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Original poster

Trans Widows are the only mothers of our children.

472 replies

TinselAngel · 27/02/2023 17:06

I don't want this claim by @bathhy to get lost in a thread that will no doubt go along the usual lines.

"As a trans woman mother who uses Mumsnet, I would never recommend coming here."

Trans women can never be the mother of any child. We women, the trans widows who are usually your exes, who give birth to those children are their mother and always will be.

If you adopt a child, you can be the child's parent, but as a male you are not the child's mother.

Trans widows say no to having our status and legal responsibility as mother taken from us.

Women here must not allow forced teaming from men who wish to appropriate our status as the mothers of our children.

Every woman here should consider how they would feel if the father of their child after having taken so much from them already, then demanded to be called "Mum."

OP posts:
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7
Vintagevixen · 27/02/2023 22:05

Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/02/2023 22:03

Why is that relevant?

It's not relevant at all but unfortunately he can't see that.

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 22:05

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 22:03

Do you deadname?

Show quote history

What’s that got to do with men not being able to be mothers? I have always treated trans people with respect and call them by whatever name they wish to be called, as I do with anyone I meet. Doesn’t mean I think they can change sex, because they can’t.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 27/02/2023 22:04

Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/02/2023 22:03

Why is that relevant?

maybe some bloke's changed his name to 'mother'?

at this point I just dunno

Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/02/2023 22:03

Why is that relevant?

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 22:03

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 22:02

No, because a trans woman can never be a mother, because they are a man. Rudeness doesn’t come in to it.

Show quote history

Do you deadname?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/02/2023 22:02

There's no reason why MTF trans people can't be adoptive fathers. Mother is a term for a biologically female person in a parenting role.

Clymene · 27/02/2023 22:02

Here's a link on another thread to 'Della's Law' which will be debated in parliament later this week to prevent sex offenders from changing their name: Della's Law - ask your MP to support banning sex offenders from changing their name UK www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4748640-dellas-law-ask-your-mp-to-support-banning-sex-offenders-from-changing-their-name-uk?msgid=-4748640#-4748640

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 22:02

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:54

But if you’re going to accept a lesbian who hasn’t birthed a baby can be called “mother”, and I assume you wouldn’t be so rude as to call a transwoman by their deadname, then surely the transwoman can also called the mother”.

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No, because a trans woman can never be a mother, because they are a man. Rudeness doesn’t come in to it.

Vintagevixen · 27/02/2023 21:58

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Clymene · 27/02/2023 21:57

Gosh that is very interesting @LangClegsInSpace

RedToothBrush · 27/02/2023 21:56

No. Only females are mothers.

Cos sex not gender.

Children need to learn and understand sex from birth.

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:54

SpudleyLass · 27/02/2023 21:52

But neither of them are male, who definitely cannot have given birth.

They have more right to be called a mother, from where I'm sitting.

Show quote history

But if you’re going to accept a lesbian who hasn’t birthed a baby can be called “mother”, and I assume you wouldn’t be so rude as to call a transwoman by their deadname, then surely the transwoman can also called the mother”.

SpudleyLass · 27/02/2023 21:52

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:39

Yeah, but one of them didn’t birth the baby.

Show quote history

But neither of them are male, who definitely cannot have given birth.

They have more right to be called a mother, from where I'm sitting.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 27/02/2023 21:50

LangClegsInSpace · 27/02/2023 21:41

According to this, from the UK government, adoptive parents are not listed as 'mother' or 'father' on adoption certificates, they are simply referred to as 'parent(s)'.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/800942/Note_for_parents_Mar_2019__4_.pdf

So you are legally recognised as your son's parent, but not as his mother.

Show quote history

that makes complete sense if you assume that 'mother' in the context of birth certificates has a very specific meaning

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:47

Vintagevixen · 27/02/2023 21:45

@MadamAndTheAnts back to Twitter please - byeee!

im fine here thanks

Vintagevixen · 27/02/2023 21:45

@MadamAndTheAnts back to Twitter please - byeee!

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 21:44

LangClegsInSpace · 27/02/2023 21:41

According to this, from the UK government, adoptive parents are not listed as 'mother' or 'father' on adoption certificates, they are simply referred to as 'parent(s)'.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/800942/Note_for_parents_Mar_2019__4_.pdf

So you are legally recognised as your son's parent, but not as his mother.

Show quote history

How interesting.

LangClegsInSpace · 27/02/2023 21:41

Bathhy · 27/02/2023 20:03

Is it different for adoption certificates? Are you recorded as your adoptive child's mother?

Yes, it is different for adoption certificates and yes I am legally recognized as my son's mother.

Show quote history

According to this, from the UK government, adoptive parents are not listed as 'mother' or 'father' on adoption certificates, they are simply referred to as 'parent(s)'.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/800942/Note_for_parents_Mar_2019__4_.pdf

So you are legally recognised as your son's parent, but not as his mother.

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 21:40

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:39

Yeah, but one of them didn’t birth the baby.

Show quote history

A man can never birth a baby so 🤷‍♀️

MadamAndTheAnts · 27/02/2023 21:39

SpudleyLass · 27/02/2023 19:03

Only transwomen are men and have not gone through 9 months of pregnancy and then child birth, both of which can be incredibly dangerous for both mother and child.

Lesbians are not men and as either one of them could have birthed the baby, I wouldn't presume to know, so calling them both mothers is just fine.

Show quote history

Yeah, but one of them didn’t birth the baby.

Helleofabore · 27/02/2023 21:22

I cannot imagine the realisation of a child who even with the best will in the world, understands that they have been lied to. Whether it starts early or it is in adulthood. It will come.

Trust will be forever damaged by a ‘lie’ that a ‘mother’ can be male.

IcakethereforeIam · 27/02/2023 21:18

@Bathhy I appreciate that you've been willing to indulge our curiosity a little, obviously you were under no obligation to do that. So, thank you. I think very few of the posters on these boards, if any, think that 'trans women' are always up to something sinister. I mean, who has the time!

Eyerollcentral · 27/02/2023 21:04

Clymene · 27/02/2023 21:00

@Eyerollcentral - the idiocy of the current system is thwr it is up to the individual to decide whether or not to disclose their former identities or indeed the sex recorded on their birth certificate they were given at birth.

It is an abuser's charter (and I'm just making it abundantly clear here that I'm not accusing anyone of that).

That is terrifying and at the same time pathetically negligent. But adoption goes beyond just a DBS. @bathy or any other adoptive parents must be able to tell us if they were required to provide any previous names at any stage of the process. Surely an application to become an adoptive parent requires a declaration that the information provided is true, which would be false if a trans person did not include their birth name along with any others when asked for previous names?

OttersMayHaveShiftedInTransit · 27/02/2023 21:01

picklemewalnuts · 27/02/2023 20:59

Yep, and @lifeturnsonadime . I worded it poorly. It can be read both ways.

Sorry Walnuts I see what you meant but it didn't read that way to me on my first reading.

Clymene · 27/02/2023 21:00

@Eyerollcentral - the idiocy of the current system is thwr it is up to the individual to decide whether or not to disclose their former identities or indeed the sex recorded on their birth certificate they were given at birth.

It is an abuser's charter (and I'm just making it abundantly clear here that I'm not accusing anyone of that).

Trans Widows are the only mothers of our children.