"periods: a genderless function" FFS!!!

Yes, just drop the 'identity' nonsense altogether. It seems to make you unhappy, it annoys other people, and it's unnecessary.

Be an individual instead of an identity.

And no one is trying to argue that we should allow astral bodies into the Oscars or make celebrities use an entirely different termonologyvor give up rights (e.g. press intrusion). There isn't really a new definition of woman. TRAs are just trying to bully one through.

Star and moon are not the same though and using the same word for both "adastral object " is uncommon

The context of words is clear then no problem

• so woman could mean a type of plant and adult human female

What it shouldn't mean and adult human female or adult human male

Yes I see what you mean.

Perhaps a better analogy for the situation we're discussing would be "star". It can mean some sort of astronomical body. It can mean a celebrity. Those are quite different meanings of the same word.

However, within the astronomical-body sense, it can be used scientifically to refer to very distant bodies of hydrogen fusing to form helium, or it can be used more colloquially to include anything glowing in the night sky including planets, comets shooting "stars".

Anyway, words can clearly have multiple, overlapping or conflicting meanings. And I don't think there's any point raging about editors of dictionaries, or how dreadful and illogical their definitions are. Dictionaries just record usage. To fight the changing mean of the words man and woman you really need to stop people using them in novel ways (not that you need reminding!).

Or another way since this seems hard for some to understand

My identity excludes " women " as an identity

Now

Do I say I am a woman meaning biology and leave people thinking it's my identity?

But My identity is personal to me and important

And I have suffered direct harm through people making none biological assumptions about me because they assume I have a specific identity on account if my sex

I have spent a god part of my life showing people that my identity is not my sex

And you are asking me to undo al I have stood for and striven for ?

Reading the definition carefully it does not include anyone who does not wish to be assumed to identify as a woman

Many women are in fact rather against the idea that women is an identity- that it describe something other than biology - that expecting them to be associated with woman as identities is hurtful and disrespectful

Let's try a thought experiment
If someone changed the word innocent to mean people who were not guilty or people who thought themselves innocent but were in fact guilty , would you want to call yourself innocent when asked if you AHF committed a crime? Would you take the risk ?

Me too. When someone says "nuance" they are actually saying "too complicated for you to understand".

I'd love to know what they mean by "bodily reasons".

You need to read the definition carefully iI think @babyjellyfish - you are still included.

Yes, it's a nonsense argument.

And not even a word coincidence, it's just taking it! Taking an existing word and slapping it on a concept they just made up. Ta da!

Like the unicorn and the horse with a plunger on it's head. Two unicorns innit.

Indeed. Oscar has (a) actually being a woman, and (b) not identifying as a woman, in common with the majority of women. Almost as if Oscar isn't that different to the rest of us after all.

Well, yes, that's the point I was making.

If "woman" can now mean EITHER "adult human female" OR "person of either sex who believes their gender identity is woman", it has two completely unrelated meanings, and people falling within these definitions are two separate and unrelated groups, not one group.

By your logic, the fact that the word "sole" can mean either a type of fish or the bottom of a shoe means that these two things have something in common. Other than both using the word "sole", they don't. And we can tell from the context whether we are talking about fish or shoes, so using the same word for both doesn't cause any particular problems.

Male people who use the word "woman" to refer to themselves are causing a problem because they would have us believe that they have something in common with adult human females and are therefore entitled to use our spaces and compete in our sports.

Nope. The new definition excludes anyone who, like me, doesn't "identify as" anything.

And even if I did identify as something, I still do not have even the faintest clue what trans women are identifying with, so how could we possibly share any kind of identity?

So it’s not a definition, then.

One job. A dictionary has one job….

Erm… this is just insane.

So today the Tate and modibodi have shown themselves to hold some pretty strange views…

"This nuanced topic..." - is this the first sighting of nuance on that side of the debate?

Transmen would be better off with counselling to enable them to confront the reality of their bodies rather than rewriting logic and science out of the whole conversation. This is just ‘x upsets me so you all have to talk about it differently. Doesn’t change whether I have a period or not, does confuse the narrative substantially, hurting the slow path to women and girls being treated like humans , but I want it this way.’

Just had a little look at Modibodi's IG, Which is covered in "period pants for all genders" shite. Nope. Another brand off the list. Why is it so hard for manufacturers of products for women to accept that their customers are women?

If woman is everyone female bodied and grown up, then Oscar is a woman. If woman is those people who identify as women, then most women aren't one. This either or does not make sense.

No. I don't identify as a woman. I have called myself it whilst it's a biological term. Nothing to dobwith identity.

I can't accept a definition that could imply that it's my identity

And I can't accept a definition that is not a definition but a set of options because that's not a definition

The way the definition is structured in that dictionary it's either/or.

Ducking hell.

I always quite admired ModiBodi as a brand.

Not after this.

It could, but see my previous answer to this question!

Pretty sure a definition that relies on how you identify will exclude a large number of those previously known as women because they don't see it as part of their identity

It's not my identity, nearer a curse or affliction

Look at the definition - I'm pretty sure that it includes you.