Starmer Radio 5 "A woman is an Adult female"

No sorry, too late. I don’t believe a single thing he says, he’s noted he might need to flip flop to save his own arse, that’s all. Which doesn’t mean I have written off the Labour Party, just not with him in charge.

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I agree we need to find out exactly what each and every word means, as the term 'safe spaces' is dubious, and suspicious. And the lack of opening out into the Cass report disappointing and also suspicious.

Still at least the lack of shrieks of bigots is enabling the shedding of so much more light on the sorry mess they've got us into.

I'll bet you anything you like Stonewall have been handed much soothing rhetoric about 'we have to lie and say nasty things to the nasty bastards until we get elected, but don't worry, it's only a means to an end. As soon as we get into power we'll do what we promised you and what you funded us to do '

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What's that Yorkshire phrase: 'he can make his mouth say anything, that one'.

I wonder what he'll define women as tomorrow.

What a lot of back-peddling going on...there is a lot more ground for them to back-pedal over, but it is positive that this might (hopefully) allow some of the debate to actually happen out in the open.

Small victories...I understand the lack of trust and cynical responses, but I don't think we should underestimate the knock on effects that this could have. This is just another small chip out of the Stonewall but these small chips add up.

So did Rishi Sunak flounder at this simple definition. Do you disbelieve him now he's changed his mind?

Labour is now in the same position as the Conservatives. Both have their TRAs and MRAs, both have leaders who now know what a woman is and have said so. Both were talking about introducing self-id and have now ruled it out.

The LibDems and the Greens are yet to step up - and their GC members are still fighting hard.

This ideology runs through Labour like words through a stick of rock. It’s so entrenched. You’ve only got to look at the unions to understand this. Some carefully chosen words at the top does nothing to dispel the institutional misogyny at ground roots level.

I still think that he told Ian from Stonewall to go on and defend his position to the media and by royally fucking that up and creating the shitshow last week he has had to admit he cannot defend the indefensible and here we are.

'I cannot in any way trust anything that Starmer says on this issue.'

I feel exactly the same. I want to vote Labour but just don't trust them an inch

He's never asked why he supports children being told their bodies are flawed and that drugs and surgery can fix them? Does he agree with Cass & what's the party position on the experimental medical treatment of children with mental health problems that they've been advocating for so long?

Come on journalists - make him lay it all out.

We need to think why stepping from law into politics is such a natural transition. What do both sectors do exceptionally well?

Yes they're clearly trying to work out some sort of weasaly phrasing that will make women who don't look too closely think they're back on side and will generate some huff and puff from the trans lobbies but won't really materially change anything for them - hoping to get votes from both.

It's weaslly and, imo, ultimately doomed to failure as it will never be enough for either side now that the TRAs and the creepy men in women's toilets and changing rooms have forced it all to be so polarised. No feminist or even a woman with young daughters can vote for Labour after what they've been complicit in over the last decade.

The "safe spaces" business feels like a way of limiting the discussion to prisons and rape crisis/DA shelters. Those are important but that's not all of. There's toilets, changing rooms, the freedom to assemble as a women's only group.

The most famous women's only group has been captured. And this went under the radar but look who their new Chair is:

www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/news/our-new-chair-harriet-harman

Behind the scenes, it's all presumably being worked out. Who they'll consult with, what views are acceptable.

Don't fall for it. Carefully chosen weasal word to try and play both parts of the electorate. Biological females and the trans lobby. He's a lawyer. Look at how carefully and consistently he uses the wors 'reflect' and 'safe spaces' not single sex spaces. India Willoughby claims that toilets and prisons are already safe spaces for women like you, me and them, IW is a biological make who claims to have a cervix remember.

Heaven forbid!

Slippery sod was my first thought. He knows he has to say it to try abd win back a swathe of voters whose only alternative was the Tories. I don’t believe him for a second.

Sorry - not in the Guardian, in the Daily Mail (which is why I didn't foist a link on you all.)

I don’t trust him either. Who knows what he’d do once Labour got in?

We shouldn’t have to choose between public services and women’s rights. We really shouldn’t.

Where can we read the detail of Labour's new policies on updating the GRA? I have just read James Esses' article in the Grauniad and this bit is worrying.

"At first glance, you could be fooled into thinking that Labour's U-turn was a positive intervention — a triumph for feminists who have long pointed out the obvious dangers that self-ID poses to women-only spaces such as prisons and rape centres, and indeed to women's sport.
But dig beneath the surface, and it's clear that the Labour party will still push a regressive and divisive ideology should it ever win power ...
Dodds plans to abolish the current system, under which a panel of independent doctors decides on whether or not to award a 'Gender Recognition Certificate' (GRC) to someone with gender dysphoria. Crucially, under these rules, the applicant does not know the identity of the doctors, which allows them to make their decision fairly and in private.
Under Labour, a single doctor chosen by the applicant, and a registrar instead of a panel, could award the certificate.
This gives all the power to the person who wants a GRC.
It also means an applicant could simply attend one of Britain's many private gender clinics (often run by self-professed trans activists) and pay a few hundred pounds to receive a diagnosis, possibly even after a single telephone conversation."

And of course they mean to do away with the misnamed spousal veto - which should be called the spousal escape clause.

I think he is right to say this is a cynical political ploy because they saw how things went down in Scotland. I don't trust them reverse ferret again on virtually everything if they get into power.

"A woman is an adult female, let's clear that one up" is hilarious. This is the question that Starmer and his fellow shadow cabinet members have flailed and floundered over for the past three years. Now he's pretending that it's all pretty simple, actually.

Bingo, you fell for it! What he left out was the fact that he thinks that anyone who says they're female is female. It's just more weasel words.

This is the long-term destruction these Men's Rights Activists have caused. No one can simply use the word 'woman' any more: they have to qualify how they define a woman or female.

We need to push back against 'safe spaces' at every turn, it's just more linguistic deceit .. single sex spaces.