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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Has anyone else been forced to become Conservative after all of this?

357 replies

ponderingsoul · 22/04/2023 11:31

Probably the wrong wording, but I'm curious - after always considering myself fairly left wing/ liberal and generally voting Labour (or tactically Lib Dem when I was in the SW), I no longer really consider them a valid option for me because of their gender views/ inability to take a view.

Has this happened to anyone else? Never thought I'd be a Tory, but now feel like I have no choice as this issue is so important to me.

OP posts:
AGovernmentOfLawsAndNotMen · 05/05/2023 01:28

So MNs did you deface your Labour vote as some have said.
Note vote
Or go Tory for the same reason as OP concerns

dimorphism · 04/05/2023 13:21

macj1 · 04/05/2023 12:18

Agree - the major parties need to be sent a strong message by women voters - the Isla Bryson type of a message - you'll lose unless you support women and can tells us what a woman is.

Otherwise it's turkeys voting for Xmas....

Well done @macj1 for running, I hope you get elected.

This is why I'm voting Tory - I'd say for the first time in my life but actually that was last time, on this single issue.

Look at Afghanistan and Iran - women had much greater equality there and it's gone. Does anyone think they're going to reclaim their rights anytime soon and without many women and girls being killed? I don't.

Once women's rights are gone, we're stuffed. The economy can wait, my daughter's safety is paramount and I'm not convinced that any party that is so anti-science and anti-reality as to believe something as nonsensical as that humans can change sex is going to be any better on the economy. They'll just identify as having funded the NHS.

macj1 · 04/05/2023 12:18

Agree - the major parties need to be sent a strong message by women voters - the Isla Bryson type of a message - you'll lose unless you support women and can tells us what a woman is.

Otherwise it's turkeys voting for Xmas....

macj1 · 04/05/2023 12:15

Many thanks - it's my first time ever as a candidate - I only got here thanks to Kelly-J and the TRA's - it's galvanising us - so we can be thankful for that much, no matter what our political affiliation.

I've had the most wonderful support from a friend who is a Green Party Candidate - she's been suspended by her party for a year and generally tormented by the TRA's - she suggested I run in the first place!

TooBigForMyBoots · 04/05/2023 12:04

macj1 · 04/05/2023 11:35

Notice for any Labour/Lib Dem/Green supporters on this site: whilst out canvassing for a seat as a Conservative on my local council, I've had a wonderful reception, thanks ENTIRELY to the issue of the TRA issue. Any time I met a confirmed member of the above parties, or a disaffected Tory, I just said:

'I couldn't vote for a party that believes a woman can have a penis; that believes adult men should be in the showers with our 8 year old daughters at the local swimming pool and in our toilets; that Karen White, the rapist who attacked women whilst housed in a woman's prison, who has since had his penis inverted at our expense on the NHS, should be allowed to get a Gender Recognition Certificate on his release and then access women's single sex spaces.'

Mostly - I got laughs - shock - support - pledges to vote - I even got a Green canvasser to apologise for supporting the Greens who are captured by this ideology - NOBODY could argue back. At all.

I have had a fantastic campaign as a result - in the midst of this, the Male Cyclist stole the women's money in New Mexico and may enter the Olympics. It's the gift that keeps giving, politically, and the hill that the other parties will die on. An 80 year old who hated Boris and Rishi, who had a wife and daughters, immediately identified what a woman was - and pledged his enthusiastic support - he'd read about the theiving cyclist already.

Pass on the message to your politicians if you want your parties to get back into power.

Good luck macj1.☘️

I wished needmoresleep luck on a different thread.

AGovernmentOfLawsAndNotMen · 04/05/2023 11:57

I’m about to head out to vote.
Like you @AutumnCrow im really torn.
Do I vote for womens rights for a party I have never voted for
or do I go for my usual.
A MN post on renting with a piece on Labours proposed policies for rental properties ( I’m not a LL btw ) is swinging me towards theConservatives for the first time ever. I don’t want my kids homeless.

So at the moment

I might just put my cross in and run

AutumnCrow · 04/05/2023 11:51

I'm currently sitting here with my postal ballot paper still in front of me, vacillating. Do I spoil my ballot paper again, with a message about why, or vote for the least worst local candidate?

I'm aware of the sacrifices made so that I could have a vote.

But, OTOH, those sacrifices weren't made so that I'd feel compelled to collude in one of the greatest dangers women and children in this country have ever faced. The Parties named on the ballot have all let us down; and the Independent is a fool.

I think I'll write the message.

AGovernmentOfLawsAndNotMen · 04/05/2023 11:37

macj1 · 04/05/2023 11:35

Notice for any Labour/Lib Dem/Green supporters on this site: whilst out canvassing for a seat as a Conservative on my local council, I've had a wonderful reception, thanks ENTIRELY to the issue of the TRA issue. Any time I met a confirmed member of the above parties, or a disaffected Tory, I just said:

'I couldn't vote for a party that believes a woman can have a penis; that believes adult men should be in the showers with our 8 year old daughters at the local swimming pool and in our toilets; that Karen White, the rapist who attacked women whilst housed in a woman's prison, who has since had his penis inverted at our expense on the NHS, should be allowed to get a Gender Recognition Certificate on his release and then access women's single sex spaces.'

Mostly - I got laughs - shock - support - pledges to vote - I even got a Green canvasser to apologise for supporting the Greens who are captured by this ideology - NOBODY could argue back. At all.

I have had a fantastic campaign as a result - in the midst of this, the Male Cyclist stole the women's money in New Mexico and may enter the Olympics. It's the gift that keeps giving, politically, and the hill that the other parties will die on. An 80 year old who hated Boris and Rishi, who had a wife and daughters, immediately identified what a woman was - and pledged his enthusiastic support - he'd read about the theiving cyclist already.

Pass on the message to your politicians if you want your parties to get back into power.

I understand a lot of women voters are going to mess up their voting card though.
Effectively loosing their vote.
That doesn’t help anything….what are they doing…

macj1 · 04/05/2023 11:35

Notice for any Labour/Lib Dem/Green supporters on this site: whilst out canvassing for a seat as a Conservative on my local council, I've had a wonderful reception, thanks ENTIRELY to the issue of the TRA issue. Any time I met a confirmed member of the above parties, or a disaffected Tory, I just said:

'I couldn't vote for a party that believes a woman can have a penis; that believes adult men should be in the showers with our 8 year old daughters at the local swimming pool and in our toilets; that Karen White, the rapist who attacked women whilst housed in a woman's prison, who has since had his penis inverted at our expense on the NHS, should be allowed to get a Gender Recognition Certificate on his release and then access women's single sex spaces.'

Mostly - I got laughs - shock - support - pledges to vote - I even got a Green canvasser to apologise for supporting the Greens who are captured by this ideology - NOBODY could argue back. At all.

I have had a fantastic campaign as a result - in the midst of this, the Male Cyclist stole the women's money in New Mexico and may enter the Olympics. It's the gift that keeps giving, politically, and the hill that the other parties will die on. An 80 year old who hated Boris and Rishi, who had a wife and daughters, immediately identified what a woman was - and pledged his enthusiastic support - he'd read about the theiving cyclist already.

Pass on the message to your politicians if you want your parties to get back into power.

CliantheLang · 27/04/2023 18:14

blackpearwhitelilies · 25/04/2023 09:39

It will be interesting to see how the Tories vote on Labour’s proposals to clamp down on sexual harassment in the workplace.

Certainly it depends on how 'sexual harassment' is defined. For example, does the definition include using correct pronouns for everyone?

I mean, we've already seen what the left considers to be 'conversion therapy'; i.e. allowing confused children to access psychological help.

blackpearwhitelilies · 25/04/2023 09:39

It will be interesting to see how the Tories vote on Labour’s proposals to clamp down on sexual harassment in the workplace.

Redebs · 24/04/2023 16:53

ponderingsoul · 22/04/2023 11:31

Probably the wrong wording, but I'm curious - after always considering myself fairly left wing/ liberal and generally voting Labour (or tactically Lib Dem when I was in the SW), I no longer really consider them a valid option for me because of their gender views/ inability to take a view.

Has this happened to anyone else? Never thought I'd be a Tory, but now feel like I have no choice as this issue is so important to me.

Nothing in the world would make me vote Tory.
Might consider CP if there's a local candidate

blackpearwhitelilies · 24/04/2023 16:45

Well neither Corbyn nor Milliband would have channelled billions to suspect firms for PPE. By that measure alone the UK would have been significantly better off.

Laladybird · 24/04/2023 16:01

I don't agree with superlatives like 'destroyed'.

Women in Britain aren't treated like women in Afghanistan. This is still a G8 economy. More detail and context is needed for such assertions to carry any weight.

The Q is would Ed Milliband or Jeremy Corbyn have done any better with the same circumstances?

TooBigForMyBoots · 24/04/2023 10:27

Trusterfuck economics nearly bankrupted the UK.
My region has had its budget slashed by 10%. Which realistically is more like 20% because of inflation.
Brexit damaged our trading with our closest neighbours.
Austerity has led to our essential workers striking.

That is what people mean by tanked. The Tories have destroyed women's rights and destroyed the British economy.

Anklespraying · 24/04/2023 09:41

What does "tanked* mean though? All those sad remainers keep saying it and yet we all got up and went to work this morning.

tank
/taŋk/
Learn to pronounce
See definitions in:
All
Motoring
Sport · Informal
verb
past tense: tanked; past participle: tanked
1.
fill the tank of a vehicle with fuel.
"the cars stopped to tank up"
2.
INFORMAL•US
fail completely, especially at great financial cost.
"the previous movie had tanked at the box office"

Claiming the economy has failed completely is the usual pointless hyperbole. Surely the only people you depress with this empty catastrophising is other sad remainers? I feel a bit sad for you that you are so stuck in the past and can't move on. You seem to want things to be bad .

Namechange5544 · 24/04/2023 09:38

Never voted Conservative, never ever will.

TooBigForMyBoots · 24/04/2023 09:35

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 23/04/2023 18:54

You do realise that Labour lost the last election? And that can only win the next one by getting people who voted Tory last time to vote Labour. Yet you and other numpties like you are hell-bent on alienating anyone who has ever voted Tory. You are doing the Tories' work for them.

Most people in the UK did not vote Tory. Doesn't mean they are Labour supporters.

Rosula · 24/04/2023 09:09

Anklespraying · 24/04/2023 08:58

Are you one of those Labour people that only measure success in terms of greater consumption? And who likes to be considered better than other countries?

No, I measure success in part against other countries that are doing so much better than us in terms of social welfare whilst keeping their economy stable. I also measure success in terms of not having an economy that has been needlessly tanked whether due to Brexit, Truss/Kwarteng, or whatever. But primarily I measure it in terms of having a government that runs a country where I do not see crumbling services everywhere, whether it's in terms of health (including mental health care), social care, education, policing, the justice system, farming support, transport, drainage, the environment ... and also having a government that is not demonstrably favouring its members, relatives and friends in terms of tax and government contracts.

Anklespraying · 24/04/2023 08:58

Rosula · 24/04/2023 08:48

Yet, 13 years after Labour left office, we have one of the weakest economies in the western world. So it's not as if you can suggest the Tories have got it right.

Are you one of those Labour people that only measure success in terms of greater consumption? And who likes to be considered better than other countries?

Rosula · 24/04/2023 08:48

Yet, 13 years after Labour left office, we have one of the weakest economies in the western world. So it's not as if you can suggest the Tories have got it right.

ColdMeg · 24/04/2023 07:58

Lavenderlaze · 23/04/2023 12:47

I would choose Labour over Tory every time but I hold my nose doing so. I am under bI used to suggest tactically voting Lib Dem in certain areas but wouldn't again after the damage they did in coalition.

For me, voting Tory is abhorrent. I weep at the damage they have done each and every time they have been in power. Labour are problematic and I can't stand Starmer but things were better under the last labour government. We had better investment in education and health, we had policies that were improving life chances and bringing down child poverty.

I am not wholly aligned with any main party really, I have been left of labour since the 90s.

Things were better under the last Labour government because Brown spent over tax receipts in top of a cheap credit inflated economy every year from 2001 to 2008. When that cheap credit disappeared, tax receipts collapsed by £200 billion and we were left with liabilities we could no longer fund.

That was the reason for austerity.

Prior to 2001, because of the New Labour pledge to keep to Tory spending plans in their first term, there was no money (there never has been really) for new schools and hospitals, but Labour had promised them. That's why they used PFI, which has strangled the NHS in punative costs ever since.

It's very easy to fund things when you borrow. The problem comes when your income collapses and you've huge liabilities every month, or your repayments become unmanageable. When you looked at all our unfunded liabilities in 2009, including pensions, the situation was far worse than Greece. The only decent thing Brown did was keep us out of the euro, probably because he couldn't have done what he did if we'd been part of the EMU.

I wish Labour had won the 2010 election. They would have had to address the extraordinary economic and financial mess they had made.

Twenty-one years, it took, from 1979 to get the British state budget to balance. We had to go through all the carnage of the 80s, and for what? For Labour to do it all again after 2001.

I left the Labour Party over it in 2005 because I could see what they were doing. You cannot make wholesale, stable changes within society by creating liabilities that you cannot fund long term. We were told "things would get better". What we got was an enormous party that few of us were invited to, and we've ended up with the bill.

dcbc1234 · 23/04/2023 22:06

Yes for sure. Also live in Scotland currently so that is an extra reason as I would never ever vote SNP. The Tory sometimes wins in my MP's seat. I used to be a tactical anti Tory voter and Labour member until Corbyn; but no more free speech is the only thing which is allowing the genderwoo to be rolled back.

NotHavingIt · 23/04/2023 19:58

has just become.....

NotHavingIt · 23/04/2023 19:58

DojaPhat · 23/04/2023 19:40

@NotHavingIt I understand the feminists on here have no other choice but to vote for the tories, or spoil their ballots, based on their lived experiences which have bought them to this point. It's just the state of affairs really. Kudos to you however, who became vegetarian shortly after your 16th birthday and just before you picked your A-level subjects.

I don't call myself a 'feminist anymore. I'm a woman who thinks that women have integrity as women and they matter.

Feminism' has just just another branch of identity politics for many , I feel. When women, as a discrete and distinct sex class, don't exist anymore without having to be qualified by terms such as 'cis' - how can you look after their interests .

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