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Graham Linehan interview in The Times (17 March 2023)

184 replies

IwantToRetire · 17/03/2023 01:42

From both ends of the trans debate, I am told his interventions are “counterproductive”, “a net bad” and “unhinged”. Some gender-critical women — that is, women who agree with him — believe he craves attention, martyrdom and leadership of a movement whose fight is not even his. One mentions that he was once pro-porn and sex work, which he admits to being before “talking to feminists” changed his mind. Over on the other side of the battle lines, an activist dismisses him as a fringe character full of hot air. None of these people is prepared, however, to go on the record, mostly saying they fear he will retaliate in his customary style.

There is one admirable exception. She is Kathleen Stock, the radical feminist philosopher who resigned from the University of Sussex in 2021 after a campaign by “queer, trans and non-binary” students who wanted her fired. “Graham and I have clashed in the past,” she says, “and we probably aren’t each other’s favourite people. But I think it’s fair to say he’s genuinely committed to fighting what he believes is a woman-harming and child-harming ideology (and I agree with him on that); and he talks to some demographics — particularly ordinary blokes, who don’t really care so much about niceties of language and aren’t put off by his sometimes bludgeoning style — that others don’t necessarily reach.”

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/broke-shunned-and-cancelled-father-ted-creator-graham-linehan-and-the-trans-debate-cgv8gqpjk

Sorry no share token

(If you paste the Times link above into archive.ph/ it has been archived)

OP posts:
RoyalCorgi · 17/03/2023 12:43

Rather than the audience, I expect the difficulty for Father Ted: The Musical is that young, musical theatre actors are the most pro-trans and super-woke demographic out there!

This makes sense. It lines up with those publishers who wouldn't publish the Hannah Barnes or Helen Joyce books because their younger staff refused to work on them. And while there's always another publisher, I suppose it is different with actors. (Though how hypocritical do you have to be to say "I'll work on Father Ted, but only if Graham Linehan isn't involved?" He wrote the damn thing, so if you want to take a principled stand, then you shouldn't have anything to do with it regardless of whether his name is on it or not.)

FOJN · 17/03/2023 12:41

On another note, is Father Ted available on any streaming channel now? If not what a loss that is.

Hat Trick still cashing in on Father Ted with clips from the series on their YouTube channel but they've hidden the full episodes. What cowardly, unprincipled wankers.

BloodyHellKen · 17/03/2023 12:35

Slothtoes · 17/03/2023 07:07

Graham Linehan is plainly right. He’s got more moral fibre and integrity in his toenail clippings than those dolts in the media who still inexplicably believe he’s cancelled. No he’s bloody not cancelled. They are on the sexist, homophobic, wildly misogynistic authoritarian wrong side of history.

Andrew Billen’s his mealy mouthed attempt to interview Linehan as a good for clicks while condemning him (for what real transgression exactly?) on faint praise is merely showing his own journalistic efforts towards misogynistic and authoritarian appeasement. The shame is Billen’s. Linehan has done nothing wrong in speaking up in support of women and children.

People love Linehan’s comedy writing work. Those who share his views in gender identity politics also know a feminist ally, supporter of safeguarding and freedoms of speech when they see one. I think Linehan’s real crime has just been to point out than men can be dangerous. He’s said the quiet bits out loud and worse, said it wittily and engagingly too . That’s so uncomfortable for a lot of people who should really be looking hard at themselves to think why they feel that way.

His speaking out makes the sheep at the top who are only there for the financial bottom line, and who believe what some out of touch privileged teenager tells them is the real world (because it’s on their social media feed); fear for their audience figures. When neither those big cheeses nor their interns can read a room.

it reminds me of Chris Morris and Cake with Linehan’s words as the Cake. Unfortunately though for Linehan, its worse for him than just being embarrassing and showing up personal gullibility and the mercenary professional scrabble to get ahead.

Linehan works in a fiercely back stabby and ultra competitive writing and producing world- like academia, like the arts and theatre- where the rationale to pick off one big beast like him leaves more room for the established figures who want more and for the up and comers growing desperate for their big break to take attention and get work. So of course they’re all going to gun for him to keep him out. Even though the paying public would want to watch him.

👏I agree @Slothtoes

Graham Linehan has my admiration. Not only is he a comedy genius but he isn't afraid to stand up to TRA bullies and misogynists. He stands with women and children.

He also makes all the other men in comedy and I'm looking at you The Last Leg, James Acaster et al who suck up to the TRAS look even more misogynistic and lacking in moral fibre than they all ready do. It's frustrating when someone you thought would be sensible about women's rights and child protection puts themselves and their career first because they are scared of rocking the boat.

anyolddinosaur · 17/03/2023 12:30

Not a great fan of Father Ted personally but the way Graham has been treated is terrible. A reminder that if you google his name and crowdfunder he could do with more veg.

Righthandcider · 17/03/2023 12:18

StephanieSuperpowers · 17/03/2023 09:54

I personally think that how he expresses himself is fine - I would not have his courage and humour. When people accuse him of being vicious, I personally see someone with an eye for the ridiculous getting to the empty heart of this nonsense. It's just that it's so exposing, they can't bear it.

Yes, this. I saw a tweet of his taking the piss out of a pic of Sam Smith in a stringy bikini thing, and thought, 'Hmm, that's a bit unnecessary.' But then I realised that's literally what satirists, comedians, political cartoonists etc have always done – expose the absurd, egotistical, delusional puffery that the rest of us are too 'kind' to point at. Otherwise stupid sodding madness takes over society like fecking knotweed.

And I'm another who's glad of Graham's voice. That foul interview with Sarah Smith on Newsnight really wound me up, esp. hearing her tell him 'Women are quite capable of speaking for themselves, thank you very much.' Well, Sarah, for one thing you don't speak for all women. For another, he's entitled to give a shit about something that affects the women he loves and that's being largely perpetrated by men. And thirdly, most of the world doesn't fecking listen to women anyway, do they?

(Two 'feckings' in there dedicated to Father Ted.)

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2023 12:14

I think it's a sad article. Still implies that Glinner should STFU.

On another note, is Father Ted available on any streaming channel now? If not what a loss that is.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 17/03/2023 12:07

Reading Twitter under Elon Musk's ownership, though, it does seem like there are a lot of people, many men, now openingly taking the piss out of gender ideology without repercussions

I honestly think it's sometimes the best way to fight the cultural dominance of this ideology.

ditalini · 17/03/2023 11:59

Glinner is used by TRAs as an example of What Will Happen To You if you don't toe the line to the rest of the entertainment industry and the vast majority have heeded the lesson. It's been unbelievably peurile and vicious.

And no, I don't think we should always aim for "respectful debate" when the definition of "respectful" will always mean what TRAs say it means - it's impossible to be respectful in debate when it means STFU.

Pudmyboy · 17/03/2023 11:59

He is brilliant, and on the right side of history, along with James Dreyfus. I was so disappointed in Matt Berry denouncing the genius episode 'speech', it is the best of the series in my mind. Even though Glinner pointed out that Matt's character loses out on a potentially perfect relationship because of the character's inability to accept April 'used to be a man', it was still deemed transphobic, when to me it highlighted the prejudice April's character faces.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 17/03/2023 11:49

I hadn’t realised he did count Arthur Strong too. I don’t love the way he interacts here, but I do love his writing and think he is a strongly principled man

ScribblingPixie · 17/03/2023 11:47

The article reads as if Andrew Billen is terrified of saying one positive thing about Graham Linehan. Reading Twitter under Elon Musk's ownership, though, it does seem like there are a lot of people, many men, now openingly taking the piss out of gender ideology without repercussions. I hope Graham Linehan can keep on keeping on until he can start making decent money again.

LittleFingerStrength · 17/03/2023 11:46

Pangolin23 · 17/03/2023 11:05

Rather than the audience, I expect the difficulty for Father Ted: The Musical is that young, musical theatre actors are the most pro-trans and super-woke demographic out there!

So putting on the production and not having it disrupted could well be difficult.

Show quote history

Aren't there something like 90% of actors resting?

DarkDayforMN · 17/03/2023 11:32

Glinner is still paying the price for being one of the first to speak out and it sucks. It’s not like he’s especially vicious or anything, he was just willing to say what no one else at that time with a public profile was saying (no, “trans women” aren’t women.)

I think without him we’d have self-ID; he played a critical part in raising awareness back in the days when it was all about filling in consultation responses.

I really hope he is publicly vindicated.

HermioneKipper · 17/03/2023 11:24

I really like Glinner too and can’t understand why his whole life has been destroyed.

He just speaks sense as far as I’m concerned and takes the piss out of the gender numpties.

I feel very sorry for him

Pangolin23 · 17/03/2023 11:05

RoyalCorgi · 17/03/2023 09:15

Interesting article. And very sad.

I think Andrew Billen was not the best person to do the interview because, having read previous pieces by him, he is at best ambivalent on the trans issue, at worst seems to think that it's a generational divide, with older people on the wrong side of history.

I was very interested to read Jimmy Mulville's quote. He clearly thinks the Father Ted musical script is great and that it would do well in the West End - as long as Linehan's name isn't associated with it. I'm not sure he's right about that. Who are the main Father Ted fans - young people, sympathetic to trans ideology? Or older people, who watched Father Ted in the 1990s? And who are the main demographic for West End theatre - older people or young people? The trouble with Mulville is that he imagines that everyone thinks the same way as people who work in theatre or post angry tweets on Twitter, whereas in fact the vast majority of people (certainly the vast majority of the theatre-going demographic) either couldn't give a damn about the issue or are actively sympathetic to Linehan.

Also interesting that Billen couldn't get anyone apart from Kathleen Stock to speak on the record. I thought Stock's quote was quite generous, actually, given that the two have argued in the past.

I thought Billen's comments about the dating app were odd. Clearly Linehan was simply taking the piss out of all the heterosexual men forcing their way into a lesbian-only space. Why would you consider this cruel to those men - instead of being angry at those men for trying to force same-sex attracted women to have sex with them?

Rather than the audience, I expect the difficulty for Father Ted: The Musical is that young, musical theatre actors are the most pro-trans and super-woke demographic out there!

So putting on the production and not having it disrupted could well be difficult.

Dinopawus · 17/03/2023 11:05

One woman wears a T-shirt with the slogan “Woman = adult human female”, a common riposte by “gender-critical” lesbians to trans women who insist they are indeed women (although legally, of course, they can be).

Where to start? I have an AHF T shirt and an married to a man. He has a penis and everything. I don't think I'm a lesbian.

As for repeating the legal fiction that Transwomen are women...

Saucery · 17/03/2023 10:57

Content selling fear

Count Arthur Strong? Grin Grin

He's a principled man, we need more like him to stand up and be allies.

RoyalCorgi · 17/03/2023 10:46

StephanieSuperpowers · 17/03/2023 09:54

I personally think that how he expresses himself is fine - I would not have his courage and humour. When people accuse him of being vicious, I personally see someone with an eye for the ridiculous getting to the empty heart of this nonsense. It's just that it's so exposing, they can't bear it.

This is absolutely it. Glinner relentlessly takes the piss out of these ridiculous people, and they can't stand it. I do think there is still a view amongst some GC people that we should always be respectful in debate - and Glinner refuses to toe that particular line.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 17/03/2023 10:45

Lol mishy I do admire your tenacity

glinners career and life has been wrecked whilst the most marginalised of allll time ever have literally had the Bank of England lit uk in support of themand succeeded In forcing their male bodies into everything designed to be women only - refuges, prisons, women’s sport even groups for mothers who are breastfeeding

so very very marginalised & oppressed….

MishyJDI · 17/03/2023 10:40

Well another big article in the Times for Glinner.

So much for being cancelled. He really still don't get it.

If he was able to provide relevant content to today's viewers, he would be getting the assignments. Content selling fear.....yeah not great. I wouldn't touch it either.

Still, he is an entertaining character, that is for sure. Perhaps just needs a new hobby!

Isheabastard · 17/03/2023 10:38

It’s an ‘interesting’ article. I have much sympathy for Graham Linehan.

But I seriously thought the author of the piece sounded biased against him.

Do others not see that? What am I missing?

Wellies54 · 17/03/2023 10:30

GettingMarriedAgain · 17/03/2023 09:51

Same here - I read it earlier and thought it came across as incredibly sneery in tone and in places quite ill informed!

Show quote history

I think sometimes balancing out both sides in an article like this is good. People who don't know much about what Graham has said might have a vague idea that he said something really awful then they read this and think, well I agree with him and when there is some sneeriness, they see it for what it is.

GettingMarriedAgain · 17/03/2023 10:22

@IcakethereforeIam I can't see the comments (thank you for the share token) are they allowing any and, if so, what's the consensus?

I’d say about 95% of the comments are on Graham’s side

Ereshkigalangcleg · 17/03/2023 10:07

When people accuse him of being vicious, I personally see someone with an eye for the ridiculous getting to the empty heart of this nonsense. It's just that it's so exposing, they can't bear it.

In terms of how he expresses himself and his humour, I fully agree.

IcakethereforeIam · 17/03/2023 10:06

Love Glinner, love his work, glad his crowd fund got a mention. I think there'd be a massive audience for a Father Ted musical, well....I'd go see it. I wonder if Mulville was seeing problems getting the thing as far as being staged. I could foresee everyone from the venue to the caterers being targeted by the tras.

I was fine with Doc Stock's comments, I read them as generally supportive. The last sentence about the minefield, what are you supposed to do with unexploded bombs? You can't just leave them there.

I can't see the comments (thank you for the share token) are they allowing any and, if so, what's the consensus?