Law changes to strengthen women's rights by rewriting the Equality Act on the basis of biological sex instead of gender identity might not take place until next summer

Oh dear. So the person who will manage this project doesn't exist.

Very good. A wilful running down of the clock. Of course this is a massive priority...

Rubbish. Can kicking. And deliberate. It could be December by the time this person even starts, and then there is only six months useful legislative time left assuming that the actual solution is agreed which it won't be since every department has to sign off on this.

Maybe Labour will bother with it.

Oh that's easy. The police look at the photo and may decide that the person should be the subject of further investigation. That investigation may involve establishing the natal sex of the person being investigated.

I mean if I make a specific claim yes I’m happy to be specific about what I’m claiming…

Like you always do?

As pp said there isn’t actually legal recourse if someone uses the incorrect loo anyway

But vast majority of us know societal rules and follow them

We need to update the law so everyone is aware females do get single sex spaces and have the right to due to privacy and dignity plus safeguarding

Perhaps you could give us an example?

And after you’ve encouraged people to start taking photos of others in changing rooms and toilets, how do you plan on proving that they are not the ‘right sec’ for the facility they are in?

You may need to look harder.

Using powers conferred in the Equality Act itself?

The only secondary legislation I’ve found that amends the Equality Act have been enacted under the European Communities Act 1972, which would not be available for these purposes (not least that it is repealed).

That’d do it!

No one asked women about all this. I’m with you just give us single sex spaces back

Both sections 207 and 208 govern …a power…under this Act’

That means that the powers are contained elsewhere in the Act.

Second, neither section actually specifies the purpose of a power. When a power to make secondary legislation is provided, it is done so for a specific purpose.

So neither section actually confers a power on ministers. The powers are conferred by different sections - I’m just asking which specific power you think could be used for these purposes?

There have been 20 SIs used to amend the EA so far.

They are the powers. Please explain why you think that they aren't?

Agree 💯

I think that we should go all in.

1. Any facility that might be a single sex facility must be labelled as either Male, Female or unisex with penalties for failure to accurately label the facility.

2. Amend the Sexual Offences Act 2003 to make entering a single sex facility reserved for the opposite sex, irrespective of any gender reassignment protected characteristic, an offence similar to indecent exposure. Then we could act the same way as we do when we encounter a flasher - photograph them and call the police.

I have now completely run out of fucks.

Neither of those sections are powers in themselves. They set out how powers in the Act are to be used.

Can you say which specific power you think could be used to amend the provisions in respect of sex discrimination?

If you can't see any Equality Act power that would allow the amendment of primary legislation then you must have missed Part 16 paragraphs 207 and 208.

On one level there shouldn't even be a need to discuss whether single sex provision is still needed. Common sense and accepted practice knows that it is.

I agree but we are no where near that.

So I can’t see it happening in any way other than explicitly through the law

At this point I’d be happy with the updated expectation

We don’t even have that

Venues refuse single sex gatherings - see Brighton thread

Change the law so we have single sex back and it is known by everyone

Even if some gigs have a free for all or whatever if you take gender ID out of the equation the vast majority use the correct male / female area just by societal rules

But even in a venue, how would it be enforced?

The vast majority of scenarios that come in for complaint here are not settings where ID is required to be produced or checked (prisons and hospital admissions, admittedly, are the exceptions).

@EasternStandard it’s hard to see how Parliament could legislate to actually enforce use of the sex-correct toilet. The reality is there are a lot of venues where the loos are a bit of a free-for-all, I’m sure we’ve all been to gigs and clubs where women go into the mens as the queues are shorter (or for other reasons!) I’m not sure how enforcement would work.

I was thinking more of a venue fine when writing that but if we have male / female and mixed and the law says biological sex for first two at least we’d set out what is expected

Just on the question of SIs, as I understand it Sex Matters propose using s23 GRA powers rather than any power under the Equality Act to amend the Equality Act.

I can’t see any Equality Act power that would allow the amendment of primary legislation.

‘Enforce somehow’ covers a pretty big hole though.

When you encounter someone in the women’s bathroom that you believe to be a trans woman, how on earth do you propose verifying whether she is trans or not?

@IwantToRetire They may say all those things but that’s not our reality

We are arguing for privacy and dignity and safeguarding

Ok thanks for HSE guidelines @MelodiousThunk

Men and women spaces where possible, but currently no law to say who uses what

So now men feel they should have access to female spaces what next in the law?

To get privacy and dignity etc surely we need to legislate for actual separation by sex