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Original poster

Michigan criminalises midge seeing with five years in jail or 10k fine

53 replies

Jongleterre · 05/07/2023 15:16

thenationalpulse.com/2023/07/03/michigan-criminalizes-misgendering-with-5-years-in-jail-or-10k-fine/

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mach2 · 08/07/2023 05:19

This is the bill:
^legiscan.com/MI/text/HB4474/2023^

But I can't see anything in that about pronouns, so the media may be putting their own spin on what constitutes intimidation.

Yes, the offences are:

<span class="italic">(a) Uses force or violence on another individual.</span>

(b) Causes bodily injury to another individual.
(c) Intimidates another individual.
(d) Damages, destroys, or defaces any real, personal, digital, or online property of another individual without the consent of that individual.
(e) Threatens, by word or act, to do any of the actions described under subdivisions (a) to (d).

At a stretch it could come under "intimidates" if part of intimidating behaviour.

Michigan HB4474 | 2023-2024 | 102nd Legislature

Bill Text (2023-06-21) Crime victims: other; elements for commission of a hate crime; create. Amends sec. 147b of 1931 PA 328 (MCL 750.147b). [Referred To Committee On Civil Rights, Judiciary, And Public Safety]

https://legiscan.com/MI/text/HB4474/2023

Croneofakind · 07/07/2023 06:31

I'll stick with seeing midges if its all the same to you. Best Mumsnet typo I've seen!

Boiledbeetle · 07/07/2023 00:01

.

Despicable Me Lol GIF
IcakethereforeIam · 06/07/2023 23:52

I thought of a solution. It's crazy but it just might work....

Michigan criminalises midge seeing with five years in jail or 10k fine
Delphinium20 · 06/07/2023 23:35

If ONLY we could incarcerate the midges! Our short summers would be much more pleasant.

LostMySocks · 06/07/2023 23:32

I guess they'll have jail's full of primary school kids. My nearly 10year old misgenders me at least once a week.

literalviolence · 06/07/2023 23:31

I do hope that calling someone 'cis' will be seen as the misgendering that it is and that everyone who does that is thrown in jail. Might get a bit crowded.

LonginesPrime · 06/07/2023 23:10

BabyStopCryin · 05/07/2023 15:33

How on earth did we get to the point when calling a man a man gets you more jail time than bashing someone over the head with a brick and stealing their wallet?

So this law could actually increase violence against trans people, if criminals opt for the crime carrying the lesser sentence...

Boiledbeetle · 06/07/2023 23:07

ArabeIIaScott · 06/07/2023 22:55

I was really impressed by your big gaps.

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As was i as whenever i try to actually do big big gaps mumsnet seems to tidy it up for me and reduces them when i press post.

Boiledbeetle · 06/07/2023 23:05

JanesLittleGirl · 06/07/2023 22:31

Please tell me that it helped you to make sense of my 'joke'?

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😁 yes it did totally! 😁

ArabeIIaScott · 06/07/2023 22:55

AmbleInAnnBoleyn · 05/07/2023 16:08

OMG stooooopid samsung putting huge gaps in. Aaaaarg.

I was really impressed by your big gaps.

JanesLittleGirl · 06/07/2023 22:31

Boiledbeetle · 06/07/2023 12:15

I was just admitting my appalling English language skills 😀 I had to go look up the meaning of the words!😁

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Please tell me that it helped you to make sense of my 'joke'?

OldCrone · 06/07/2023 12:47

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 05/07/2023 15:48

Bill HB 4474 – passed in the Michigan House on June 20 – could make it a felony to intentionally “intimidate” someone for, among other things, using the wrong pronouns.

The way I'm reading this is that it's a felony to intentionally intimidate someone who has misgendered you - not, as they presumably intend, a felony to deliberately misgender.

Surely they mean BY, among other things, using the wrong pronouns?

Yes, they do mean 'by using the wrong pronouns' not 'for using the wrong pronouns'.

This is the bill:
https://legiscan.com/MI/text/HB4474/2023

But I can't see anything in that about pronouns, so the media may be putting their own spin on what constitutes intimidation.

lechiffre55 · 06/07/2023 12:19

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 05/07/2023 15:48

Bill HB 4474 – passed in the Michigan House on June 20 – could make it a felony to intentionally “intimidate” someone for, among other things, using the wrong pronouns.

The way I'm reading this is that it's a felony to intentionally intimidate someone who has misgendered you - not, as they presumably intend, a felony to deliberately misgender.

Surely they mean BY, among other things, using the wrong pronouns?

This was exactly my interpretation of what was written too.

Like the Starbucks barrrista who went off on that woman for misgendering. He could be facing jail time if she felt threatened and intimidated.

Boiledbeetle · 06/07/2023 12:15

JanesLittleGirl · 06/07/2023 11:27

Sorry Beetle. It was a weak joke about Latin grammar.

I was just admitting my appalling English language skills 😀 I had to go look up the meaning of the words!😁

WickedSerious · 06/07/2023 12:13

BabyStopCryin · 05/07/2023 15:33

How on earth did we get to the point when calling a man a man gets you more jail time than bashing someone over the head with a brick and stealing their wallet?

What a time to be alive eh?

JanesLittleGirl · 06/07/2023 11:27

Sorry Beetle. It was a weak joke about Latin grammar.

Boiledbeetle · 06/07/2023 00:13

AutumnCrow · 06/07/2023 00:05

As any fule kno

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Your post makes more sense than Janes to be honest! But then I was thrown out of English language and literature before my exams!

AutumnCrow · 06/07/2023 00:05

JanesLittleGirl · 05/07/2023 21:15

Surely confusing the dative and ablative would be a schoolperson error.

As any fule kno

IcakethereforeIam · 05/07/2023 23:56

Just been reminded from another thread, Michigan was where Michfest was held.

JanesLittleGirl · 05/07/2023 21:15

Surely confusing the dative and ablative would be a schoolperson error.

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 05/07/2023 20:14

Helleofabore · 05/07/2023 20:05

Well, that bears looking into further! That would set a very different precedent!

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Indeed. 'I'm going to intimidate you BY misgendering' is very different from 'I'm going to intimidate you FOR misgendering.'

Slightly embarrassing if legislation says the opposite of what is intended.

Helleofabore · 05/07/2023 20:05

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 05/07/2023 15:48

Bill HB 4474 – passed in the Michigan House on June 20 – could make it a felony to intentionally “intimidate” someone for, among other things, using the wrong pronouns.

The way I'm reading this is that it's a felony to intentionally intimidate someone who has misgendered you - not, as they presumably intend, a felony to deliberately misgender.

Surely they mean BY, among other things, using the wrong pronouns?

Well, that bears looking into further! That would set a very different precedent!

MichelleScarn · 05/07/2023 19:54

Boiledbeetle · 05/07/2023 16:06

https://www.electricscotland.com/poetry/henderson/singalong/wav/104%20The%20Midges.wav

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Shades of my childhood! 😆

Original poster
Jongleterre · 05/07/2023 19:50

Sorry!

Michigan criminalises midge seeing with five years in jail or 10k fine
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