Rise of Moms for Liberty in the USA

MfL is very much a USA phenomenon where the driver is: they are our kids not the governments, and reflects the huge suspicion of the government which is much more an element of the US psyche, which we don't have.

Home schooling in the USA has increased an insane amount over the past 20years. There is a significant number of people in the USA that don't trust schools or the government, particularly with their kids.

I think the lockdowns accelerated this movement, vaccine mandates, CRT, and the Trans issue have all combined to motivate these parents to want to take control back.

I can't see the same thing happening here. We don't have the same shared philosophy to drive it and feel uncomfortable with the religious, nationalist and libertarian language and drivers.

I think we're likely instead to try to tackle each issue individually.

It's a shame as I think there are many parents in the UK who share their concerns but who don't have a shared language or philosophy to unite them.

Is it a political party like KJK is setting up? Or a pressure group?

it looks like they have managed to organise anyway, presumably by working together and not squabbling like the current factions in Uk feminism?

I have two children in special education. I am very, very aware that a polite chat has about a 10% chance of getting me a thing.

I reiterate, however, that a book ban remains unnecessary. There is, in fact, quite a lot of territory between a nice cup of tea and a national campaign.

right now, in my very school district, there are parents pushing to take off books mentioning LGBTQ people. (I would like to note, here, that there is a strict list teachers have to use, only 1 book mentions trans people at all, and the motivation is that the parents believe that having their kids taught about gay people violates their religious rights.) You could, in fact, call it a campaign. But it is focused on one specific issue.

When you delve into the history of Moms for Liberty, and how it intersects with a very long history of the American right and its views of "parental rights," you get a very different picture. And as a Jew, I'm not all too fond of a group that seems to not be sure if I should be included in "Americans".

Whilst I don't agree with many of their aims, what I find interesting were the same tactics and insults being used to shut them down, as we see over here - GCs get reported for hate crimes, they got reported for domestic terrorism.

Going back to the OP and the point of the thread I read this article the other day and think it is relevant. It is absurd in the extreme but it really brings home the the techniques used to undermine women who attempt to organise politically by accusing them of being Nazi or KKK aligned.

Mumsnet and Women's Hour even get a mention.

https://libcom.org/article/fascism-and-womens-cause-gender-critical-feminism-suffragettes-and-womens-kkk

But if I saw something like that I'm perfectly capable of taking it up with the school without starting a campaign for book bans.

And when they ignore you? You wouldn't dream of teaming up with other parents to publicise what was happening?

You seem to have some sort of assumption of privilege - that obviously the school would listen to well-founded concerns raised politely over a cup of coffee.

So of course there would never be any need to start anything as gauche as a campaign.

It appears from that thread that if it did happen it was in England. It's daft. But if I saw something like that I'm perfectly capable of taking it up with the school without starting a campaign for book bans.

I have three children (two now really as oldest just graduated) in a large, liberal school district. I have never seen anything remotely like that. I want sources that this actually happened and where and when. Because anyone can post anything on Twitter.

and yes: people have been caught faking examples of things being taught at school.

Meanwhile you're focusing on the Hitler quote, and not addressing anything else M4L stands for.

You brought up the Hitler quote to undermine what MfL stand for 😂

Here is a good example of the type of thing that parents are concerned about. I'm am always confused by the argument that if politically right parents complain and campaign about stuff like this it causes a problem for those on the left or that those on the political right are using this type of thing as a wedge issue or to stoke a culture war. Is is not possible that these mums just don't want their children to be politically indoctrinated in schools? On race, on gender, on religion?

https://twitter.com/Urqhuart6/status/1679914168634179665

Faux indignation? Really?

meanwhile you're focusing on the Hitler quote, and not addressing anything else M4L stands for. it's almost like you want to defend this group because you align in one small point. Here's my philosophy: there is a fundamental, unbridgeable gap between my views and M4L's. I cannot separate their views on gender from their homophobia and their racism. (And no, having a nonwhite board member is not an all purpose shield against racism, any more than women can't ever be sexist.)

M4L didn't get started because of gender ideology. The impetus was COVID. It then sucked up every right wing talking point in its wake.

So now we're also defending using Hitler quotes if we agree with the reason?

Um, yes?

Or are you going to argue we shouldn't teach about the Second World War and fascism?

"You can teach about Hitler, but never show anything the Nazis actually said or did." Great plan.

How does this tally with your faux indignation about "complaining that teaching about Ruby Bridges shouldn't happen because it makes white children feel bad"?

It's almost as if you don't have a coherent philosophy and are just throwing stuff out there.

Re: The Hitler Quote

The original pages of the newsletter, which were posted on the group's Facebook page Wednesday night, showed below The Parent Brigade's masthead a quote Hitler used at a Nazi rally in 1935: "He alone, who OWNS the youth, GAINS the future."

Late Wednesday night, after IndyStar initially published this story, the front page of the newsletter was updated to include what was described as "context" for the Hitler quote.

"The quote from a horrific leader should put parents on alert," the update says. "If the government has control over our children today, they control our country's future. We The People must be vigilant and protect children from an overreaching government."
https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2023/06/21/moms-for-liberty-hamilton-county-indiana-quotes-hitler-in-newsletter/70344659007/

It was a mistake to use a quote from Hitler, obviously.

But what was the context?

The context was not that MoL follow Hitler. It was the opposite.

The context was that TRAs and some left wing Liberals follow Hitler in their authoritarian methods.

The first version of the newsletter included the quote, “He alone, who OWNS the youth, GAINS the future,” and cited Hitler. While the origin of the quote is not entirely clear, it has been attributed in numerous historical texts to a 1935 rally speech by the Nazi leader.

Isn't this just a version of Aristotle's “Give me a child until he is 7 and I will show you the man.”? It's an age old concept. Authoritarian governments on the political Right AND Left are known to to use education as a way to control the thinking of the next generation. There is a legitimate debate to be had around education and how much power and control you give to the state in relation to the education (or indoctrination) of your children. Genderists are all over twitter / tiktok beside themselves with glee that they can use their access to other people's children to disseminate ideas around gender ideology.

I don't know anything about them or their views, but I feel compelled to point something out to those saying that their being right wing makes it harder to get through to lefties...

You can be the most die hard lefty in the entire solar system and as soon as you say the mildest GC thing e.g., 'maybe we shouldn't cut teen girls' tits off because they're struggling with puberty' or 'perhaps we shouldn't allow 15 stone, 6ft 3 men in women's sports or rapists in women's prisons' you are deemed no longer of the left. You are now of the right and you are the enemy.

I'm not sure what the answer is but if you're waiting for someone left wing enough for those lefty Americans, you're in for a long wait.

Tldr: no one is left wing enough to get the message through to "left wing" zealots

AP has some pertinent info.

keep in mind that the chapter apologised... and then it got defended at the M4L conference.

https://apnews.com/article/moms-for-liberty-adolf-hitler-newsletter-quote-bcce698e901b9e782970030ccd710512#

I mean it really depends what the quote was and how it was used doesn’t it? Context is everything. MRAs were recently ecstatic when a woman at a LWS event used the concept of “the big lie” (a term coined by hitler and used in Mein Kampf) and applied it to trans ideology. This woman was clearly not Nazi adjacent. This is a term / concept that is in common usage by people across the political spectrum.

Wrong quote. Just adding pertinent information.

Just adding pertinent information.

my position is that I think the trans issue is simply another tack to blend into their right wing views. If you're asking why they're successful, it's because they've woven gender issues (which for them isn't just trans, but all LGBT, and feminism too) and racial issues into an entire world view. That's how they sold people on all of it. I don't support it because I am in the USA, I am watching when the Moms for Liberty people get elected to school boards, and i'm seeing what they are doing and the effect they are having on education.

So now we're also defending using Hitler quotes if we agree with the reason? It was inflammatory. And then someone got up on stage at the conference and said she stood with that person. It's really not very difficult to not quote Hitler.

The kind of men who vehemently oppose many feminists/feminist groups probably agree with a lot of these women’s points. That probably helps them a great deal

She used the Hitler quote to warn about what transactivists were doing.

Then, if you don't believe that everyone who shares one view with these people is vile, what is the point of raising an issue that isn't relevant to the majority of posters on this site? Most people here aren't American and the assumptions underpinning anything in America aren't particularly relevant, except to bring out the old "look who you're agreeing with! Change your views or be among the worst people!".

@DifficultBloodyWoman

But politics are tactics are entwined. Organisations which shut down debate with extremist ideology are to be wary of not applauded. One stated aim is to remove information on sexuality from school libraries, that includes all novels including a gay character. They want teachers to be forced to hide their sexuality if gay and I've even state one of their spokespeople say that don't think gay people should be teachers. Don't be fooled this is about gender neutral bathrooms. I don't think you will get anyone in the U.K. or Europe disagreeing that the USA is wrong on woke ideology in some cases etc why are they allowing surgery on under 18's??? But this group are about far more. Schools don't do surgery...

@StephanieSuperpowers no [yawn] obviously not. But I can choose who I associate with and this bunch of extremists are basing their view of trans people on foundations I profoundly disagree with. I believe in children's rights and parental responsibilities, not 'parents rights' as this group see it. I also know that my son would be regarded as Jewish and therefore somehow lesser by this lot (even though ironically he wouldn't be Jewish enough for most other purposes). They're vile. That doesn't mean people who agree with them on one publicised statement are vile.