Kirstie Allsopp 🤦🏻‍♀️

I think its because she can afford to have luxury beliefs not only when she is safe in the knowledge that it has no inpact on her, but she isnt the one who has to implement and take responsibility for the fantasy.

When sharron davis asks how she intends to protect the vulnerable women and allow any man to self id, she said - "Honest answer, I don’t know. But if we consider each place in a sensible fashion I’m sure we can work it out."

Thats not answer, thats continuing to live in a fantasy world fluffing up cushions and letting everyone else live with the consequences of her privilege beliefs.

This is really profound and I think you are onto something.

It must be well weird growing up in a class system where women and girls are still officially second class citizens, where your annoying little brother is higher up the family pecking order from the moment the placenta hits the pedal bin onwards, and no matter how hard you work, no matter how clever you are, how talented, how accomplished, you will never ‘win’ the family title and all that goes with.

Kirstie went to posh girls schools and while those schools look pretty luxurious from the outsiders point of view it’s also obvious that they are less prestigious than the boy’s equivalent and I doubt that will ever change much because posh, rich men don’t need their future wives to be academically accomplished and capable of earning half the family income 😬

The stuff up thread about Kirsty going to lots of schools reminded me of Jan Morris’ daughter, Suky Morys. Neither Jan nor wife Elizabeth were not landed gentry but Jan had had the aristocratic boys education (boarder at a public school followed by oxbridge degree) and they had plenty of cash so Jan and Elizabeth’s three sons all went off to boarding school.
Suky’s education seems to have been afterthought at best and maliciously disrupted by her father’s behaviours at worst).

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-11527279/amp/Celebrated-writer-Jan-Morris-bully-hug-children-daughter-claims.html

Bit of a tangent but…
I’m rather fascinated as to what senior school Princess Charlotte will attend, seeing as the Royal Fam are now more modern than their aristocratic cousins when it comes to primogeniture and Kate’s side of the family clearly had a middle class, upwardly mobile sensibility when it came to educating girls?
Obvs, money is no object and as long as Charlotte isn’t completely stupid her parents will be able to get her a place at any school they take a fancy to… (and even if she is stupid, it might not hurt, Harry went to Eton despite clearly not reaching their usual standards!)

Yes, that's a good point. She's been conditioned her entire life to be a service human. Why stop now.

I think with women like this, if they can't see it, they go down in my estimation so much I just focus on other people and barely glance in their direction ever again. I wouldn't watch her on tv or read anything she writes because of this and I have a craft business so have watched her crap Christmas crafts shows before - but why would I now when she's happy to dismiss the serious and legitimate concerns of others? And while I'm sure Kirstie doesn't care what many random women think about her, for some of us, this is all we will think about in the future when we think about her legacy and achievements. Because it cuts deep to see another woman dismiss these fears.

I am just grateful that so many other women DO get it and have worked so hard to protect people more vulnerable than themselves.

I wonder if this is significant in forming her thinking around all this. From birth she must have been immersed in the understanding that she was a supporting player, that her role was secondary because of her sex. Male is trumps, every time. So if a man says he'd rather pop on a skirt and join the queue for the ladies' loos at Ascot, the girls move up and think he's a jolly brave sort for trading in all that power and privilege. Poor chap for not being quite manly enough to cut it with the big boys (though he'll still get the title and the estate.)

Ah yes! She is the living embodiment of being asked to support the benefits for ze menz, whilst being strictly forbidden to use it herself.

Kirstie should do us all a favour and be a true ally of the transmen: identify as a man and demand the peerage that's going to her younger brother. Let's see all those TRA misogynists fighting for the women for once.

Yeah, I think they realise that their PR machine has fucked things right up.

Kirsty, despite being privileged, still has views which represent something of the 'normal woman.'

Wants to be kind, but disagrees with sport and being personally re-labelled. It's a fairly mainstream fence sitting view.

If they can reinvent themselves to be acceptable to her, it's got to be looking like a bit of a litmus test.

Most of them only really care about toilets and changing rooms anyway. Because they're not in prison, or athletic.

But Although she's dug her heels in, I still predict she will come round in the end. Except blocking everybody might throw a spanner in the works. She don't be able to see how these women are targeted.

Frankly if she deliberately chooses a TRA based echo chamber, then that's on her.

But I guarantee it will wear thin.

Rich, privileged celebs don't tend to have a massive bandwidth for nurturing the gigantic egos of loser men.

I think it’s interesting that trans activists aren’t tearing her to shreds. She is being allowed to say “don’t like being called cis” and “there’s a debate to be had re sports” and as far as I can see she’s not received any “suck my girl dick” responses. I wonder if that’s because they think they can educate her further or is it because they feel like they are on the back foot and they have to take what they can get. She’s certainly a very flawed ally. She wouldn’t have stood a chance a couple of years back.

I hope at least Phil is a a closet GCer.

I had to look up that story.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rip_Van_Winkle

It reminds me of this one

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echo_and_Narcissus

I can hear echo chants of 'sustainability, equity, inclusion, intersectionality, TWAW'

Kirstie Allsopp is a little like a barometer to me.

She is confident and privileged, prides herself on her abilities, presumably partly in connection with solving offspring conflicts, but doesn't have the smallest clue about the trans issue. And certainly doesn't realise it's zero sum game.

Which is why, I believe, she's more significant than she would otherwise be.

She's representative of a certain type of fence sitter. One who might have some influence, given she's a tv presenter, but knows fuck all about the issues. So, there is something to play for in getting her on side.

And by play for, I mean who has the most persuasive argument - particularly for a
'be kind', opinionated woman.

It's whether she comes down on the side of logic, women's rights, and child protection, or whether she comes down on the side of let's be kind to the men who I generally placate.

Which is why I think her specific outlook is attracting attention.

On another note, the article managed a few fabulous turns of phrase. I see that he used to write for Dr Who. Which is interesting, given Russell T Davies' outlook.

Kirstie dropped a series of ever bigger, ever more staggeringly uninformed clangers. ‘Using preferred pronouns is simply good manners’, said Rip van Allsopp

🤣

Oh yes, but who does she think actually watches her TV shows?

She's pretty stupid really.

From a self promotion view I don't really get it, who are her target market?

Kirstie seems very much to me like a man's woman. She might want to seem like 'one of the girls' but she's all about pleasing the chaps and I get the strong impression she'd chuck any woman under a moving vehicle to do it.

I also think she's being nasty.

She is calling women who care about women's rights 'vile'.

From a self promotion view I don't really get it, who are her target market?

It’s crept up on a lot of people, all this queering of boundaries and taking over women’s spaces. I didn’t have a clue - when the JKR storm began I was completely bewildered by it all. I had no idea until last year that people literally thought TWAW and TMAM. It’s heartening that more people are waking up to it now. We need to find a way forward where trans people are free to live in peace without riding roughshod over women’s rights or encouraging children to change sex.

True. I was out on a mums night out last night. When I started banging on about all this about 6 years ago, they used to look at me blankly like I was some sort of conspiracy theorist. Now I'm the expert 😎 literally no-one I speak to is happy about what's happening with children, women's sports, the hospital thing was discussed. All without exception of the large group were on the same page and wondering what they could do to push back.

I agree, but I bet that - even if the experience doesn't actually peak KA herself - plenty of women witnessing this will be rethinking who ought to 'be kind' to who.

Actually she's behaving pretty nastily now. I'm disappointed in how she has heard all the concerns of other women and has minimised them, mocked them, called them wierd freaks, laughed at their fears. I actually am pretty sickened by her behaviour.

I think Kirstie means well but she’s really out of her depth with this one. Breezing in, thinking she’s offering a lovely, kind yet balanced viewpoint on the issues… Oh, Kirstie. You’re not a mum breaking up a squabble between kids.

The so-called t3rfs are not the ones threatening violence against those they disagree with. It’s the other side unfortunately. Not all trans people of course, but the militant trans rights activists are more dangerous than the most fervently GC women. If you’re going to nail your colours to the mast, choose wisely.

On the Witch Trials podcast, JK Rowling talks about how she read up on the issue of trans vs women’s rights very, very thoroughly, looking at it from all angles, before deciding she had to speak up. Jumping into this issue on some kind of whim is ill-advised.

Sounds like the pair of them did the first wife a favour.

She’s proper posh on both sides of the fam.

This is her dad: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Allsopp,_6th_Baron_Hindlip

Not that I care but it might explain why Baroness Nicholson isn’t just batting her away like an annoying fly - they probably have some social circle people in common.

And I’d imagine India Willoughby is a little more tolerant of Kirstie than India is of other middle aged women who don’t want to be called ‘cis’ because Kirstie is several rungs higher than India on the TV presenter hierarchy!

Aristo that went to multiple private schools but did not go to university. I think we can safely assume she's not an intellectual heavyweight. Not sure why anyone is trying to attache that level of significance to her uninformed, generic and reductive tweets.