This is what happens when women say "No" - Vermont school ban

@SinnerBoy

Oh I agree - it was a principled stance and absolutely the right thing to do in my opinion. Its just so demonstrative that women (or in this case girls) removing themself from a situation is interpreted as a hostile act that must be punished.

It is really such a perversion of discourse to claim that trans individuals are entitled to have whatever they want (for whatever reason) because attention to the unreasonableness of their wishes/demands has let to verbal/physical attacks and threats; while at the same time (a) refusing to accept any blame for similar harassment of gender critical commenters, and (b) telling such individuals that it is a result of their wrong-headed opinions, which they only need to change/keep quiet about, in order for the attacks to cease. Of course, not only are all the attacks illegitimate and almost certainly illegal, but allowing them to influence argument is the same as endorsing such behaviour at all levels of debate - from kids in the playground to the relations of states. But, and this is the vital thing, they are only a significant factor when trans women/biological [not cis] women are involved. Why is there no objection to trans men (i.e. biological women) impinging on biological men's perceived areas? Why no fuss along the lines of "trans men are men" or "keep trans men out of men's football teams"?

namitynamechange · Today 11:29

One of (its hard to pick) the worst part of this is that they conceded the match - they basically accepted a loss to their team instead of playing. Its unfair that they had to do even that.

Horrible and unfair though it is, I admire their principled stance, which achieved two things.

The school removed the girls from the risk of serious physical harm, by a hulking great male. It prevented them from being humiliated, by having to accept a false loss, by a team which has been allowed to cheat.

It still makes me want to puke.

Gawd. If receiving threats = entitlement, women on this board should be entitled to the moon on a stick by this point.

Jeez, even if some trans people have received threats, why does that mean that they get to ruin women's sport. Like, does that make the threats go away? It's just so unfair.

Bloody hell that snopes article. Rare use of the phrase 'she was only 6'5"!'

As I said, I don't like the use of single still pictures in this issue, because ridiculing individuals isn't right, even when the image does illustrate a point, and it's absolutely true that women who aren't pretty or particularly feminine or conformist, or in fact trans like Mack Beggs, suffer. Images get manipulated by all parties too.

It also means we get ludicrous articles like that which deliberately miss the point so completely.

How can it be out of context? The context does’t change the height difference. It can’t. Trying to claim that age somehow means that the huge height difference wasn’t an advantage is disingenuous at best. Nor does when the photo was taken make any difference.

That article is classic ‘the mostest oppressed ever in the history of everything’ TRA stuff. And all from the trans woman’s perspective. Obviously. That’s the only context that could really matter.

The Snopes (attempted) take down of that basketball story is hilarious. The effort they make is absolutely heroic. www.snopes.com/fact-check/gabrielle-ludwig/

One of (its hard to pick) the worst part of this is that they conceded the match - they basically accepted a loss to their team instead of playing. Its unfair that they had to do even that. But the fact that the reaction was so petty and vindictive - preventing every single girl in the school participating in sports with other schools is awful.

Under Biden the decision is highly likely to be in favour of gender being the important part of Title IX - he is totally sold on gender woo woo.

Oh, I must have said the wrong thing about the trans relay runner from Massachusetts....

This makes sense.

These days, even British GC feminists are accused of being aligned with and funded by the alt-right, including Christian fundamentalist groups in the US; groups which bear little resemblance to any similar hard-of-thinking movement currently existing in the UK. The Ideology is quite sufficiently lacking in criticality and nuance to reason that an actual British feminist would align herself with the kind of GOP, pro-life aligned cult which conservatively thinks a woman's place is in the kitchen, subservient to her menfolk, happily propagates the Trad Wife in true southern style and denies women autonomy over our own bodies.

Who knew feminism had turned so hard to the right, eh?

(And who recognises anything MRAs are peddling about Difficult Women Who Say No as emanating in any way from the Left? Their kind of rhetoric seems far more aligned with the kinds of sentiments outlined above, which they seem so keen to attribute to the feminists of today).

Top-level DARVO, or what?

I hope more schools will stand up for girls. It's so ridiculous this is happening

“The VPA again reiterates its ongoing support of transgender student-athletes as not only a part of building an inclusive community for each student to grow and thrive, but also as a clear expectation by Vermont state law(s) in the Agency of Education Best Practices, and in VPA Policy regarding transgender student athletes,” the association said in a statement.

As usual, all students "thrive" except girls.

TRAs always claim ‘threats to trans lives’. But there’s no evidence that trans people are at increased risk of murder. Any increased risk there might be seems to be from suicide.

Threats of suicide are a pretty standard tool of abuse. People repeating this stuff are encouraging this.

It’s unacceptable how the TRAs uses suicide in its rhetoric. And how politicians and various other people just repeat it - rather than questioning it and condemning it as irresponsible.

And women haven’t suffered all of those things, for all of history, and are still suffering them today in every single town, village and city in the world?

This story was really distressing. I've experienced a not dissimilar situation in this country - we're not even allowed to question men in women's sports. It's industrial-scale gaslighting. I completely despair for women's sports.
Many women go along with it because they are utterly terrified of being branded transphobic or they have convinced themselves transwomen are a vulnerable minority who must have everything opened up to them.

EfingNora · Today 06:56

Quote from the article "Trans rights advocates argue for the inclusion of an already marginalized group that has faced historic discrimination, and threats to their lives."

Threats to their lives? Bit like that "decapitate terfs" sign threatening women then. Don't they realise that threats of death and other violence are just a normal part of being a woman?

That's also the part of the article I felt was most salient, I thought, "What? Women?"

If you are allowed and supported in being allowed into a sport, in a category in which you shouldn't have any entitlement, it doesn't really shout marginalised, does it? Or being allowed to make the most disturbing threats online and to rarely be sanctioned. Or to stand next to politicians, with signs calling for murder and to get away with it. Or to assault women, as the Police spectate and threaten to arrest the victim.

No, to me, that doesn't say marginalised, or discriminated against; it says "Allowed to discriminate, with powerful support."

That. LGBTWhatever no longer means a widely diverse group of people with only homosexuality in common. It now means a group of people of any sexuality with a political belief in common.

Hence the endless attempts to redefine homophobia into being a sin committed by homosexuals against male people by saying that sex exists and they are not homogenderal.

Yes. This is always the thing. They’re not being excluded. They’re just not getting to choose to compete in the category of their choice. it’s just the same as deciding you identify as under 10 so you can compete against the little kids rather than other 15 year olds.

That’s not exclusion. Exclusion is when you can’t do something, not when you don’t like the rules much.

Thank you. We need more to stand up against this discrimination against women and to reject the false teaming with homosexuality.