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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Top finishers in Brooklyn half non-binary division all male

64 replies

Misstache · 21/05/2023 10:20

Surprise, surprise! The non-binary division offered equal prize money to the other categories. The men’s race was won in 1:03. Womens’ race won in 1:11. Non-binary top 3 men: 1:12:05, 1:17:56, 1:19:47. 1:12:05 would be 41st in the male division, 1:17:56 would be 182. Mediocre men now get the same money as elite women by calling themselves NB.

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ApocalipstickNow · 22/05/2023 21:53

JacquelinePot · 22/05/2023 07:53

Why aren't these men embarrassed?

To win in the NB category, and get a medal, when you're slower than dozens of men in the men's category... I just think any reasonable* person would be embarrassed.

*I think I've answered my own question, here

I think it’s a bit like in The Simpsons when Rainer Wolfcastle is asked how he sleeps at night and he replies “on a pile of money with many beautiful ladies” only without the beautiful ladies bit.

Slothtoes · 22/05/2023 21:29

I definitely noticed with the big mainstream media-covered events like the Brit Awards, that did get a lot of people peaking talking about the rights and wrongs of competitions dropping male/ female prize categories.

Chersfrozenface · 22/05/2023 10:45

Beowulfa · 22/05/2023 10:31

How can people not notice this massive giant piss-take?

One, they don't read media that carry these stories.

Or, two, they do notice it, and reach the mountain top.

Or three, they do notice it, but it means the "progressive" claptrap they've embraced has something seriously wrong with it, they can't cope with this and just ignore the piss-take,

Beowulfa · 22/05/2023 10:31

How can people not notice this massive giant piss-take?

SinnerBoy · 22/05/2023 08:23

It must me extra galling for the women who beat the NB "winners," but weren't in the top three of the women's race.

JacquelinePot · 22/05/2023 07:53

Why aren't these men embarrassed?

To win in the NB category, and get a medal, when you're slower than dozens of men in the men's category... I just think any reasonable* person would be embarrassed.

*I think I've answered my own question, here

Slothtoes · 22/05/2023 06:43

God, I didn’t clock that the men can ALSO race as women in the woman category . Oh for absolute fucks sake.
Every man’s a winner, baby

Redebs · 22/05/2023 00:48

ApocalipstickNow · 21/05/2023 13:25

I for one wish them luck against the cis cheetahs.

🤣🤣🤣

Redebs · 22/05/2023 00:35

Helleofabore · 21/05/2023 10:53

Do you understand that this means male athletes have TWO categories to win prize money?

These are literally mediocre males collecting prize money, but no female athlete will have equal opportunity in this category because the male athletes have physical advantages.

This is now discrimination of opportunity.

Don't they also let men run in the women's category if they've taken hormones for 12 months?

So that's 3 categories that men can compete in?

MrGHardy · 21/05/2023 23:38

Is it ok though? A male is ranked No. 41 of all males. Receives the same prize money as the male No. 1 and as the female No. 1.

All because, muh non-binary equality. In essence, that prize money going to this joke category (and yes, it is a joke category because 'gender identities' have no impact on sporting ability) was taken from the male and female category.

nepeta · 21/05/2023 19:37

marshmallowmatcha · 21/05/2023 10:29

Isn't this OK though? They aren't taking the women's spaces?

I don't think a nonbinary category works for those male runners who identify as women, because it doesn't provide validation of their identity.

As others have noted, categories based on inner abstract feelings don't make any sense, but of course what we really have are two categories based on average sex differences and then an additional category which is mixed sex but defines itself as consisting of those runners who are not two-dimensional sex stereotypes (Barbie dolls and G.I. Joes).

This is illogical, because two different definitions are mashed together. Either all categories are sex-based or all categories are based on some inner floating feelings of femininity or masculinity or not having either or having both etc. We are moving towards the latter way of defining things, which forces many of us to either transition or to accept retrogressive sexist views about men and women.

PuttingDownRoots · 21/05/2023 18:21

I would worry that they will use this as evidence that they could run in the female category as their times were slower.

EdithStourton · 21/05/2023 18:16

When did it become okay to be so dishonest? To deliberately race against women, knowing that because you are (however you sodding well identify) a natal male and thus likely to win?

I used to be quite optimistic for the human race, but these days I just want to move to a house at the end of a dead-end lane and shut the fucking gate.

turbonerd · 21/05/2023 17:06

«Chromosomes do not fit the binary and neither do athletes».
Says Jacob (they/them).

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 21/05/2023 16:30

https://www.instagram.com/p/CfUssV5FUKr/?hl=en

I think this is the best self posted picture of Jacob.

Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/p/CfUssV5FUKr/?hl=en

Delphinium20 · 21/05/2023 16:26

Misstache · 21/05/2023 15:59

15 women and 181 men ran faster than Jacob yet there he is on his Instagram flouncing around as a winner of the race. Infuriating.

Exactly. Jacob is just an all around douchebag.

TheBiologyStupid · 21/05/2023 16:22

Misstache · 21/05/2023 10:46

And it also reinforces the idea that sports divisions are about identity. When we accept the idea of a non-binary division we are accepting the idea that your personal identity is relevant to sports competition. We don’t have categories for “Asian women,” or “mothers” or “immigrant.” What’s relevant is your sex. These men can identify as NB and run with the men. Accepting this division is part of eroding sex-based sports by pretending your gender identity matters: it exists as a partner to pushing men into womens’ sports as well.

Absolutely!

Misstache · 21/05/2023 15:59

15 women and 181 men ran faster than Jacob yet there he is on his Instagram flouncing around as a winner of the race. Infuriating.

OP posts:
Beamur · 21/05/2023 14:26

Chersfrozenface · 21/05/2023 12:48

Sorry, meant to bold the quote in the first paragraph.

Yep. Agree but I was mostly being hopeful 😁
As a category, women's means little if it includes men because then the chaps would have 3 categories they could enter!

NecessaryScene · 21/05/2023 14:03

The fact that women will be disadvantaged is irrelevant.

Yeah, I think this is one of the ones that will fall out of fashion quite fast, because it's obviously unfair to other men.

(My favourite other example of this is those rowing rules that permit men to compete in the women's events, but not to take a woman's place in a mixed-sex event.)

MagpiePi · 21/05/2023 13:56

I expect that NB categories will only get dropped because men who entered as men will realise they are missing out on prize money and complain. Although it may go through a period where the NB men will then identify as women, so then there will be 3 lots of prize money being won by men.

The fact that women will be disadvantaged is irrelevant. 🙄

Shelefttheweb · 21/05/2023 13:44

marshmallowmatcha · 21/05/2023 10:29

Isn't this OK though? They aren't taking the women's spaces?

Three prize pools available to men and none for women should a man decide yo race due to the inherent male advantage? No it is not ok.

literalviolence · 21/05/2023 13:39

Helleofabore · 21/05/2023 11:10

I suspect you are right.

or. A female athlete will take them to court because there needs to be a NB male and NB female for the opportunities for NB female to win fairly.

It really is a discrimination case now. It needs to be tested. However the outcome is that there is double the opportunity for male athletes to win and win money!

I have no sympathy for the afab nbs. They bought into the idea that sport is about identity not body so can either live with the consequences or move to an actual scientific understanding - which would mean campaigning for sports segregated by biological sex and no other categories.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/05/2023 13:26
Grin
ApocalipstickNow · 21/05/2023 13:26

quiteathome · 21/05/2023 13:14

How long before a lot of men just go into the non binary category to get prize money. Therefore just filling it up for a while. Once they don't get any benefit it will probably just fizzle out

You mean that’s not already happening?