If you're non-binary...

That you have to worry about such things is ample evidence of the craziness of gender identity and ideology, isn't it?

That you have to continually check your speech and your thought patterns, and to police your own instinctive responses

Everyone laughs and jokes when people they know come out with ridiculous propositions - even if not to their face. Even you, I'm sure. That is what irony and humour are based upon. The foibles of human nature and comedic situations.

This.

All that aside I'm blaming you lot entirely as I just had an online meeting with several people and needed to direct my question to two ladies who didnt have their name on screen m, then worried myself about whether I could refer to them as ladies and ended up just vaguely pointing.

That being said, I'm taking that as a point because if I've had known their pronouns I wouldnt have had to do that 🤣

No, I suggested that consideration is hardly just for them.

The real issue is the growing occurence of people, and young people especially, unable to cope with life and who are suffering with their mental health. What lies at the root of this crisis and how do ee best go about finding solutions for it which enable people to develop emotional resillience and healthy self identities.

Encouraging and nurturing young people to believe in illusory states that require conntinual validation should they fall apart is not good practice.

https://post-trans.com

You said that some people pupils need have special consideration. Yes, they do. But not for pronouns and the like.

If I was 14 yes but as an adult I wouldnt encourage it.

@Ereshkigalangcleg the phrase, I forget exactly about trans not being able to be questioned. There would be no place for that.

.. whata that got to do with anything?

Not at all! It is mst often the most intelligent and mentally stable pupils who catch on to the ludicrousness of it all - and see it for what it is ( in most cases attention seeking - for whatever reason that may be). My 16 year old niece is a wonderful girl. They go along with it in a way - because that is the social expectation - but they are not buying it at all

Everyone laughs and jokes when people they know come out with ridiculous propositions - even if not to their face. Even you, I'm sure. That is what irony and humour are based upon. The foibles of human nature and comedic situations.

In that sense, it reminds me of puberty blockers, of the idea that by avoiding puberty children can avoid their sex.

Which ignores the fact that missing puberty ALSO has implications and consequences.

Given that nonbinary can apparently mean anything at all, is indefinable and inexplicable, I think it's a kind of apophatic belief.

It's considered a safe choice. I'm not choosing to be female, but I'm not changing sex, so I'm in this 'agnostic' space here, free of sex, beyond sex. The Switzerland of Gender.

It is a sanitised, unrealistic, and idealistic idea, that we can opt out of our sex. And what is missed is that a neutral position is ALSO a position. We cannot escape our mortal existence (except by the obvious) and we cannot escape our sex.

Perhaps just classic avoidance. Instead of confronting the implications of living in a sexed body in a sexist world, we attempt to just opt out.

If you had a truly open classroom discussion - without any compulsions and with the protection of free thought and speech you might not approve of what many puils would actually say and think on this issue.

If you had a classmate ( a 14 girl) who came back to school after the summer holidays and decided that she is now NB and wants to be called 'Gizmo' wouldn't you laugh ( even discreetly?). Lots of pupils would and do.

I agree that Queer Theory is so often ignored yet it really has shaped so much of what is now considered acceptable in schools and in the way that children think about themselves and others.

And listening to detransitioners is really important too, imo. Because they tell us honestly and clearly what were the influences that had the most impact on them.

The solutions are deeply embedded in culture and in education. That Queer Theory has been so successfully inserted into the way that young people are now encouraged to frame their developing self is a real problem - with no short term or easy solutions.

Have you ever listened to any detransitioners speaking about how they first came across trans or NB identities and how thought " Yes, that's me"?

If I believed in this stuff I would definitely "qualify" as NB, and I know how I'd explain it. But I don't, and I'm not so I won't.

This!

I think I would definitely qualify as non binary according to the definitions that I have heard from non binary people. But I’m secure in myself as a person and happy to be a non conforming female, if other people have stereotypical expectations of me that’s their issue.

....and if a pupil has sadly lost a parent or close relation the class will most likley be informed and everyone will be aware.

They're influenced by prejudice views of their elders though.

Are they? How would you know? I thought you were a fan of lived experience, they, like me, probably see the attention seeking in it.

Pupils with an obvious physical disability, or who have a health condition such as diabetes obviously have to be given certain specific additional considerations. Pupils with additional learning needs most often have a classroom assistant if they have a statement) or else they go to a specific unit within the school when necessary.

If any teacher said that theyd he sacked.

If they said what?

They're influenced by prejudice views of their elders though.
I'd be horrified if my child was mocking and laughing about pupils in their class for any reason.

If any teacher said that theyd he sacked.

They don't laugh in people's faces - that would just be rude, and in most cicumstances uncalled for - but they do eye rolls and smirk and laugh in private. But that is, indeed, how they view it. There is a younger generation coming up and through who are tiring of the whole thing. Why should some pupils be given 'over and above' treatment to all the others - especially when that person is still just a girl or boy in their class, like every other?

I dont think they dont take the piss, nor do I think it's more awful.

Whar I think is that a good discussion should be encouraged in a safe space for the children.

Adults have dignity at work. 2e shouldn't be letting teenagers mock each other in a classroom.