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Original poster

Online misogyny set to be outlawed

54 replies

MidsomerMurmurs · 04/02/2023 11:34

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/02/03/online-misogyny-set-outlawed/

Misogynistic abuse should be banned online, the Government believes.

Michelle Donelan, the Culture Secretary, is understood to believe the Online Safety Bill has the power to stamp out attacks on women on the internet.

Under the new Online Safety Bill, currently being finalised, social media firms will be required by law to abide by their terms and conditions, which generally bar misogynistic abuse. Failure to enforce them will result in fines, and their services could be blocked by Ofcom, the online watchdog.

Interesting to compare to the Scottish Government’s approach to misogyny, and what sort of concerns are “valid”. Also interesting that there is an amendment which the government might have to accept:

However, a group of Tory peers including Baroness Morgan; Baroness Bertin, a former aide to David Cameron; and Baroness Newlove, a former victims’ commissioner, plan to put forward an amendment that would see the law go further.

The amendment would give Ofcom the power to fine social media companies up to 10 per cent of their global turnover if they failed to abide by a code outlawing online misogyny. The Labour Party will back it, raising the prospect that the Government may have to compromise or face defeat.

OP posts:
Middlelanehogger · 18/08/2023 16:54

BigglyBee · 04/02/2023 12:01

I think you are probably right. More laws are unlikely to be the answer here. They will just end up being more sticks to beat women with.

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100%.

Sausagenbacon · 18/08/2023 16:53

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.
this

aurorauk · 18/08/2023 16:38

yes make misogyny a hate crime FINALLY but also actually convict rapists too.

Slothtoes · 04/02/2023 20:54

Woman isn’t defined anywhere in UK law as far as I understand it. I doubt that an Act regulating online speech will be the one to do that especially in the current climate.

If the 2010 Equality Act is amended to make clear the difference between biological sex and gender identity politics then job done, we’ll be back to sex based protections surely. Male people couldn’t use misogyny laws to cover themselves.

I agree about proliferation of laws being undesirable (and unnecessary, nonsensical or outdated and problem-causing laws like GRA should be scrapped IMO) but hate speech laws really aren’t the cause of hate. That’s not logical. There’s hate speech laws for other protected characteristics already so why not an anti sexist law that recognises misogyny?

Why is it better NOT to have hate speech protections for women? What advantage exactly does the status quo give us? When women are being driven off social media or made to feel like shit by threatening comments purely on basis of their sex. When increasingly taking part in digital life is essential for social and professional inclusion, employers expect a personal digital presence from their employees, business owners are expected to be visible online and so on?

There’s no way that the existing multiple hate speech legislation in the UK will be repealed. That ship has sailed. So since they do exist for other PCs and they will continue to do so.. and with Equality Act clarification so men can’t use misogyny laws as a weapon against women, and where women want and need to be able to operate freely as men in the digital world, this seems a good move to me.

BlessedKali · 04/02/2023 20:32

They need to concentrate on making rape illegal by actually fucking convicting rapists rather than looking at online speech, especially when definitions are difficult, and men are now sometimes considered to be women

BellaAmorosa · 04/02/2023 20:29

@Slothtoes
Hate crime type laws just create resentment and redound on the group supposedly being protected.
I'm also against the proliferation of legislation.

Also
If the UK’s 201 equality act is sorted out then you won’t get TW misusing laws intended for biological women any more. So if that’s your concern make sure you sign the Sex Matters petition.

Who counts as a woman, what counts as misogyny is, etc - those are questions which would be decided by the wording of the new Act, I would imagine. Norway's anti-misogyny legislation protects only men who claim to be women, and women not at all.

BellaAmorosa · 04/02/2023 20:19

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

I agree.

OneMorePlant · 04/02/2023 18:08

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

Agree completely

NicolaSturgeonsSOGIbottom · 04/02/2023 17:36

This is road to hell, good intentions situation, I suspect.

nilsmousehammer · 04/02/2023 15:18

It will indeed be yet another stick for men to beat women with.

Original poster
MidsomerMurmurs · 04/02/2023 13:39

ResisterRex · 04/02/2023 12:11

I agree. I read that article with a heavy heart. You just know the usual suspects will be wasting parliamentary time with trying to make it "gender" based and to sneak "gender identity" through with it.

I fear the very, very worst.

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Will they be able to “do a Dentons” now though? After the last two weeks, aren’t the implications of “gender” being talked about more widely? I’m naturally very sceptical about the online safety bill, but it does seem that something has changed in the last few days.

OP posts:
purpledalmation · 04/02/2023 12:39

All we need now is violent porn to follow the same way. It's misogyny at its worst.

SomethingLikeThisNow · 04/02/2023 12:37

If it does what it says on the tin half the internet will shut down.

But most likely it will be women at the recieving end for men's hurt feelings

thedankness · 04/02/2023 12:36

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

Agree. Hate crime legislation is inconsistently applied restrictions on free speech.

Why does it only apply to social media sites? Will it apply to YouTube and not PornHub? Because porn is misogynistic abuse but I'm guessing this bill will not close down Pornhub when every video on there gets reported.

Would love it if that were the case though.

Slothtoes · 04/02/2023 12:33

I’m happy to see this.
I don’t think the present situation is working for girls and women <massive understatement> so I’m very pleased that this is being raised.

Pleased also that the global online platforms who make gazillions with absolutely no responsibility towards their users might have to start moderating and removing the vile threats and abuse that women get. That is the absolute least they can do. Shameful that they need to be legally forced into it.

If the UK’s 201 equality act is sorted out then you won’t get TW misusing laws intended for biological women any more. So if that’s your concern make sure you sign the Sex Matters petition.

OnlyTheWeedsGrow · 04/02/2023 12:26

Why only online?

Mollyollydolly · 04/02/2023 12:12

A few years ago I'd have said great. Now I just think it would be a tool for someone like India Willoughby to send the police to my door.

ResisterRex · 04/02/2023 12:11

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

I agree. I read that article with a heavy heart. You just know the usual suspects will be wasting parliamentary time with trying to make it "gender" based and to sneak "gender identity" through with it.

I fear the very, very worst.

BigglyBee · 04/02/2023 12:01

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

I think you are probably right. More laws are unlikely to be the answer here. They will just end up being more sticks to beat women with.

BigglyBee · 04/02/2023 12:00

I have no faith at all on this being fairly applied and enforced. All that will happen is that SM companies will be so scared of the fines that nobody will be allowed to say anything. And by "nobody" I mean "no women", obviously.

That's before you consider the likelihood of it being turned round on women and deliberately used to silence us/protect TW.

JacquelinePot · 04/02/2023 11:56

Hate crime legislation needs to be repealed, not extended.

Threats, harassment and incitement are rightly illegal already but anything beyond that is too vague, broad and open to bad interpretation. I don't believe that this will help women.

Abccde · 04/02/2023 11:53

If misogyny now has a different meaning then it needs to be clear what that meaning is.

nilsmousehammer · 04/02/2023 11:52

I am now very convinced that no law is better than another bad law that a bunch of transactivists will then warp and exploit to the nth degree to the detriment of women and children.

Abccde · 04/02/2023 11:52

Tw are not victims of misogyny unless someone has incorrectly identified their sex.

TM may be victims of misogyny.

nilsmousehammer · 04/02/2023 11:51

Er.... whenever I've seen this mooted- SNP particularly - it's largely been to work out new avenues to prosecute and terrorize women for 'misogyny' such as pointing out the reality of sex of a person with Y chromosomes and a penis regardless of how they view themselves.

It has certainly not for example been intended to prevent MSPs supporting the rape and decapitation of anyone in favour of women having equality of rights.

So the definition of 'woman' is fairly crucial, and the definition of 'misogyny' because at this point we've been bitten so many times and politicians are currently so insane as a group that I am as suspicious as fuck.