31 Jan 15:15 Women & Equalities Committee - Scottish GRR Bill

And here is the written statement that Sajid Javid submitted to Parliament

questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-statements/detail/2022-06-30/hcws170

The law change Bernadette Wren talks about is briefly mentioned here:

amp.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/24/sajid-javid-plans-review-of-impact-of-gender-dysphoria-treatment

I suspect GIDS could’ve found a legally compliant way to track the data anyway, but the GRA gave them a convenient excuse not to think about it

For health records they issue a completely new NHS number and then copy and paste over notes with the references to sex redacted (which seems utterly stupid to me, but here we are!)

I have a feeling Bernadette Wren or another women specifically said on record that sex markers were being changed for children.

Unless there's another marker indicating transgender then coupled with a name change could that cause issues tracking and data collection?

Ah sorry cross post Bin

Perhaps ...?

Obviously name changing can make paper trailing difficult. And I remember in a gov evidence session that (I think the same woman?) said children are getting sex markers changed on medical Records.

That must actually make data collection very hard.

Trans people have often commented that they're let down by the medical system not realising what their sex actually is and thus missing out on sex specific care. I remember a piece in the Guardian a few years ago. (So sex does matter....)

The GRA does not make data collection and long term follow up illegal. That would be daft, and is a pathetic excuse from the Tavistock.

Firstly, the long term follow up of medical outcomes relates to people who have had medical treatment - whether or not they have a GRC. And we know that many transitioners don't have or want the certificate.

Secondly, the GRC (and parts of the GRC process that are not necessarily an actual part of the Act, and ways in which various organisations handle gender changes in general - regardless of holding a GRC and completely separately from the act) does introduce difficulties in retrospective and population-level studies. But these are practical rather than legal ones, and would not affect prospective studies run by the clinics actually providing the treatment.

This news about the GRA...does it explain this in the latest Cass letter? Or give context?

"the commissioned data linkage study (part of our quantitative research programme), which represents a unique opportunity to collect longer- term outcome data on this population, has been much more complex than initially envisaged, and is taking longer to establish. However, I am pleased to say that we have now received provisional approvals and will soon be moving into the next phase of the work, which will involve detailed information for service users and the option to opt out before commencement of any data collection. The full protocol will be published on our website.

I anticipate that by the summer, in addition to the strands of work described above, we will have some information on the intermediate outcomes for children and young people with gender dysphoria, as well as the changing characteristics of this group, using data which is already routinely collected within the NHS. However, the complexities encountered in establishing the data linkage study means that the full results of this element will likely not be available before the Review is concluded."

https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Cass-ReviewLetter-to-NHSEE_Jan23.pdf

were not followed up into adulthood because the GRA made it illegal.

Something that we’ve all long suspected but not confirmed with a credible source.

These two things are I think news to me but I don't know if others know - possibly new thread? Certainly relevant to Susie green thread.

I hadn't heard that that's why they weren't followed into adulthood

Nope, I only put it in here. Sometimes it takes me a few days to figure out how significant something is 😬
Should probably bump the OG Tortoise podcast thread too.

Do you think it should go on a thread of it’s own as well?

Was also Interesting to learn that the non binary participant in the podcast works for Tortoise…

@ShireWifeofNigelFarage have you put that on the SG/ Webberly thread?

Christ on a bike, thank you for pointing that out.

Horrific safeguarding given how many are being 'treated' with these drugs now around the world.

'Evidence base' never even had a chance.

just popping this down here as it’s the most recent GRC thread.

This is a follow up discussion to the Tortoise podcast on GIDS at Tavi.

At about 41 mins Bernadette Wren (once second in command at GIDS) defensively says that the puberty blocked children were not followed up into adulthood because the GRA made it illegal.

Something that we’ve all long suspected but not confirmed with a credible source.

Puberty blockers weren’t a thing in childhood gender Dysphoria until after the legislation was passed, so we cannot blame PFC directly for the harm caused to children, only blame them indirectly.

Shitty, shonky law.

Looks like a tourist attraction to me. Nothing creepy about it.

It's not that creepy! The extract from the book specifically mentions the shop and its venison pies.

twitter.com/CormStrikeFan/status/1021396909221654530

Man in bbc report. No mention of dressing up

Man charged after 11-year-old girl's disappearance in Galashiels www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64557459

Maybe the police have finally been given guidance to say "man" if the only evidence of being a woman is a utility bill?I.e. no grc? Funny how they used to trust the utility bill instead of their own eyes.

Someone needs to ask Nicola if he’s a man or a woman or a Rapist or a new 4th category.

He had a creepy JK shrine at his butchers shop.

Interesting the police said they arrested a man when he calls himself a woman wanting to date women.

Another man who wears Women’s clothes has been arrested in scotland

child abduction:

reduxx.info/scotland-crossdressing-butcher-arrested-in-case-of-missing-child/

It's also glorious.

Naomi went right in from the outset saying it as it is. Any man can get a grc. The nice and the predatory.

Also...

That is the rhetorical manoeuvre generally known as whataboutery

Glorious!

Yes, it's blood boiling.

Clear winners in the debate though.

Thanks WarriorN

I am picking up things from the transcript that I missed when I was watching the debate

Ta da!

The transcript

committees.parliament.uk/oralevidence/12639/pdf/

So true.