Am I Reading This Right?... Rosie Duffield Throwing KJK Under The Bus?!

Off-topic. Can somebody tell me if 'search' is malfunctioning or why it doesn't return any posts for the OP's name? Is that what happens when someone de-registers or has the search gone awry?

This is relying on the girl telling the truth.

The girl knows there will be huge consequences if she discloses sexual abuse from a family member so inventing a boyfriend is a preferable option.

There isn't an easy answer.

Or are people going to just make attempts, either sly or overt, to present Kellie Jay Keen as not supporting abortions and other twisted interpretations?

Parents should always be part of the discussion - yes, other services and adults too, but that child still has to live with her parents. What a nightmare scenario if she is constantly having to hide the truth.

If parents are at fault, I don't see how excluding them makes that any better, it's far more likely to cause more problems. If they are involved with discussion with other adults and other services far more likely that if parents are at fault they will be held accountable. If they're overly religious, it's far more likely their stance will change if they're involved with other adults pointing out the harms this is having for their child. For most people love of their child will override most other things, especially if given the chance to be part of the conversation.

I simply don't see the benefit to the child of the parents being deliberately excluded from the conversation and it will put a burden of deceit upon her which seems almost abusive in itself.

The only situation in which I can see that not telling the parents is ok is if the parents are the ones having sex with the child in which case they should be arrested and jailed and parental responsibility removed.

If parental responsiblity is not being removed, they should be part of the conversation, anything else is a safeguarding failure. Safeguarding is meant to be a shared endeavour and if you're hiding relevant information about safeguarding (and a child going on the pill is definitely that) from one of the parties with greatest responsibility for safeguarding, you are making it impossible for them to safeguard appropriately.

So, have we worked out yet what KJK did and did not say??

Just a reminder :

Tweets from 9/3/3023 19.27.

“The issue of consent is that one leak leads to many. When thinking about how we’ve got here, a place where schools are able to socially transition kids behind their parents back, it’s essential to rigorously examine all of the mechanisms that may have assisted.”

“This does not mean I endorse any kind of forced birth. Ever. But I cannot ignore that child traffickers have been able to exploit laws that enable vulnerable girls to be abused.I cannot ignore that it’s not only at risk under sixteen year olds that are given the pill. Without parents knowledge”

“There may well be a more appropriate way of protecting vulnerable girls without creating deceit in all families.”

”This idea of consent is dangerous and open to all sorts of abuses.”

”We should be careful to vigilantly monitor unintended consequences.”

Here’s how the conversation could go:

GP- are you aware that I cannot guarantee confidentiality if you disclose something which I may be obligated to raised safeguarding concerns about.

Girl- Please don’t tell my parents

GP - why don’t you want your parents to know?

Girl - they are really strict and religious- they’ll make my life hell, I am worried I will be forced to keep the baby.

or

Girl - it’s just that. It’s someone in the family and they said they’ll hurt my dog if anyone finds out.

or

Girl - my parents don’t know I’ve got a boyfriend and I don’t want them to.

So dependent on what she says, the GP can make an assessment on whether to inform the parents directly or to go through social services and let them handle it.

To have the principal that parents should be informed if their daughter is having underage sex/statutory rape doesn’t mean that the girl should be needlessly put at risk. The parents should be always be involved in these important matters unless there are safeguarding reasons for intervention and overriding of their parental responsibility in that case.

When one of my close in my family was raped as a child, it was indeed the grandfather and that man threatened the child if they told. The parents were unaware and would have acted quickly and decisively to stop the abuse and support the child.

In the situation with another family member, the mother was absolutely complicit in the abuse.

Assuming the worst of the parents is sometimes right and sometimes wrong.

I refuse to believe that the only choices are forced birth for tweens OR total sexual autonomy from 8 years onwards.

Well said, it's ludicrous and I note the people trying to force team children going on the pill with adults are not agitating for children to be able to drink and drive, open a bank account on their own or work a full-time job. Apparently it's only when it comes to sex with adults that child autonomy is important.

I'm so sorry you were failed by so many adults @RaininginDarling 💐

Thank you for showing what the rest of us are trying to say.

Not sure I put it well before but simply - the pill and abortion for CHILDREN is not the same as the pill and abortion for ADULTS. Conflating the two, as if adults being able to choose freely is the same as children and it's exactly the same issue to be discussed, with no mention of safeguarding, is a paedophile's agenda, frankly and anti-safeguarding.

Anyone who bangs on about 'anti-choice' when talking about safeguarding 12 year olds rather than letting them just go on the pill whenever they want is dodgy as anything and should be ashamed of throwing children under the bus for their political agenda.

You think that most mothers are aware and complicit when their daughter is being abused by the dad, brother, uncle or grandfather?

I don't know about most mothers but definitely some. Horribly, there is often willful blindness in this situation, especially when the mother is in a relationship with the perpetrator.

Seconded.

Much love to you @RaininginDarling 💐

Thank you for sharing with us - hearing from survivors of childhood sexual abuse definitely helps strengthen one’s resolve in pushing back against policies that enable adult predators.

There must surely be a way to ringfence access to abortion whilst minimising the secrecy that groomers and paedos rely on to operate.

I refuse to believe that the only choices are forced birth for tweens OR total sexual autonomy from 8 years onwards.

This - 100 times this.

Absolutely parents should be involved.

Absolutely if they're not then some men will seek to exploit this situation so they can groom and rape 12 year olds.

Absolutely I am pro-choice but a 12 year old girl is a CHILD. They cannot make choices about other aspects of their life (driving, drinking), why can they make adult decisions about this? Who does it benefit. They should have to have a conversation with a trusted adult who genuinely has their best interests at heart before they go on the pill. Not a rushed off their feet medic, or anyone who could be invested in statutory child rape. This is safeguarding.

The pill has side effects, it's not consequence free and putting a CHILD who hasn't even completed puberty on a drug like that so a man can have sex with her isn't that progressive, really.

Parents, in general, are more likely to have their child's best interests at heart than pretty much anyone else.

You think that most mothers are aware and complicit when their daughter is being abused by the dad, brother, uncle or grandfather?

The vast majority of little girls do. The vast majority of children grow up in loving, caring protective families, and of those who are abused, their parents would be devastated by knowledge of it.

This is so naive.

If a 12 year old girl falls pregnant something has gone very wrong in her loving, caring, protective family.

She needs urgent intervention from social services and a safe adult who can she disclose the abuse to. The perpetrator may well be her dad, brother, uncle or grandfather.

I definitely do not assume that all do and I think it’s absolutely fucking tragic for those who do not and they should be properly supported by social services, not left in the ‘care’ of their rapist.

Thankfully, the vast majority of children do have at least one supportive, responsible female adult in their lives even if she isn’t a blood relative.

It’s so moving to read your post @RaininginDarling .

It’s so important that even the vaguest concerns are raised.

The vast majority of little girls do. The vast majority of children grow up in loving, caring protective families, and of those who are abused, their parents would be devastated by knowledge of it.

It is essential that social services look for help within the family first for the sake of the child’s continuity of care and welfare, rather than make the assumption that all families are bad/complicit. This distrust of parents and families being stirred up is troubling. Especially since this distrust seems to be stirred up by the same people who oppose child safeguarding…. 👀

Which reference?

I was just thinking that

well not quite that but that its obviously not ‘most’ parents

Raining.

Thank you for your post.

It must be a lovely bubble to live in when you assume all 12 year old girls have a kindly mum / auntie / big sister to hold their hand while they have an abortion and who will always have the child's best interests at heart.

So I ask again.

You seem to have argued that she said that abusive parents should have authority over their child.

I would like to see you post her saying what you have accused her of please.

Back in the 70s/80s, when I was being abused as a child, adults in positions of power: police, teachers, relatives didn't want to know. Literally, shut me down. The strength it took to even try to get help when I blamed myself for the terrible things that had happened to me and the defeat of being left unheard and minimised will always stay with me.

I now appreciate that many adults don't want to engage because it is too awful to think about so they change the subject or engage in whataboutery.

It strikes me this current debate has very similar vibes. The need to pretend children as young as 10 or 12 are fully capable of making informed decisions on their own about their sex and fertility. Strong 'I don't want to think about the alternative' vibes when actually the mature stance might be led by curiosity and concern.

Those who are twisting this to say its anti-abortion or anti birth control are royally missing the point. But I suspect that's just a bad faith interpretation because engaging with reality brings you close to having to look into the darkest corners of human nature.

I have found this particularly true, ironically, of people whose job it is to safeguard children.

Just an observation.

Just going to paste the tweets from KJK clarifying her stance.

Tweets from 9/3/3023 19.27.

“The issue of consent is that one leak leads to many. When thinking about how we’ve got here, a place where schools are able to socially transition kids behind their parents back, it’s essential to rigorously examine all of the mechanisms that may have assisted.”

“This does not mean I endorse any kind of forced birth. Ever. But I cannot ignore that child traffickers have been able to exploit laws that enable vulnerable girls to be abused.I cannot ignore that it’s not only at risk under sixteen year olds that are given the pill. Without parents knowledge”

“There may well be a more appropriate way of protecting vulnerable girls without creating deceit in all families.”

”This idea of consent is dangerous and open to all sorts of abuses.”

”We should be careful to vigilantly monitor unintended consequences.”

Absolutely.

imagine having a abortion, medical or surgical, as a tween or young teen without your mum, nanna, female guardian, auntie, big sister or similar to hold your hand, not just on the day but in the weeks, months and even years after.

Abortion should be available to all women who want to access it, but no matter how easy it is to access, it doesn’t make it an easier process to go through, physically and mentally it can take a sizeable toll on your well-being and it’s not something most adult women would want to go through completely on her tod, let alone a raped kid.