17yr old DD thinks she is trans - challenging behaviour

Never mind, MrHardy. She might learn something useful, if she keeps reading.

I was at the 'transgender people need validation of their gender, and gender is more important than sex' stage once. I changed my mind. Reality does that to quite a lot of people.

Changing username is almost pointless, unless she doesn't actually read the forum but just searches your username. Because this story is so detailed, if she comes across it she will know it's you writing it.

She’s a “they”? Ask her why the default human is male - which she’s basically admitting if she wants a double mastectomy. Follow this up by talking about equality for women. Mention some of the things from the past that might shock her, eg women being property, not being able to do certain things without a man, not being able to vote, etc, etc. Ask her (kindly) to explain her gender. She’ll no doubt struggle to avoid stereotypes.

At all times be kind and sympathetic, but through questioning gently prompt her to think.

Even if she seems resistant and defensive, gentle questions can plant seeds that grow.

Ask her how many transmen she knows with both of their nipples, who still have sensation, or who don't have dog ears-- when the remaining sides of the breasts taper off to the side like the corner of plastic sandwich bags.

Two things: Teenagers need to rebel at some point from their parents to differentiated themselves and it looks like this has not come up so far in your relationship.

I'm glad you are putting that money out of reach, but does she know how long it takes to get over a mastectomy? It takes a hell of a long time and is she expecting you to look after her?

I'm in a very similar position to you OP except my dd's diagnosed with autism and has an EHCP. Nothing has made any difference and I'm struggling to find anyone to take on counselling, let alone a GC one. I've told her no to hormones or surgery.

I agree with the previous comments about the online autism community. It often seems obsessed with gender identity, and a new term “ autgender “ has been created in reference to autism and gender identity.

Unfortunately you can’t move money out of a Junior ISA once it’s in there. The money is considered a gift to the child, only they can access it and only when they reach the age of 18.

Given the trans madness I would caution parents against putting money into Junior ISAs or Child Trust Funds as you have no control of when they receive the money or what it is spent on.

I think the only conversations i would be having with her is that "as i gave birth to a daughter i will continue to call her she or her and asking me to call her anything else would make me v v upset" and " where do you plan to live and how do you plan to finance your life after having top surgery" Then carry on with family life being very very nice and lovely.

pp have offered good advice but just to say it must be incredibly hard.

Removal of healthy parts of the body is difficult to hear as an option.

If you get a chance watch the interview Jordan Peterson and Chloe Cole . It’s very enlightening. Also I agree keep calm about everything and emphasise as an adult if she wants you to listen to her she must also listen to you and read literature and films from both sides .

With regards autism assessment- We’re just coming to the end of an assessment for autism for DS (10) and from what I’ve seen/read that is quite a standard process so may be by less influenced by the attitude of the people doing the assessments. A big chunk of it is the ADOS questionnaire which is structured to ask questions of the child in order to pick up features of ASD. So for example looks at social communication, sensory issues etc. The other parts of the assessment were a more general cognitive assessment so again structured. He was asked about similarities and differences between things (what is similar about a bee and a butterfly) and then a meeting with us to go through his developmental history and what he was like when smaller.

Obviously (thankfully) at 10 ds is largely unaware of the trans stuff going on and the assessment may be different in older teens but I think there is more structure to it than ‘open’ counselling type sessions talking about how you feel because the diagnosis depends on people having certain features across set domains so hopefully finding someone who doesn’t focus on trans but is purely looking at ASD will be straightforward for you.

Remain dead calm regarding the book. At the moment you are Satan so any ballistics on your part reinforces that narrative.

OP she's been brainwashed, and she needs to feel angry and aggrieved to keep that particular fire burning bright. Books like Irreversible Damage will majorly stoke the flames and make her feel like she's righteous and has the right to express anger at you. She'll be more fired up to act as well.

The only way to take away that fire is to give no resistance and just pretend you'll completely support her, then just don't talk about it. She wants to rage against the machine and the op is like the ultimate rage act - but you'll have taken that away by taking away your own resistance - it'll take some of the heat away and may make her probably just talk a mean game for a while, but not actually follow through.

And if she goes for that op, it's a consequences of actions situation, and she will have to learn to live with those consequences, if she goes through with it.

Trouble is @BoredOfThisMansWorld she'll be hearing about how life-saving the surgery will be and how hard it is for her and what a victim etc etc so rational sensible arguments are unlikely to land.

When I questioned puberty blockers effectively taking away a child's potential future sex life DD called me a weirdo and a pervert for talking about kids and sex.

If they are in the grip of the ideology it is hard to bring them around with logic.

She’s 17. The chances that she wants to hear anything about female sexual pleasure from her mum are slim.

Mums have sex to conceive their all important offspring, don’t you know, not to as people who have a pleasurable sex life.

A slight tangent but I’m impressed your local library has a copy of Irreversible Damage’?! Ours has got Trans by Helen Joyce and The Transgender Issue by S Faye but not Irreversible Damage.

I sympathise OP - would probably return the book to the same place in the pile and say nothing or, at the most, say please treat library books with respect as they don’t belong to us. But she’s probably actually nervous about how you’re going to react so keeping it calm as possible is probably the way to go.

I hope you’ve found some useful materials and support on this thread.

I think there's something in this.

I'd probably emphasise the sexual pleasure slightly over the future babies because many teen girls are adamant their future selves will NOT want babies (or become in any other way like their mum!).

I'd calmly drop a couple of facts in that she can sit with for a while. In relation to sexual function, you can add "I expect that's why most (over 95%?? ) transwomen keep their penises, so that they're able to enjoy full sexual function with whoever they choose to be with". Maybe check that she does know that females experience sexual pleasure too and it is very much not just PIV for the majority and obviously lesbians.

In relation to future babies, again "I expect that's why most transwomen keep their penises, so that they're able to have babies with the women or transmen they're partnered with". And that "more than 80% of humans do go on to have children and that of course includes trans people and gay people, as it should do".

Most teens have an acute sense of fairness and injustice. Unfortunately the modern trans movement thrives off obscuring the imbalance between the sexes, be it physical or structural, and many young people just don't have the facts. For example, many young people ( inc. me once upon a time) genuinely don't know that males are physically stronger than females and that it's not just about comparative heights.

Tbf I see your point. The trans lobby probably does target the most vulnerable in society.

Nothing to add to the wise advice you've had here, but you have my absolute sympathy. I don't really believe in evil, but this ideology comes pretty close.

Sorry, just RTFT. Glad you can keep the money out of her hands! Hopefully until this phase passes...

@CheekNerveGallAudacityandGumption with respect that is bollocks.

Huge numbers of kids in the care system are falling prey to this ideology and the NHS is recruiting doctors to perform the surgery!

Good luck OP. I'm glad you have had so much warm, calm advice from people further along that path.

Is there anything you can do to stop her getting access to that money when she turns 18?

It’s ironic that it’s her/your privilege that is leading her to potentially destroying her life.

If you were poor and didn’t have a pot to piss in I very much doubt she’d be concerning herself with “trans” issues.

I don’t know what the solution is though.