Sunak stands behind miriam cates and rosie Duffield and takes aim at starmer

Yes.

"I like that policy, but does it come in red? Or possibly green at a pinch?"

Soz, multiple cross post there - my reply was to Boots' post.

Although I might disagree with Starmers stance, at least he's telling us honestly what he thinks.
Disagree. I don't think he's being honest but I think he's too scared of his own party to say what he really thinks. To be absolutely fair, I think he has reason to be scared but, as he's party leader and as no-one forced him to take the job, I don't think that's any excuse. And of course they can change their position - if they can drop Clause 4, they can certainly drop this, although the nearer they get to an election, the worse it'll look.

So take that up with your own party - whoever they are. Ask them what the hell they're playing at leaving a wide open goal for the opposition to exploit. Absolutely pointless to complain that the opposition are taking advantage.

To be honest, it sounds like people are annoyed with Sunak because Starmer hasn't said the same. It's weird. Starmer is allowed to have his opinions and they're allowed to be different from Sunak's.
Although I might disagree with Starmers stance, at least he's telling us honestly what he thinks. He believes that men can become women and can therefore enter women's spaces. He's,said the LP are not going to change this. He's stated this on several occasions in various forms so even if it were politically expedient, he can't change his position because he'll just look shifty and untrustworthy. He knows that so he's sending out popular members like Cooper to lie and say he never said these things. Just generally spread confusion.

Me too.

No football game victory is ever decided on who 'deserved it most' or 'who had the hardest time' or 'who was kindest'.

The Tories have fallen for this for 13 years as every other organisation did. The capture was successful, and a future step any decent government should take is an inquiry into how, and how the safeguarding loopholes are closed, to prevent another political lobby infiltrating and taking over law and policy in the same way. This has to be the end of 'cosy cups of tea in back rooms' subverting transparency and democracy to make policy that would never get past the general public if not done through deceit and double dealing. This has to be the end of lobbies who are paid by government to lobby government with power and money that grassroots groups cannot compete with. This has to be the end of such ruddy awful, crass incapacity and public foolery such as MPs stood with stupid grins under banners about decapitating their voters. Grown up bloody government with some actual values and morals is seriously bloody needed.

But it's plain that if any other party was currently in power this would be embraced at full speed with no regard whatsoever for women, children, safeguarding, equality, diversity, justice, reality, objectivity, public duty of impartiality, that kind of basic stuff that qualifies you to run a country.

I don't think anyone here disagrees with what he said Flo. But they're just words from a man so divorced from reality that he's renamed us Unicorn Kingdom.

Once again, I can't see anyone on this thread disagreeing with what Sunak has actually said on this issue, just people who sound annoyed because a politician is doing what politicians have done since the dawn of time - probing and picking at the opposition's weak spot.

lt's like Arsenal complaining it's not fair if Man City take advantage of their title wobble.

Sort it out Labour you absolute fools.

I don't think anyone is claiming that the Tories are wonderful. They are responsible for everything that happens whilst in Power.

But at this moment in time given a choice between a party that refuses to get on board with the fact that men can't be women and still seems hell bent on destroying our rights OR a party that admits things have gone wrong and spells out what they intend to do about it to put things right I'm going to have to choose the lesser of two evils.

Am I happy about potentially having to vote conservative at the next election? No! But my displeasure at doing that is less than the disgust i would feel with myself if i voted Labour given their recent behaviour towards women.

At least with the Tories we are still free to speak the truth...

Not really. Conservative MPs have reported women to the police/employers for Tweeting JKR.

Nope, i care about the shite heaped on us for the last 13 years... you seem swayed by a few "sympathetic" words.

Its like living in a parallel universe, where the erosion of womens rights by the Tories which we "should" all be able to see, such as the Trans woman masturbating in a female loo or the Trans in womens prisons or the bedroom tax that made an escape room subject to a benefit cut (albeit reversed reluctantly) or the men in female sport hasn't happened under the Tories but it would under Labour.

None of this seems to matter so long as Sunak says he knows what a woman is and before him, Boris, my God what a champion of womens rights he fuckin was - not.

Just had Labour at the door so informed him I wanted to talk about the one thing Kier says isn't being talked about on the doorstep. The guy struggled to get a word in edgeways!

Basically he was in agreement with me but I told him I didn't care and until the top of Labour get their act together confirm that women are 100% biological women and that man have no rights to women only spaces, sort the likes of Arsehole who had a go at Miriam out and apologise to Rosie I'll be voting for someone else.

Such fun!

You have to wonder about the thought process don't you?

"But the person I know is nice! So give away all your stuff."

For your info, I've had very in depth conversations with a very close family member who is a trans adult and they are entirely selfish and think women should stop making a fuss. They are male and use female spaces. No surgery and definitely don't pass. They think this is their right just because they say so. No. Fuck off.

Yes i wonder how many on here have ever had an inter action with a trans women, let alone know one personally.

Why do people keep saying this. Do you really think we have never met a trans person and if we did it would suddenly be acceptable to give up our rights and protections in law?

For

For now yes. This is urgent. If we let this go then women’s rights and protections and safety go back a century. And it will be extremely difficult to reverse. So yes for now this is what I am going to vote to protect. Once this is secured via clarification of the Equality Act then I will go back to voting on other things.

So you think if we all just got to know a couple of trans women then we would feel ok about letting men cheat their mediocre arses to our sports prizes, enter our refuges where women go to escape men, happy to tell our kids they are born in the wrong body and cut off their healthy breasts, endanger vulnerable women in hospitals and care centres….

seriously ? You think that’s what this is all about. We’ve just got to meet a couple and then all is ok. We give away all this?

I'm a lesbian you could be Mohandas Gandhi and I don't want you in my female spaces.

This.

I couldn't care less how lovely some trans women are. You can't legislate to allow lovely harmless biological males with genuine gender dysphoria into women's spaces and retain the ability to keep other, less lovely and less harmless, biological males out.

It's an open door and a red carpet to any man who wants to access any women's space for any reason whatsoever.

I will NOT be voting Tory unless Sunak puts his money where his mouth is and actually takes action. If he does, then I probably will.

Labour lost me a long time ago. I won't be going back. I'm bloody furious with them for putting me and countless others in this position. I blame them entirely. I will never forgive.

Does it? I suppose I went through a period of being shocked.

Over the past few years I've come to think that Labour have misogyny baked in so hard it's possibly not redeemable.

I also see an increasing number of young women walking around with full facial hair.

I'm not sure where you live but men presenting as women are a frequent sight where I live.

It really does beggar belief that the Labour party's explicit policy is to make it so much easier for predatory men to do this. That's their policy.

And that secures another Tory vote. This issue is far too important to ignore.

Thanks, dimorphism. It's fine, it was a long time ago, and tbh I had very little idea what was going on. I just knew I needed to get out as quickly and quietly as I possibly could.