Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Ex prison officer guilty of possession of CSA images referred to Transgender Case Board

34 replies

ArabeIIaScott · 07/05/2023 09:53

'Tanya Howes, of Netherwood Green in Norwich, has pleaded guilty to three charges of possessing indecent photographs of a child and a separate charge of possessing 100 “grossly offensive” extreme pornographic images and videos.'

Tanya has not yet been sentenced.

'A probation officer told the court: “There needs more time for the report in order for it to be completed to fullness but also our policy dictates that a transgender board needs to be consulted in order for this person to then go on to be sentenced.'

'“It’s about our policy but also making sure the appropriate factors are identified given the nature of the case.”'

'A ban on trans women with male genitalia who are violent or sexual offenders serving sentences in female prisons came into force earlier this year.
Exemptions will only be made in the "most exceptional" cases and with the approval of ministers, the government said.'

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/23498059.norwich-trans-woman-indecent-images-children/

Reduxx found that this person used to be a prison officer.

https://reduxx.info/uk-trans-identified-man-pleads-guilty-to-possessing-pornographic-images-of-children/

Seriously hoping that the current ban will hold and no exemption made. There is no way this man should be in a woman's prison.

Trans woman admits possessing indecent images of children

Male-to-female transgender offender Tanya Howes - described as 'female' in court documents - was found with dozens of indecent child images and 100…

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/23498059.norwich-trans-woman-indecent-images-children

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page
ArabeIIaScott · 11/05/2023 09:40

mynameisnotkate · 11/05/2023 08:24

I find the focus on those with sex offence convictions - as if all other men are safe round women - a bit worrying. We know that the vast majority of sex offences do not lead to convictions, there’s just no way to tell who has committed a sex offence. Of course those with sex offence convictions must never be in the female estate, but I worry this leads to a false sense of confidence that other prisoners are safe.

Absolutely agree. It's the crudest of safeguards. If the prison service considered all prisoners equally, males would be excluded from women's prisons regardless of what they'd done, because of the impact on female prisoners.

OP posts:
ArabeIIaScott · 11/05/2023 09:39

Opplesandbononos · 09/05/2023 23:29

On this occasion the perpertrator no longer has a penis. Will this effect where they end up?

I think because the offences are sexual, this should mean they are still not allowed into the women's estate. Unless there are, to quote 'exceptional circumstances'. Not clear what those might be.

OP posts:
mynameisnotkate · 11/05/2023 08:24

I find the focus on those with sex offence convictions - as if all other men are safe round women - a bit worrying. We know that the vast majority of sex offences do not lead to convictions, there’s just no way to tell who has committed a sex offence. Of course those with sex offence convictions must never be in the female estate, but I worry this leads to a false sense of confidence that other prisoners are safe.

ChristinaXYZ · 10/05/2023 19:39

Just to add to the above - rememeber Lisa Nandy absolutely thinks Lexi Rose should be in the female estate. However bad the Tories are on this I just remind myself how much worse Labour (or worse still Labour in coallition with the Greens, LibDems or SNP!!) will be.

ChristinaXYZ · 10/05/2023 19:37

zibzibara · 07/05/2023 10:22

That they even have an 'exemptions' route for the purpose of housing men in women's prisons just shows the Tories have no intention of actually dealing with this problem. They just want to fob everyone off with rhetoric, hoping we don't look at the factual details.

To be fair - the change in the placing of trans prisoners has now started. From today's Telegraph. "Trans woman convicted of rape to be jailed in a male prison
Lexi-Rose Crawford, born a man called Dominic Risden, will serve a nine-year sentence at men’s jail following recent guidance from the MoJ"

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/05/10/transwoman-convicted-rape-jailed-male-prison/

Trans woman convicted of rape to be jailed in a male prison

Lexi-Rose Crawford, born a man called Dominic Risden, will serve a nine-year sentence at men’s jail following recent guidance from the MoJ

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/05/10/transwoman-convicted-rape-jailed-male-prison

Opplesandbononos · 09/05/2023 23:29

On this occasion the perpertrator no longer has a penis. Will this effect where they end up?

NicCageisnotNickCave · 07/05/2023 18:03

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:57

Don't get me started on why similar boards are not convened for other protected characteristics. I sat on a TG board at the same time that I was managing a physically disabled offender who was being held in a cell totally unsuitable for his needs. Noone convened a board for him.

Anyway....the board will be internal. It will include senior management from the prison, offender managers, probation, occasionally the police, and one or two specialist senior managers from the Prison Service, plus the prisoner. It is not a circus (though some prisoners try to make it so) and no outside agencies are involved, because its an internal Prison service decision.

This should be shocking but sadly, it’s the same story over and over again in all sorts of circumstances - only one of the 9 protected characteristics attracts all the special fuss.

Pleased to have you on FWR to answer some of our speculations!

Datun · 07/05/2023 13:04

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:57

Don't get me started on why similar boards are not convened for other protected characteristics. I sat on a TG board at the same time that I was managing a physically disabled offender who was being held in a cell totally unsuitable for his needs. Noone convened a board for him.

Anyway....the board will be internal. It will include senior management from the prison, offender managers, probation, occasionally the police, and one or two specialist senior managers from the Prison Service, plus the prisoner. It is not a circus (though some prisoners try to make it so) and no outside agencies are involved, because its an internal Prison service decision.

Thanks Pony How many of those people are there representing the interests of the female inmates? And of those, are they only connected to the actual prison?

Do you they have any outside representation?

ArabeIIaScott · 07/05/2023 11:40

Separate wing seems very sensible.

OP posts:
WomanIsEnough · 07/05/2023 11:36

I understand at least one of the male prisons on east coast is building a transgender wing to house them

MrsOvertonsWindow · 07/05/2023 11:30

Thank you PonyPatter44. That's a relief. Although, (as I'm cynical about all this) isn't it amazing how out of all the vulnerable groups in prison, only the male born sacred caste get their demands to access more victims even considered? 🙄

CatProcrastinator1 · 07/05/2023 11:22

Thank you PonyPatter44. Does the board sit before or after sentence?

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:57

MrsOvertonsWindow · 07/05/2023 10:36

Interested to hear about these boards PonyPatter44 if you don't mind?

Who sits on them? Is it all people with experience of managing offenders? Are there individuals representing trans groups / organisations?

Are there similar boards for vulnerable women prisoners - pregnant? mentally unwell? with serious illnesses? Thanks

Don't get me started on why similar boards are not convened for other protected characteristics. I sat on a TG board at the same time that I was managing a physically disabled offender who was being held in a cell totally unsuitable for his needs. Noone convened a board for him.

Anyway....the board will be internal. It will include senior management from the prison, offender managers, probation, occasionally the police, and one or two specialist senior managers from the Prison Service, plus the prisoner. It is not a circus (though some prisoners try to make it so) and no outside agencies are involved, because its an internal Prison service decision.

fairypeasant · 07/05/2023 10:45

Shocking re the community sentences when those men were jailed for the Viking or whatever coins.

I would imagine an exemption if the person transitioned pre-puberty, or had a chromosomal disorder, fully "presented as female" whatever that means, and only ever offended against men, and was thought to be no risk to women at all.

Datun · 07/05/2023 10:42

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:31

I've never sat on a board that agreed an exemption. All of them have involved sex offenders, and these were clearly people who had no business being in women's prisons. Not one of them "passed" as a woman either.

In my own experience, an exemption would, for example, cover someone who had transitioned before puberty but gone on to offend non-violently as an adult. The unicorn tax accountant, perhaps. I work in the men's estate but I would think that similar boards in the womens estate would be confirming that transmen should be housed in the women's estate and NOT go to the men's.

The thing is, the exemptions specifically mention sex offenders.

*A ban on trans women with male genitalia who are violent or sexual offenders serving sentences in female prisons came into force earlier this year.^
Exemptions will only be made in the "most exceptional" cases and with the approval of ministers, the government said.'

PinkFootstool · 07/05/2023 10:38

Tbh, the sad part is that with the number of images identified, prison may not even be a likely outcome. 85 images across A, B & C even with 100 extreme images - I've seen similar get community sentences, especially with a previous clean record.

It's unclear from the Reduxx article (which is beautifully researched,) whether the offences took place whilst employed as a PO, which could be an aggravating factor, but might not turn the tables.

It's certainly a quandry the probation officer wants help with for the pre-sentence report and understandably so!

MrsOvertonsWindow · 07/05/2023 10:36

Interested to hear about these boards PonyPatter44 if you don't mind?

Who sits on them? Is it all people with experience of managing offenders? Are there individuals representing trans groups / organisations?

Are there similar boards for vulnerable women prisoners - pregnant? mentally unwell? with serious illnesses? Thanks

ArabeIIaScott · 07/05/2023 10:34

an exemption would, for example, cover someone who had transitioned before puberty but gone on to offend non-violently as an adult.

But the exemption is specifically for sex-offenders, or those with penises, I thought?

OP posts:
LizzieSiddal · 07/05/2023 10:34

Very reassuring to here @PonyPatter44

Kendodd · 07/05/2023 10:33

I wonder where they worked as a prison officer?
And if as a transgender women prison officer they were responsible for strip searching women prisoners (does strip search actually happen anyway?)
Women prisoners would, I assume, have no rights at all to refuse being searched.

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:31

I've never sat on a board that agreed an exemption. All of them have involved sex offenders, and these were clearly people who had no business being in women's prisons. Not one of them "passed" as a woman either.

In my own experience, an exemption would, for example, cover someone who had transitioned before puberty but gone on to offend non-violently as an adult. The unicorn tax accountant, perhaps. I work in the men's estate but I would think that similar boards in the womens estate would be confirming that transmen should be housed in the women's estate and NOT go to the men's.

guinnessguzzler · 07/05/2023 10:27

And before the ban, what would have happened? Terrifying. How on earth did so many people get hoodwinked by this? It's so obvious to anyone with a bit of common sense!

ArabeIIaScott · 07/05/2023 10:25

zibzibara · 07/05/2023 10:22

That they even have an 'exemptions' route for the purpose of housing men in women's prisons just shows the Tories have no intention of actually dealing with this problem. They just want to fob everyone off with rhetoric, hoping we don't look at the factual details.

This is a very good point.

trans women with male genitalia who are violent or sexual offenders serving sentences in female prisons came into force earlier this year.
Exemptions will only be made in the "most exceptional" cases

So there is some conceivable reason that a violent sex offender could still be housed in the female estate. Be good to hear the rationale behind that.

OP posts:
ArabeIIaScott · 07/05/2023 10:24

PonyPatter44 · 07/05/2023 10:21

The board is really unlikely to agree that he goes to a womens prison. I have sat on TG boards, and they are not generally in favour of doing such things.

The best "Tanya" can hope for is being allowed to have his dresses while he is on a (male) VP unit somewhere. As an ex-officer, he will be on a VP unit anyway.

Thanks, that's good to hear. I had worried, given the delay in sentencing, that this suggested he might be being considered for the women's estate.

OP posts: