KJK opposing fertility treatment for gay couples

Love Julia. And KJK

I meant in person! Germaine Greer was (sadly) experiencing her peak cancellation years when I first started paying attention (2017/2018).

If Dr Long is the first feminist you saw saying trans women are men out loud without apology then you need to brush up on Germaine Greer.

Me too.

Love Dr Julia.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=NkO5taktmfc

I can’t get ‘live’ videos from YouTube to embed in a MN post, so here’s a link and screen shot.

Ngl - all those ladies singing made my eyes a bit wet.

Lovely to see Dr Julia Long leading the crowd through the loudhailer - Julia has long been my favourite voice in all this, on the trans issue, on the sexual exploitation of women via prostitution and reproductive exploitation via surrogacy.

Dr Long is the first feminist I ever saw say, out loud, matter of factly, without a hint of apology, ‘Transwomen are men’.

objectnow.org/about/

Julia Long is a Radical, Lesbian Feminist so I very much doubt she’d be there, literally cheering for KJK, as she walks into the police station, if she agreed with Sappho’s accusations that KJK is a lesbophobe/homophobe.

Here’s Julia on the Savage Minds podcast:

podtail.com/en/podcast/savage-minds-podcast/julia-long/

It's pretty much the same story with puberty blockers / cross sex hormones and gender reassignment surgeries.

Yes the parallels weren't lost on me. It's easy to claim there is no evidence of detriment if you haven't collected any data.

The section on stem cell research and diabetes treatment is the terrifying part. How long before we see start considering exploitation of the world's most economically disadvantaged women, to cure disease, as a necessary evil?

I'd be amazed if they weren't already doing this.

It's a hard to believe that there are NO long term studies about the effects of donating eggs.

It's incredible isn't it?

Presumably they can get away with this because there is such strong ongoing demand for these treatments and unscrupulous clinicians are prepared to go ahead with them despite the lack of evidence because $$$$$$$$$$.

It's pretty much the same story with puberty blockers / cross sex hormones and gender reassignment surgeries.

Thank you to the person who posted the link to the Eggsploitation documentary. In an age of gender affirmation treatment you'd think nothing could shock me about the state of medical ethics but I am shocked and frightened by the documentary.

It's a hard to believe that there are NO long term studies about the effects of donating eggs. I appreciate the documentary is US based and the women who appeared in the documentary MAY represent a tiny proportion of the women who donate eggs but without any long term studies we simply do not know that. When the possible effects include internal bleeding, ovarian torsion, stroke, cancer, future infertility and death we should make knowing how many women are affected a priority. How can anyone give informed consent without this information?

The section on stem cell research and diabetes treatment is the terrifying part. How long before we see start considering exploitation of the world's most economically disadvantaged women, to cure disease, as a necessary evil?

Did I say that? Did I say anyone shouldn't post or have access to their social media accounts? Where please? Quote it.

Or did I say I thought it was BS? Am I not allowed to disagree? Do I need to call the free speech police?

Her statement wasn’t ambiguous though. Her meaning was really clear

Evidently you want KJK to stop having takes though. Weird.

If your patience is wearing thin, turn twitter off for a while! People don't have to stop having takes because it annoys other people

I thought it was in relation to Paris Hilton?

She's not a gay man is she?

People are so quick to shout 'phobia' at every fucking conversation these days people's patience with the thought police is wearing so, so thin.

Oh boo hoo no one is impeding anyone's free speech ffs, I'm simply saying if you choose to make ambiguous statements that sound kind of homophobic, it's not surprising that homophobic people will be drawn to it.

No it’s not semantics. Words have meaning. Two fertile people of the same sex do not need infertility treatment. They are fertile. They need assisted reproduction to have a baby. That’s a totally different thing. Trying to call it a fertility issue is dishonest.

I think you are determined to see homophobia where there is none. People are allowed to speak on any subject they want. They don’t have to do it in a way you think you be proper and it’s really odd that you would think that it would be appropriate.

Again though, this is semantics. Same sex couples are part of the group of people which would also include people with fertility issues, who cannot conceive naturally.

So as I said, if discussing surrogacy I'm not focusing on the reasons why someone can't have a baby, I don't really care to differentiate as that's not the focus of the conversation. So to me it's telling that someone would feel the need to do so.

So how is the tweet to be taken in isolation a commentary about surrogacy?

If you're going to write stuff that can easily be construed as homophobic, it's not surprising that it's going to appeal to homophobes. I imagine most non homophobic people who were genuinely interested in conversations about women's rights and surrogacy would be actually speaking on that. But I don't know who this person is so maybe there is a different context.

Tbf a good deal of people even in the past didn’t come in to the world as a result of a lifelong partnership between loving parents. The difference is the advances in fertility technology and the £££ that can be made from it.

Where does this recent 'right' to have a baby come from?

A baby used to be considered a happy byproduct of a lifelong partnership between two parents.

Thing is when we talk about people have any kind of “right” to be a parent or have a baby, it’s very difficult if the only way they can do so is by use of someone else’s body or body parts.

When you consider it that way it does seem dubious...

It’s not a fertility problem for gay couples, it’s a biology problem. It would be incorrect to label it as a fertility problem. Two people of the same sex cannot conceive. No one has a right to have a baby.

She didn't did she? She said that it wasn't a fertility issue. Which it isn't because fertile women or men don't need investigating for the causes of non ability to conceive. The issue is lack of the opposite gamete.

Which is not a fertility issue.