Should Uterus Transplantation for Transwomen and Transmen Be Subsidized?

HootyMcBooby76
Does anyone ever feel that the human race has collectively lost it's mind?

I hear people say how shocked they are that women are so hated; but for me the biggest shock is how many people don't have an internalised identity or set of rules, and can be persuaded to think that what everyone else does must be the right thing to do.

https://twitter.com/GrahameParkGirl/status/1694636521494659429?s=19

Link to the lovely video of the tw who wants a womb transplant just to get pregnant and have an abortion.

Correction accepted graciously.

Bit scared at the thought of a Very Hungry Human Caterpillar.

Funny how being a transman doesn't change your female status of service-person to males.

Isn't it. Perhaps some of these male people could reciprocally volunteer their penises for a penis transplant to "trans men".

Does anyone ever feel that the human race has collectively lost it's mind?
I mean actually, some people are certifiably insane. The fact that some of them are doctors, is mind boggling.

It would be an implant not a transplant.

But then in this day and age, transplants ARE plants, so who even knows!

Funny how being a transman doesn't change your female status of service-person to males.

The history of this type of surgery needs to be looked at in context, and the context is notone of kind-hearted, empathic surgeons who devoted their lives to their patients' welfare.

It's disturbing how this moves on. Breast implants (see how no-one has trouble recognising the difference between a transplant and implant in this context) have a repulsive history. This includes implants as augmentation to Japanese comfort women who are better understood as sex slaves: allegedly European and other men were more accustomed to larger bosoms than were typical for Japanese women.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4865102-a-history-of-breast-implants-warning-disturbing-content

The history of this type of surgery needs to be looked at in context, and the context is not one of kind-hearted, empathic surgeons who devoted their lives to their patients' welfare.

Could surgeons who went on to investigate how long it took prisoners to freeze to death, ever have centred patients? Or perhaps did they always see human beings as their toys to play with?

One of the surgeons that operated on that transwoman went on to work at a concentration camp, where he performed grotesque experiments on prisoners, including Jewish women.
https://twitter.com/TwisterFilm/status/1408150587175227396

I’m going to be radical here and say that uterus transplants should not be available to anyone. There should be more done to support adoption.

They say that they need "as much donor vagina as possible:

To overcome this anatomical hindrance in M2F transgender women, a utero‐vaginal transplant could be performed, utilising as much donor vagina as possible, en‐bloc with the uterus (Figure
(Figure1).._
11). This would be achievable using a similar technique to that employed at radical hysterectomy, with preservation of the vaginal branches of the uterine vessels. This would necessitate retrieval from deceased donors, excluding female living donors. An alternative donor pool may be female to male (F2M) transgender men undergoing hysterectomy and vaginectomy, although the increased radicality of the hysterectomy may not be acceptable. However, recent evolution of the surgical technique, following cases in China20 and Dallas,21_ has potentially significantly reduced donor risk. The modified technique utilises venous drainage of the graft via the ovarian or utero‐ovarian veins, as opposed to the unpredictable and tortuous uterine venous plexus which leads to the internal iliac veins. This negates the need for the complex and time‐consuming ureteric dissection away from the uterine veins, reducing surgical risk. Moreover, it reduces operative times from 12 hours to 4–5 hours, which in turn decreases potential venous thromboembolism (VTE) risk. This dissection also favours minimally invasive retrieval techniques, which should enhance recovery and reduce potential morbidity further. As most F2M transgender men will also undergo bilateral oophorectomy, whereas the ovaries it would not be transplanted, it would allow the retrieval of elongated ovarian vascular pedicles to facilitate the implantation.

Quite. And I think that population would be especially vulnerable to that.

F2M transgender men may offer an alternative donor pool should they accept the increased risk compared with standard hysterectomy.
IDK what the rules are around transplant donation, but I don't think anyone should guilt trip people into doing something that is medically against their best interests.

It's worth reading the whole paper. Apparently periods are intrinsically female. How terfy!

Not only is withdrawal bleeding an important sign of graft function, but it is intrinsically part of being female and therefore contributes to gender identity, which may have psychological benefits.

If transmen are seeking hysterectomies as part of their transition do they become a source of live donors? A lot are young and healthy women, so potentially good donors.

It's been suggested. Transgender Males as Potential Donors for Uterus Transplantation: A Survey

And also in the Imperial College paper from the surgeons who carried out this first female womb transplant (my bold):

Despite a number of anatomical, hormonal, fertility, and obstetric considerations that require consideration, there is no overwhelming clinical argument against performing UTx as part of GRS. However, the increased radicality associated with the retrieval operation, including a longer vaginal cuff and more extensive ligamentous dissection, potentially necessitates the use of deceased donors. Alternatively, F2M transgender men may offer an alternative donor pool should they accept the increased risk compared with standard hysterectomy. Prior to undertaking UTx in transgender women, further research should be undertaken including cadaveric retrieval and implantations to assess the feasibility of the anatomical considerations discussed herein.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6492192/

@HeedlessAndUnbridledConcupiscence thanks for the quote - makes me go cold.

@DaphneDeloresMoreheadRidesOn sadly many women of 35 with 2 children are refused hysterectomies but 18+ year old transmen are being given them.

The NHS is truly captured hence the concerns about transwomen.

If transmen are seeking hysterectomies as part of their transition do they become a source of live donors? A lot are young and healthy women, so potentially good donors.

It's been suggested. Transgender Males as Potential Donors for Uterus Transplantation: A Survey

The use of live donors enables extensive pre-transplantation evaluation and planning. Living donors have mainly been relatives of the recipients, often their mothers, and so had emotional and genetic relationships with them [7]. However, experience shows that potential related donors have a 75% risk of not fulfilling current inclusion criteria [8]. An alternative to directed living donation is altruistic, non-directed donation. It is currently offered by two teams [9,10].
Uterus donation by patients with a normal uterus requiring hysterectomy could also be performed. Furthermore, the surgical operation would not be carried out for the sole purpose of a uterine transplantation. Such is the case for transgender males who decide to have a hysterectomy as part of their gender-affirming surgery.

Carbonnel M, Karpel L, Corruble N, Legendri S, Pencole L, Cordier B, Racowsky C, Ayoubi JM. Transgender Males as Potential Donors for Uterus Transplantation: A Survey. J Clin Med. 2022 Oct 14;11(20):6081. doi: 10.3390/jcm11206081. PMID: 36294400; PMCID: PMC9605112.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9605112/

I very much appreciate this post because it has my favourite director in it but the nerd in me has to correct your Caterpillar to Centipede.

(Although a body horror about multiple people stitched together and munching their way through a week’s worth of apples, oranges, salami and chocolate cake could be a goer!)

There has been a uterus transplant to a trans woman. It was in 1931, she died not long after though.

There is a very important aspect of this that I don't think has been covered (apologies if I missed it) and that is the health of the sister who donated her womb.

As understanding has improved, it has become clear that wombs are important to the female body even in a woman who has been through the menopause.

"Research in recent years has begun to challenge the notion that the uterus is a dormant, useless organ in older females, instead playing an important role in healthy bodily and cognitive function via direct connections between the uterus and the brain through the body’s autonomic nervous system. The system is responsible for unconscious functions, such as breathing or digestion, and now it seems that these loosely understood links between uterus and brain may have a significant impact on how females age."

https://www.betteraging.com/aging-science/does-a-hysterectomy-or-oophorectomy-increase-the-likelihood-of-dementia/

I do wonder what is going to happen in the future to the cohort of female people with trans identities that have had a 'gender affirming hysterectomy' especially if they have the oophorectomy too.

We really need to increase people's understanding of biology and how the body works. These organs do not function in isolation to the rest of the body.

I find it very bizarre that, if a 24 year old went to the GP and asked to be sterilised because she didn't want any children, it is likely that they would refuse it.
If said she wanted to to be a man they would happily comply and remove the lot.

I know there are two threads from different perspectives running so I may have missed if someone has already posted this.

If transmen are seeking hysterectomies as part of their transition do they become a source of live donors? A lot are young and healthy women, so potentially good donors. Obviously they couldn’t have taken puberty blockers etc.

We could end up in a mad situation where a 20 year old donates her womb. It’s implanted in another woman and as per guidance removed after 5 years. However at age 23 the donor wants her womb back so there are court cases seeking to have their own womb re implanted.