba ck into this thread.

okay, if anyone has any genuine questions about Islam i'm happy to answer,

sorry i don't want to be jumping down peoples throats but there is just so much rubbish and untrue things said about Islam.

so sorry for snapping!

i have my Qur'an here that verse isn't even about that, doesn't even mention it

And I didn't google Sharia law, but verses in Koran dealing with capital punishment.

So, no, I haven't visited any anti-Islamic website.

I don't have an issue with any religion as such, I'm merely pointing out that some of it is a bit outdated, that's all.

It's somewhere after verse 2:178- it's about a rule of equality, so a man killing a woman would not be punished by death.

oh lets just google sharia law and go on the first anti islamic website we find.

right so now you are a scholar in sharia law. and men can murder women without the death penalty. whatever, i just can't be bothered with this rubbish.

you said you haven't even read Qur'an, but you think you know Shariah law.

you know you cannot force anyone to marry. so ask your 11 yr old to marry someone, they will say no, then thats it. no marriage.

I mean, you couldn't possibly disapprove of it because it's permitted in Koran.

So, if your friends, for example, married off their daughter at 11, because she had her period and because it's fine by Koran, you wouldn't find it reprehensible, then?