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Girls Using Walking Sticks

914 replies

Arran2024 · 08/07/2025 18:57

I saw a post about this on X this morning. Apparently it is a trend.

Anyway, I went into town this afternoon and sure enough, I saw a number of young women with walking sticks. None of them looked like they were leaning hard on their stick, just kind of walking along like it was a big umbrella.

Is anyone else seeing this?

OP posts:
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Arran2024 · 10/07/2025 20:49

MissDoubleU · 10/07/2025 16:50

You’re talking about people with a very serious mental health issue, which is also a protected disability in its own right. These people need help - not judgement.

When does it tip over into abusive behaviour? Is fictitious illness by proxy a mental illness or a calculated strategy designed to achieve a particular outcome?

I don't think it's straightforward btw. My girls' birth mother was never prosecuted but she didnt get help either.

( BTW that's not why the children were removed).

OP posts:
HelenaWaiting · 10/07/2025 20:34

Iwanttoliveonamountain · 08/07/2025 20:13

My point stands.

Well it doesn't because the mods have deleted it.

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 20:27

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 20:21

I didn't say that, and I have no interest in engaging with someone who will lie so blatantly.

Where have I lied? I am confused.

I wasn't implying you said that . You have misunderstood

I was agreeing with you that a discussion needs to be had that about why there is an uptick in illness and whether it is related to covid and or the vaccines. And it doesn't seem to be happening. Theres been a massive increase in people diagnosed with Myasthenia since the pandemic and again, I think it seems that for some reason it's not really being talked about . And my frustration is that discussion about why there are more ill people (and indeed, hand wringing about rises in benefits claims) doesn't seem to ever get close to a big discussion about the physical impact of COVID on the population

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 20:21

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 20:00

It's more fun to imply everyone's just making it up though I guess.

I didn't say that, and I have no interest in engaging with someone who will lie so blatantly.

Heggettypeg · 10/07/2025 20:11

I wonder if "austerity" is another player in the uptick in disability? It's a good many years now since the need for food banks began to be a thing, so a lot of young people have grown up with that, and of course there was a long break during COVID where children living in poverty didn't go to school; did they get anything equivalent to free school meals during that time or were they just left to manage?

The puzzle then would be why girls rather than boys. Are girls more vulnerable to being physically undermined by malnutrition? Or just less likely to tough out mobility issues without using a stick? Or is austerity a red herring and there's no correlation between young stick users and household poverty? I don't have any data that would illuminate this.

BettyBooper · 10/07/2025 20:10

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 20:00

It's more fun to imply everyone's just making it up though I guess.

I absolutely don't think you're making it up.

However I have also worked with many young people who do horrendous things to themselves when in distress. And I worry that this may be the next avenue.

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 20:08

EveSix · 10/07/2025 20:03

My transnephew alternates a stick and a wheelchair for this reason. Chronic pain and inflammation since cross-sex hormones.

That’s so sad that people are prepared to physically harm themselves like this.

EveSix · 10/07/2025 20:03

TimeForTeaAndToast · 08/07/2025 20:14

Isn't it caused by women taking testosterone? It's really bad for their bones?

My transnephew alternates a stick and a wheelchair for this reason. Chronic pain and inflammation since cross-sex hormones.

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 20:00

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 19:59

I don't want to sound too much like Bobby Kennedy, because he's a bit of a crazy man...

But I think someone needs to be asking questions about chronic illness. And there's such a taboo around vaccines, and at least as big a taboo about asking where the current explosion of allergies has come from, or whether underdiagnosed conditions can become overdiagnosed...

I feel that something has gone badly wrong somewhere, and we can't figure out what it is.

It's more fun to imply everyone's just making it up though I guess.

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 19:59

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 19:52

Dd thinks the same. She’s had clots in her lungs which first occurred a few weeks after the vaccine. No risk factors at all and was 21yo. But again it’s something you don’t like talking about because it makes you sound like a crazy conspiracy theorist 😆

I don't want to sound too much like Bobby Kennedy, because he's a bit of a crazy man...

But I think someone needs to be asking questions about chronic illness. And there's such a taboo around vaccines, and at least as big a taboo about asking where the current explosion of allergies has come from, or whether underdiagnosed conditions can become overdiagnosed...

I feel that something has gone badly wrong somewhere, and we can't figure out what it is.

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 19:55

BettyBooper · 10/07/2025 19:25

@MoominUnderWater Wow that's a lot. I hope you get more answers 💐

Thank you. I’m beginning to wonder if it’s in our tap water. One of the cats has a rare autoimmune disease too. 😮🙈. She actually has the same autoimmune illness as dh which is bonkers as it’s meant to be a 2 in a million illness for people. Not sure if it’s more common in cats than that but the vet said it was not common for cats. They’re both on the same steroids!

maybe i should dye the cat blue! Though actually shes a pedigree and her papers say shes lilac 🤣🤣🤣

ModerateOrGoodOccasionallyPoor · 10/07/2025 19:53

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 17:37

We all know about things like PIP assessments, but in important ways disability provision relies on the honour system. I sometimes use the disabled loo if my mobility is particularly bad, but usually I don't because, if I don't absolutely need it, I want to leave it free for someone who needs it more than me.

And the girls I'm thinking of aren't necessarily pretending to be disabled in a cynical way. They're often sad, anxious, alienated, spending too much time online, ruminating on their worries, looking for labels for their alienation, because if you can label it, maybe you can control it. And if loneliness is a problem, they can bond with others who've labelled their situation the same way.

You know how, when we were kids, music was often a way of overcoming alienation? In different ways, of course. I remember the difference between those kids who were into REM and those who were into Kiss. Michael Stipe spoke to sensitive, often gay kids and said "you may feel alone now, but it's all part of growing up and it will get better." Paul Stanley spoke to weird misfit kids and said "don't listen to anyone who says you're unpopular, you're part of the millions strong Kiss Army and that makes you part of a bigger crowd than they can imagine."

In retrospect that's very benign considering some of the ways alienated kids can connect.

And we also know there are sometimes psychosomatic elements to chronic illness.

The Reddit thread I linked upthread is really interesting because it was made 3 years ago in a smallish trans community that's set up to facilitate difficult conversations, and tries to avoid the dogpiling of the big trans subreddits. There's one long post by a disabled poster that's worth reading in full: Bizarre uptick of queer people using canes? : r/honesttransgender

Couple of outtakes:
Probably the biggest group I met was people claiming to have symptoms like vague chronic pain with no diagnosis. Chronic pain is a legitimate reason to use a mobility aid, but ideally you’d get evaluated first. I mean use a mobility aid when you need it, but see a doc to be sure you’re getting an appropriate aid and know how to use it. And get a diagnosis of some kind of actually permanent condition before identifying yourself as a disabled person and making yourself a local spokesperson for the disabled community. I never cared about people doing what they want for themselves, but I routinely got talked over about disability by people who have been using a cane for 2 months for a few hours per week for undiagnosed sore knees or whatever.
...
I met so many people claiming to have medical conditions that they clearly did not understand at all to a point that it could only be dishonesty. I met someone claiming to have spasticity (not a muscle spasm, actual neurological spasticity) while also claiming to have diminished reflexes, for example. No doctor would confuse this or allow a patient to misunderstand something that serious, and it’s very obvious even if you just google real quick. It just became very clear that there were people around me who did not have the disabilities they claimed to have and had no idea what it was actually like to live with such a disability.

And the girls I'm thinking of aren't necessarily pretending to be disabled in a cynical way. They're often sad, anxious, alienated, spending too much time online, ruminating on their worries, looking for labels for their alienation, because if you can label it, maybe you can control it. And if loneliness is a problem, they can bond with others who've labelled their situation the same way.

Another fantastic post and this paragraph above absolutely encapsulates perfectly what I believe we are looking at here.

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 19:52

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 19:40

I do think covid; the covid vaccination programme, and the lockdown have all contributed to an uptick in health, and mental health, related issues, most certainly. And considerable set-backs for certain demographics of young children.

I started to develop some heart related issues which I'm pretty convinced came about because of the vaccine. Nothing life threatening in my case, but persistent and worrysome nonetheless. The vaccine, and covid itself seems to have triggered a myriad of different complaints and conditions -maybe according to an individual's existing, under-lying weaknesses.

Edited

Dd thinks the same. She’s had clots in her lungs which first occurred a few weeks after the vaccine. No risk factors at all and was 21yo. But again it’s something you don’t like talking about because it makes you sound like a crazy conspiracy theorist 😆

ModerateOrGoodOccasionallyPoor · 10/07/2025 19:47

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 12:59

I hesitate to jump in here, because I know exactly how these threads always turn out, but...

I have chronic health issues that impair my mobility, and sometimes I use a stick. I prefer not to, because it's a faff, but I will if necessary.

And yes, I know from experience that invisible disabilities exist.

I don't take offence at this thread because I know it's not about me.

But it's also difficult to not notice the trend. And I'm very cautious about speculating what's causing the trend. We know from trans/NB identification among girls that there's a high prevalence of autism and also a lot of girls who "identify as" vaguely neurodiverse. There's no clean and easy way of sorting them out.

And similarly, spend much time listening to girls in that identity group and you'll notice they're always complaining about how exhausted they are. I'm not saying they're all spoonies by any means; it's possible quite a few have fucked up their endocrine systems with cross-sex hormones; but there's a definite overlap with spoonie culture. It spreads in the same online spaces.

I'm not surprised that people with experience of disability and chronic illness, either themselves or others, are very sensitive to any implication that people are judging who is or isn't disabled. I understand that. Where I think it goes off track is people becoming irrationally furious at the suggestion that spoonies exist, when we know they do.

And this set of arguments:

  • It's something that was always there but young people are just more confident about expressing it, like lefthandedness.
  • All this stuff about social contagion and mental health comorbidities is just a dogwhistle that fails to conceal your hatey hate.
  • It's a tiny number and doesn't affect you anyway.
  • You're an ableist, you're bigoted and right wing and any genuine feminist would accept that these kids are exactly what they say they are.

Do you think this doesn't ring a bell? Do you think I don't know parents of trans-identified children who say exactly those things?

It's a trend. Lots of us have noticed it. There's maybe an interesting discussion to be had about why it's happening. That's very difficult to do if everything is framed as an attack on a vulnerable group.

What a bloody marvellous post. 👏👏👏

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 19:40

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 19:16

DD’s first auto immune condition (coeliac disease) we believe was triggered by shingles. Obviously she must always have had the gene for coeliac disease but it only seemed to turn on after shingles. But hard to say for sure to be honest as she was a bit randomly “pukey” before the shingles.

since then she’s collected a few more autoimmune illnesses but that’s not unusual, once you have one you tend to get others. They’re now beginning to think POTS is autoimmune and they know EDS is linked to autoimmune illnesses.

yes to it running in families. A sibling of mine has coeliac and Hashimotos. All of which are formally diagnosed with blood tests, etc.

My dad had GPA and Srogjens and the treatment for his GPA killed him in his 60s. His conditions also formally diagnosed.

DH is obviously not related to my family but is DD’s dad and he has bullous pemphigoid which is a rare autoimmune disease. Diagnosed by biopsy.

Don’t think my siblings, my dads or dh’s were triggered by anything. My sibling and dad were pre covid.

dh was after covid times but he’s never had a noticeable bout of covid. However there’s a lot of evidence that there’s been a big increase in autoimmune diseases including diabetes since covid became a thing. Maybe this is what’s making younger people sicker?

For Dh’s illness I read some research which seemed to suggest the increase in numbers of people with BP was more linked to the vaccine rather than covid itself so God knows.

I do think covid; the covid vaccination programme, and the lockdown have all contributed to an uptick in health, and mental health, related issues, most certainly. And considerable set-backs for certain demographics of young children.

I started to develop some heart related issues which I'm pretty convinced came about because of the vaccine. Nothing life threatening in my case, but persistent and worrysome nonetheless. The vaccine, and covid itself seems to have triggered a myriad of different complaints and conditions -maybe according to an individual's existing, under-lying weaknesses.

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 19:40

And it's not that I have had people in real life doubt the veracity of my condition, but it's most odd to share you have a health condition (and give quite a lot of detail about the mechanics of it) and then he asked if you have been formally diagnosed. If someone says they've broken their leg do you ask to see the X ray?

While I was waiting for diagnosis I described it as "I might have Myasthenia". Indeed while I was waiting to find out if it was the generic or autoimmune variant I even said that.

Just curious what it is about invisible disabilities that makes people think that is a reasonable question to ask Smile

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 19:37

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 19:32

Look! You seem incredibly touchy.....so let's just leave it there.

Maybe you've had experience with people doubting the veracity of your condition, I don't know. But why involve yourself in a discussion if you are not open or prepared to share some of your story? That is generally the way it goes on this forum. Nobody expects people just to accept everything they say without any explanation, qualification, or exposition of the reasons and ways we have arrived at where we are.

Edited

Not touchy at all. Just genuinely curious. I would love to know your thought process. I'd explained in quite some detail in my previous post what happens to me if I exert myself. So I can understand wanting to know the condition, in fact I am always happy to talk about it as I am keen to raise awareness (it is definitely underdiagnosed due to lack of awareness) ...but I dont understand the follow up question about whether I have been formally diagnosed? So I am curious where you were coming from.

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 19:32

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 19:15

Yes, but if someone says they have cancer (for instance) it wouldn't cross my mind to ask if they have been "formally diagnosed".

Look! You seem incredibly touchy.....so let's just leave it there.

Maybe you've had experience with people doubting the veracity of your condition, I don't know. But why involve yourself in a discussion if you are not open or prepared to share some of your story? That is generally the way it goes on this forum. Nobody expects people just to accept everything they say without any explanation, qualification, or exposition of the reasons and ways we have arrived at where we are.

BettyBooper · 10/07/2025 19:25

@MoominUnderWater Wow that's a lot. I hope you get more answers 💐

MoominUnderWater · 10/07/2025 19:16

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 16:44

An auto-immune condition.

Out of interest was it triggered by anything in particular.....by covid or similar, for example? Have you always lived with it?

DD’s first auto immune condition (coeliac disease) we believe was triggered by shingles. Obviously she must always have had the gene for coeliac disease but it only seemed to turn on after shingles. But hard to say for sure to be honest as she was a bit randomly “pukey” before the shingles.

since then she’s collected a few more autoimmune illnesses but that’s not unusual, once you have one you tend to get others. They’re now beginning to think POTS is autoimmune and they know EDS is linked to autoimmune illnesses.

yes to it running in families. A sibling of mine has coeliac and Hashimotos. All of which are formally diagnosed with blood tests, etc.

My dad had GPA and Srogjens and the treatment for his GPA killed him in his 60s. His conditions also formally diagnosed.

DH is obviously not related to my family but is DD’s dad and he has bullous pemphigoid which is a rare autoimmune disease. Diagnosed by biopsy.

Don’t think my siblings, my dads or dh’s were triggered by anything. My sibling and dad were pre covid.

dh was after covid times but he’s never had a noticeable bout of covid. However there’s a lot of evidence that there’s been a big increase in autoimmune diseases including diabetes since covid became a thing. Maybe this is what’s making younger people sicker?

For Dh’s illness I read some research which seemed to suggest the increase in numbers of people with BP was more linked to the vaccine rather than covid itself so God knows.

CassandraWebb · 10/07/2025 19:15

Shortshriftandlethal · 10/07/2025 16:49

Because we're having a conversation/discussion and you have mentioned that you have a health condition. I tend to be interested in lots of things, especially if we're talking about them.

Yes, but if someone says they have cancer (for instance) it wouldn't cross my mind to ask if they have been "formally diagnosed".

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 17:41

TLDR: It's kind of the old "dad's been reading the medical dictionary again" problem, but with the added drama of young women.

SionnachRuadh · 10/07/2025 17:37

We all know about things like PIP assessments, but in important ways disability provision relies on the honour system. I sometimes use the disabled loo if my mobility is particularly bad, but usually I don't because, if I don't absolutely need it, I want to leave it free for someone who needs it more than me.

And the girls I'm thinking of aren't necessarily pretending to be disabled in a cynical way. They're often sad, anxious, alienated, spending too much time online, ruminating on their worries, looking for labels for their alienation, because if you can label it, maybe you can control it. And if loneliness is a problem, they can bond with others who've labelled their situation the same way.

You know how, when we were kids, music was often a way of overcoming alienation? In different ways, of course. I remember the difference between those kids who were into REM and those who were into Kiss. Michael Stipe spoke to sensitive, often gay kids and said "you may feel alone now, but it's all part of growing up and it will get better." Paul Stanley spoke to weird misfit kids and said "don't listen to anyone who says you're unpopular, you're part of the millions strong Kiss Army and that makes you part of a bigger crowd than they can imagine."

In retrospect that's very benign considering some of the ways alienated kids can connect.

And we also know there are sometimes psychosomatic elements to chronic illness.

The Reddit thread I linked upthread is really interesting because it was made 3 years ago in a smallish trans community that's set up to facilitate difficult conversations, and tries to avoid the dogpiling of the big trans subreddits. There's one long post by a disabled poster that's worth reading in full: Bizarre uptick of queer people using canes? : r/honesttransgender

Couple of outtakes:
Probably the biggest group I met was people claiming to have symptoms like vague chronic pain with no diagnosis. Chronic pain is a legitimate reason to use a mobility aid, but ideally you’d get evaluated first. I mean use a mobility aid when you need it, but see a doc to be sure you’re getting an appropriate aid and know how to use it. And get a diagnosis of some kind of actually permanent condition before identifying yourself as a disabled person and making yourself a local spokesperson for the disabled community. I never cared about people doing what they want for themselves, but I routinely got talked over about disability by people who have been using a cane for 2 months for a few hours per week for undiagnosed sore knees or whatever.
...
I met so many people claiming to have medical conditions that they clearly did not understand at all to a point that it could only be dishonesty. I met someone claiming to have spasticity (not a muscle spasm, actual neurological spasticity) while also claiming to have diminished reflexes, for example. No doctor would confuse this or allow a patient to misunderstand something that serious, and it’s very obvious even if you just google real quick. It just became very clear that there were people around me who did not have the disabilities they claimed to have and had no idea what it was actually like to live with such a disability.

SidewaysOtter · 10/07/2025 17:03

But I am entitled to call out anyone who claims you can look at someone and "know" whether or not they are disabled.

But that isn't what this discussion is about, and I doubt very much that there's anyone on this thread that isn't aware that some disabilities can be invisible.

What people are talking about is people - generic "people", not "that specific person that I saw the other day who didn't outwardly look disabled" - who are appropriating disability as some kind of identity when they are not actually disabled at all.

That it happens doesn't mean anyone can tell by looking who they are, just that we acknowledge that it happens.

fireplaceember · 10/07/2025 17:03

It’s when people are hurtful and question it that’s the worst
I had posted on a thread on here and mentioned an allergy to exercise/heat got “bollocks, any excuse just to be fat”
like.. sure I inject a biologic and under dermatology for it but I’m just making it up!