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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Schools ‘let pupils switch gender without informing parents’ - Policy Exchange Report

158 replies

rogdmum · 30/03/2023 06:10

There’s a raft of coverage in the Times and the Mail today:

<a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-014418/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/schools-let-pupils-switch-gender-without-informing-parents-pppbphkgq?shareToken=a982976ca8c81a3e9ea0e21ee76f3364" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-014418/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/schools-let-pupils-switch-gender-without-informing-parents-pppbphkgq?shareToken=a982976ca8c81a3e9ea0e21ee76f3364

Half of schools turn to outside agencies for sex education:

<a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-015239/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/half-of-schools-turn-to-outside-agencies-for-sex-education-zzqqsmgb0?shareToken=111ada6e40d464c85ba4f6d11703fbd8" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-015239/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/half-of-schools-turn-to-outside-agencies-for-sex-education-zzqqsmgb0?shareToken=111ada6e40d464c85ba4f6d11703fbd8

The magnificent Rosie Duffield:

<a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-015234/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/rosie-duffield-schools-are-failing-in-their-duty-to-protect-gender-distressed-children-9zzsk06j9?shareToken=fbad1f25d0a39dad9cb1bc35292664d7" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-015234/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/rosie-duffield-schools-are-failing-in-their-duty-to-protect-gender-distressed-children-9zzsk06j9?shareToken=fbad1f25d0a39dad9cb1bc35292664d7

Rosie nails it:

”Iis universally accepted that safeguarding is fundamental to a responsible society. These principles are well-established, enshrined in law, and applicable to all organisations and functions relating to children. There is never a good reason why safeguarding should be compromised, especially within school, where children spend the majority of their time outside of the home environment.”

”The rising number of children reporting gender distress, and the treatment of those children within clinical settings, is rightly being given the attention it deserves. In an NHS-commissioned independent review, Dr Hilary Cass found the Tavistock clinic to be adopting an “unquestioning, affirmative approach” without exploring other factors causing these children’s distress.
Affirmation as a one-size-fits-all solution has been discredited.

Thankfully, the clinic is being shut down. However, Policy Exchange has revealed something even more concerning: the same approach is being facilitated in schools, which breaks every safeguarding rule in the book.”

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https://archive.ph/2023.03.30-014418/https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/schools-let-pupils-switch-gender-without-informing-parents-pppbphkgq?shareToken=a982976ca8c81a3e9ea0e21ee76f3364

OP posts:
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DemiColon · 30/03/2023 17:49

lifeturnsonadime · 30/03/2023 10:25

This is what i was going to ask.

What is the point of the Cass Review if schools are going to ignore it?

Why wasn't this shared with schools? Especially the key point that social transition is not a neutral act?

I can't believe that, after the Cass report, this is still going on in schools.

Sectors like education and health aren't directly managed in every detail by government. They are mostly run by civil servants. There are thousands of people involved at different levels.

In part, there is distance on purpose, it is supposed to protect them from too much political interference. But it also means that structurally, they can avoid taking on government direction very effectively, for a long time, if they don't want to.

And they have been very effectively taught by "expert" organizations, by the media, and by their own training, to accept these ideas wholly, and think that they are morally obliged to stand up for them. People right down to the classroom level.

It takes a long time to make change in this scenario and I would even say that unless there is a lot of pressure applied steadily, often the organization wins out. There needs to be continued pressure from government on this and efforts to change thinking, and it will likely take as long to undo as it has to get here.

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 17:37

On the BBC:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65127170

"Rishi Sunak has promised schools will receive guidance on policies for transgender pupils for the summer term.

The Prime Ministerr_ intervened after a teaching union said its members were navigating a 'minefield' around gender."

I'm not sure he "intervened after" a union had something to say though.

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 17:17

Rachel Reeves. Doesn't answer whether she'd be happy being kept in the dark, says Labour have been calling on the government for months to publish the guidance. Have they? Does anyone have a link?

twitter.com/timesradio/status/1641342711637704704?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

MrsOvertonsWindow · 30/03/2023 16:52

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 16:18

Keir Starmer responds:

"Keir Starmer says schools "need and want guidance" on trans issues: "I think it's very concerning to see that different schools are doing different things.

"And I think parents would want to know what's going on. I think that's understandable. And I say that as a parent myself.""

twitter.com/dominicpenna/status/1641405403559870464?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

Ducking the issue as ever.
Look at the responses under that tweet! Not one of them with a clue about children - and all ignorant about safeguarding, throwing around right wing tropes and allegations of bigotry amongst parents.
Incapable of reading or engaging with the issues. So depressing.

Faffertea · 30/03/2023 16:36

Glad you’re feeling better @rogdmum . I’ve read your posts over the years and you have been a fantastic advocate for your child and children more generally.

Thank you to @2fallsfromSSA and everyone at SSA too for your work on this.

For us in education and health professions who are worried by the affirmation only approach it’s a real relief to see this being discussed more openly.

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 16:18

Keir Starmer responds:

"Keir Starmer says schools "need and want guidance" on trans issues: "I think it's very concerning to see that different schools are doing different things.

"And I think parents would want to know what's going on. I think that's understandable. And I say that as a parent myself.""

twitter.com/dominicpenna/status/1641405403559870464?s=46&t=WHoOZ_3Kv5G6-FyQuvE0LQ

Boiledbeetle · 30/03/2023 14:11

2fallsfromSSA · 30/03/2023 14:04

Someone was asking about this report being from a right wing group and how to frame it with their schools. This is our response to that criticism: https://twitter.com/SafeSchools_UK/status/1641376013320957952?s=20

If we sound cross its because we are.

.

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2fallsfromSSA · 30/03/2023 14:04

Someone was asking about this report being from a right wing group and how to frame it with their schools. This is our response to that criticism: https://twitter.com/SafeSchools_UK/status/1641376013320957952?s=20

If we sound cross its because we are.

https://twitter.com/SafeSchools_UK/status/1641376013320957952?s=20

TooBigForMyBoots · 30/03/2023 13:51

I don't trust Women and Equalities to help with any of this. It's chaired by Caroline Nokes and has Jamie Wallis sitting on it.

IcakethereforeIam · 30/03/2023 13:45

I concerned about schools permitting transitioning of children even with their parents knowledge and support. If a parent affirmed their daughter's belief she was fat, would the school agree to starve her? Then there's the welfare of all the other children in the school to consider.

LizzieSiddal · 30/03/2023 13:41

@ResisterRex He added: “But also what I’m also going to say today is that for the summer term, we will make sure that we publish guidance for schools so that they know how to respond when children are asking about their gender.

Well “guidance” could be a positive step. It will all depends on who is being consulted to make this guidance. I hope the Cass report is being used.

JohnnyMcGrathSaysFuckOff · 30/03/2023 13:40

Flying question, but does anyone know how the BBC reported this?

I was listening to Times Radio on way in this morning so caught Grant Shapps being questioned on it, but haven't seen anything on BBC and it's not obviously up on their front news page now.........

2fallsfromSSA · 30/03/2023 13:38

Tanya will be on LBC at 2pm talking about this.

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 13:37

Times story has been updated to include comments from the PM:

Schools ‘let pupils switch gender without informing parents’

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/eaf16a74-ce5e-11ed-9a78-fca06b87e87b?shareToken=b846aee24749f196f412ba733dedc64a

"Rishi Sunak has said that he is “very concerned” that schools are routinely allowing children to switch gender without telling parents.
...

Speaking during a visit to the UK Atomic Energy Authority in Oxfordshire, he said: “I’m very concerned about these reports.

“For me the safety and wellbeing of our children is of paramount importance. And I’ve also been clear that parents must be able to know what is being taught to their kids in school, especially on these sensitive areas.

“That’s why we’re already reviewing the RSE [relationship and sex education] guidance to make sure that it is age appropriate for children.”

He added: “But also what I’m also going to say today is that for the summer term, we will make sure that we publish guidance for schools so that they know how to respond when children are asking about their gender.

“These are really sensitive areas, it’s important that we treat them sensitively, and that parents know what’s going on, and we’ll make sure that that happens.”"

2fallsfromSSA · 30/03/2023 13:17

@fiendishdragon that is so shocking to see it written it down like that. We know that it is true but to see it so blatantly is horrific.

IcakethereforeIam · 30/03/2023 12:54

The Education Secretary is working closely with the Minister for Women and Equalities to produce guidance for schools which we will be consulting on shortly.

Why do have a picture of Kemi marching to Keegan's office and kicking the fucking door down.

30 rock made by moi GIF
ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 12:41

Also in the Telegraph:

digitaleditions.telegraph.co.uk/data/1293/reader/reader.html?social#!preferred/0/package/1293/pub/1293/page/5/article/NaN

"A DfE spokesman said: “Our priority will always be the safety and wellbeing of children and young people. The Education Secretary is working closely with the Minister for Women and Equalities to produce guidance for schools which we will be consulting on shortly.

“In the meantime, we are clear that schools should make sure they work with parents, pupils and public services to decide what is best for individual children.”"

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 12:35

Haven't seen anyone line up to call the Policy Exchange's findings into question. Have I missed it? It also feels like the quotes from those essentially being criticised are much less defensive than when Cates published her report.

ArabellaScott · 30/03/2023 12:30

Thanks for all the links, rogdmum. Amazing to see this front page news.

rogdmum · 30/03/2023 12:27

Thanks Boiledbeetle I have had a cup of coffee and am feeling better now. 😁

OP posts:
fiendishdragon · 30/03/2023 12:23

Our school's safeguarding officer said to us:

[Under the guidance we're following] "Normal safeguarding rules do not apply to transgender students."

It's an absolute trainwreck.

Schools are teaching children that some girls have a penis.
Schools are putting male and female children in the same changing rooms/dormitories.

So when a male teenager undresses, and a teenage girl objects, is this

  • indecent exposure?
  • a transphobic hate incident/bullying?

I don't understand how anyone is advocating for this - it's clearly a disaster for all the children, including and especially those who identify as trans. A total failure to think about consequences. How can schools not see the immense danger for children, and the legal risks to the schools?

Leafstamp · 30/03/2023 11:52

I'm so angry with schools for getting this so wrong. Yes, they have been let down by government but regardless they have shown themselves to be gullible and spineless and with inadequate critical thinking skills and safeguarding knowledge.

ResisterRex · 30/03/2023 11:31

2fallsfromSSA · 30/03/2023 10:33

It should have done, but I am not sure it did or if it did, I am not sure what the message was that went alongside it.

The issue is we are relying on the DfE to do this and as we know, there is widespread regulatory capture.

On this, the report has a solid potted history of how we got here. I can't see any comment from Stonewall or Mermaids. Not checked all the others names there though just yet.

IcakethereforeIam · 30/03/2023 11:27

Has Keegan said anything?

Boiledbeetle · 30/03/2023 10:51

rogdmum · 30/03/2023 07:50

I’m feeling both weepy and ill on the back of this. We (Mumsnetters, SSA, TT etc) have been shouting about this for years and have either been brushed off or dismissed as transphobic.

There is an external investigation currently being carried out into my daughter’s former school about my concerns around the breakdown in safeguarding wrt this issue. Being in Scotland I have little hope of our concerns being upheld, but if DfE wakes up and recognises the harm being done, eventually it will trickle down to Scotland as well.

Stay strong. You've personally done so much and fought for so long it must be exhausting. But without women like you really pushing for answers on these things and putting yourself and your story into the msm we wouldn't be as far forward as we are.

As is often said about the shit parts of childhood...this to shall pass.

It will be over one day. Sanity will prevail!

🍷

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