KJK opposing fertility treatment for gay couples

@SapphosRock so must single women fund it for themselves. Why do lesbians have more of a right to IVF than a single straight woman?

These are the criteria for IVF on the NHS:

According to NICE, women aged under 40 should be offered 3 cycles of IVF treatment on the NHS if:
• they've been trying to get pregnant through regular unprotected sex for 2 years
• they've not been able to get pregnant after 12 cycles of artificial insemination, with at least 6 of the cycles using a method called intrauterine insemination (IUI))_

Lesbians do not meet those criteria.

Err…. Unexplained infertility is a fertility problem. Lesbians being able to create a baby together is not unexplained fertility. It’s very much explained.

The inability of two people of the same sex to conceive is not unexplained infertility.

I don’t see that as homophobic.
If a lesbian had a male friend they want to have a baby with, but were unable to due to medical infertility, they would be able to access fertility treatment the same as a straight woman.

The difference is the NHS provide fertility treatment for people/couple who are unable to have children due to medical infertility. Having a partner not of the same sex as you is not a medical issue.

Straight couples are offered it after invasive tests to prove one or both are infertile. Not if both are fertile. If you’re fertile and you want IVF or IUI you have to pay. Are you saying lesbians should have more rights than single straight women. They also have to pay if they are fertile.

Not being able to conceive with the person you love is very much a fertility issue.

If one of you is an adult human male, and the other is an adult human female then not being able to conceive is a fertility issue.

If it's a same-sex couple who think there's a fertility issue which is stopping them, they've got a shock coming.

Looks to me like KJK is in fact pointing out that clarity is always needed. If we talk about same-sex couple having "fertility issues" then we get goaded further down the surrogacy road than we do if we talk about opposite-sex couples with that actual issue.

It's useful for being clear about the intentions and consequences of words and campaigns. It's like pushing back against saying "gender" when we mean "sex". Except in this instance, it's a very helpful reminder of the tragedy of surrogacy, which is not a solution to fertility issues for same-sex or opposite-sex couples, but a trade in human misery.

As I clearly said very quickly in the follow up post, I was referring to treatment through the NHS or a UK fertility clinic. Where, by law, in the UK the donor has to be ID release. That doesn’t depend on the country the donor came from - for example, sperm can be donated in the USA without being ID release, but that cannot be purchased in the UK for use through the NHS or a fertility clinic.

The post I was replying to suggested heavily that the NHS could provide treatment using anonymous sperm. That is not correct.

I can assure you I’ve spent plenty of time on the donor conception board.

This^^

It's just a fact she's stated that technically is correct.

I am talking about gay equality. If you support lesbians having equal rights then you would support the NHS treating them the same as heterosexual couples.

Does the NHS give free fertility treatment to hetroexual couples who don't have a diagnosed fertility problem? If the answer is no then you are being treated equally.

I'm very sorry to hear this, reoccurring miscarriage must be horrific and exhausting. No infertile/miscarriages are caused by being same sex attracted and the methods of getting pregnant available to you are obviously more expensive and less impulsive than a heterosexual relationship.

Which may have been the intent. I find the whole thing very suspicious.

Argue with her in good faith. I don't agree with everything she says. I don't agree with everything anyone says, including myself.

Yes @SapphosRock - why have you included a quote tweet in your OP?

Really it's a bit pathetic of you

From what I know of her she is very strong on stating things that are fact, without dancing around them.

You referring to her as being “tone deaf” however I suspect she would view it as just stating a fact.

I think if people are upset at being told that two people of the same sex can’t biologically reproduce then the issue is with them and the way they are dealing with reality. Most people simply accept this.

Through a clinic

A U.K. clinic yes. I recommend the BBC Podcast called Male Order for arrangements made with sperm donors outside of HFEA regulated clinics.

I agree. It's a good job that the tweet you are referring to wasn't posted by Kelly Jay. I hope we can also agree that as she didn't write it she is not responsible for the homophobia contained within it.

The law dictates that any donor child in the UK (NHS or private) can access details of their donor when they turn 18.

Only if they are donor conceived with a donor who has ID release. Check out the donor conception board for more on this.

There are children living in the U.K. who will not have access to that information by law, they may never know who donated gametes to conceive them. It relies on ID release and the laws of where the gametes originated from.

Yes this would be artificially assisted reproduction rather than infertility.

For 2 Males this means surrogacy
For 2 females sperm donor and iui or ivf.

KjK is quite right.

Which tweet are you talking about because you appear to be conflating JJKs tweet with the person retweeting her?