Did anyone see the ITV News piece about of water bills on customers?

Two threads (one I started) have been zapped about this biological male role-playing breastfeeding a baby. What is happening behind the scenes on Mumsnet where this topic cannot be discussed as a separate thread?

It's actually very alarming that an issue with multiple safeguarding concerns around a small baby cannot be permitted it's own topic.

I can't think of many fathers disregarding their infant's welfare either.

"I don't know any woman that would disregard their infant's wellbeing so callously"

You wouldn't think so, but a few of them even came on to the other thread (now zapped) to say they would be happy with this.

Such is the "be kind" mind set of 2023.

It may actually be harmful to a baby to be fed secretions from a man just because of the man's level of natural hormones too. Babies aren't evolved to be fed by men.

Ignoring evolution and the material reality of biology like this won't end well.

ALL drugs are contraindicated in breastfeeding unless there are sufficient safety data and / or a really compelling reason why it's in the infant's best interests to consume breastmilk that could contain those drugs. Even some antibiotics which are used in newborns are contraindicated for breastfeeding. The default position is precautionary because we're talking about newborn health.

So massive doses of cross sex hormones on which there are no safety data at all are definitely not ok. And there is no compelling reason which is in the child's best interests for a man to breastfeed.

None. There is absolutely no reason for a man to breastfeed which is in the child's best interest.

I don't know any woman that would disregard their infant's wellbeing so callously. It's so bloody MALE. Not all men etc obviously, but ANY MAN trying to breastfeed is definitely showing pretty toxic male entitled and selfish behaviour and putting their wellbeing above that of the child.

Imagine being a child at say 14, 18, 20 finding out your father tried to breastfeed you for his own selfish reasons? Talk about needing therapy for life.

Too many babies without their mums...

there's something really sad about that...

And with a breast fed baby, a male parent having their nice experience interferes with the mother's time and feeding which will mess up her milk supply and threaten feeding happening productively at all

I thought, or rather suspected, that this is a baby via surrogate who already has no contact with its mother. I dont thinks this is about a transwoman in a relationship with a woman who have given birth, who is saying they are co-mothering.

Although do realise this is heavily influenced by the ITV news editor being open about his same sex marriage and getting a baby via a surrogate. For all we know he too has experienced breast feeding.

Again so non essential to be included in the screen visuals as for most mothers the issue is the costs of keeping children clean, warm and well fed.

Are Mika’s partner and the baby’s mother the same person?

It's there over and over again. In sharing a toilet with women with their knickers down, in using a changing room with women getting naked, in shoving wet tampons up bottoms, in using women's lingerie to wank and then putting it out on the shelf and watching to see a woman touch it....

It's a MAJOR part of all of this. Women are being involved and lied to that no no no no no, mustn't deprive men of lovely experiences because they don't want to be walking sex toys and don't be mean. Now babies are being involved.

I cannot bear to read the article again but there is an account of one of these TW "feeding" their baby and they are very transparent about how "erotic" the feeling was - I'm surprised the TRA camp let it go out to be honest, it did not reflect well on them at ALL. I'm sure someone here remembers it and can link it.
There was a lot of sexual imagery and talk of stimulation and euphoria.

Put it this way, it was clearly written by someone other than a real nursing mother.

If I'd said to you 10 years ago...7 even...5 years...that today elites would allow men into women's sport, their safe spaces, obscure trans IDs of kids from their parents, use words like non-men and cervix haver...and now try and pull off man as female woman mum...you would have bet your house this was impossible.

Well, what are we talking about here?...

And with a breast fed baby, a male parent having their nice experience interferes with the mother's time and feeding which will mess up her milk supply and threaten feeding happening productively at all.

But they can't.

Men's bodies cannot generate enough milk, even on medication, to feed a baby. What they can do is have a bit of an experience with a baby.

It will be argued it's all about bonding etc, but I suspect it's a lot nicer for the male person involved than any other real consideration. In an awful lot of these MRA situations the elephant cantering around that we are not supposed to look at, never mind comment on, is what does 'nice' involve in the agendas of all male people doing these things, from peeing in women's toilets to feeding a baby. And to what extent is it ok to use non consenting women and children as props for their 'nice'.

What it is, though, is wilful boundary pushing - to see how far society will actually take this shit.

I just don't see why anyone would believe this bit of roleplaying from this person. I had two very very difficult starts to breastfeeding with each of my babies. I obviously had a female body in the right state for producing the necessary hormonal and physical responses, but had to work like a maniac to move through the stages of producing a supply whilst my babies were unable to feed in SCBU and then when trying to persuade them to latch and to feed. It was hard hard work, I was expressing or feeding pretty much constantly. At no point did I, nor my partner, nor any HCP we were dealing with, suggest that the baby's father give it a go. We supplemented with formula whilst we had to. Obviously.

From my own experiences of the dynamics of breastfeeding, I just don't believe these stories. It's make believe, pretending, fantasy behaviour and it is most certainly not child-centred in any way.

"99.9% of women who breastfeed are of course biological women, but there ate a very small number of...blah blah yada yada"

This is the question for Labour ‐ can men breastfeed a baby?

This is the endgame I fear, to ravage sex based rights.

I understand women who have adopted babies or had babies by surrogate are also using domperidone to stimulate lactation ( in the U.S), even though they have not been through a pregnancy and a birth.

At some point, it will dawn on Stella Creasey that the conditions are being set up for someone to turn around to her and say: "you don't need any reasonable adjustments made for you because you are a nursing mother. Your partner can breast-feed your babies for you instead."

Dont know if I say the name of at least two drs who probably will
Adrian harrop and Helen webberley.

Might now be deleted.

This is very slightly OT (my post isn't about the rights or wrongs of a man 'breastfeeding' a baby, I think that's pretty well covered here!) but I volunteer at an independent charity as a BF peer supporter. We are none of us medically trained and one of our basic tenets is that we never 'give advice', we make available information and treat our female clients as intelligent women who will then be able to make a more informed decision about their bodies and their babies.

We used to work under a private MW who was very experienced in infant feeding and she would regularly suggest that clients ask for a domperidone prescription from their GP. She made it clear that this was a drug used off-license as a galactagogue but that it was 'safe' for use. As non-medical peer supporters, we would not do this (the MW no longer works with our group) but I'm now a bit concerned, seeing the studies coming out of North America. However, I think that its use by a WOMAN, who is, after all, working with her biology rather than against it, for a short period of time in order to induce lactation, is extremely different to a MAN using it indefinitely to sustain milk production, alongside a whole raft of artificial hormones and other medications. I just wanted to say that I think its careful and considered, and medically-supervised use by a woman, is still very much practiced in the UK and that this is a very different scenario from a man using it and working against his biology to 'lactate'.

I'm documenting all the instances I come across if men claiming to be Mothers on this thread, happy for others to add as and when:

Trans Widows are the only mothers of our children. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4752371-trans-widows-are-the-only-mothers-of-our-children