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'Breaking' - Transgender rapist won’t be imprisoned in Scotland’s all-women jail, Nicola Sturgeon tells MSPs

648 replies

zaramysaviour · 26/01/2023 12:53

Excellent news.

And Sturgeon has really shot herself in the foot here (again). Because if she really thinks 'trans women are women', why is she not allowing this 'woman' to go to a female prison?

So therefore she knows this person is not a woman.

So therefore she is being transphobic...

OP posts:
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IcakethereforeIam · 26/01/2023 15:40

Peter Tatchell tweeted this (he may have posted more, I haven't looked). Tbf to him, it's the only position he could take that's consistent with 'acceptance without exception'.

'Breaking' - Transgender rapist won’t be imprisoned in Scotland’s all-women jail, Nicola Sturgeon tells MSPs
scratchedbymycat · 26/01/2023 15:39

littlbrowndog · 26/01/2023 14:22

Sturgeon said this and she always uses the let me be very clear words

“Finally, in general terms and perhaps most importantly, I heard the chief executive of Rape Crisis Scotland say yesterday: ‘I don’t see how it’s possible to have a rapist within a female prison’. And so let me be very clear, I agree with that statement.”

I thought NS's reference to Sandy Brindley was especially interesting. If she loses the support of women's safety organisations wrt self-id etc she's totally screwed. I wonder if that was the real political unravelling?

Anyone know what Rape Crisis Edinburgh has said? I'm very interested to hear their position.

MoirasSaggyBundles · 26/01/2023 15:39

Guy asking the questions is a better feminist than Sturgeon will ever be. He's making some great points about her hiding behind the SPS.

MoirasSaggyBundles · 26/01/2023 15:37

Continuation of the clip I posted above. Better sound quality.

ILikeDungs · 26/01/2023 15:37

PPs (not exact words):

I would discuss it of course but you guys are all such meanies

and

But men rape men too!

Answer to the first: grow up and join in the discussion
Answer to the second: can't answer, too batshit

IcakethereforeIam · 26/01/2023 15:36

@PriamFarrl I don't disagree, but some suggested on a thread yesterday that rape, or fear of rape would help to rehabilitate female prisoners. So....

They'll have to decide what to do with him. Apparently, there are at least six tw prisoners in Scotland already. They should be jailed together. They'll have so much in common.

MeanCanadianLady · 26/01/2023 15:35

Because apparently the goal posts have shifted yet again as it is now okay to say if they are clearly taking advantage of trans rights that they aren’t real trans people where just a few months ago that was considered transphobic. But they are finally starting to feel the negative press so now they must backpedal!

PriamFarrl · 26/01/2023 15:33

"Predatory men, as has always been the case, are the risk to women."

But this person isn’t a man, so I’ve been told, they are a woman. Why would this statement have anything to do with them.

PriamFarrl · 26/01/2023 15:31

OneSugar1 · 26/01/2023 15:02

NewFriday the illustrious Peter tatchell said this rapist should be in a womens prison in ‘segregation’.
I imagine the rest of TRSOH will be spluttering and raging pretty soon if not already.

And although it’s hard for to sympathise with this person, it is inhumane to suggest that someone should be kept in what would amount to solitary confinement for their entire prison term.

MoirasSaggyBundles · 26/01/2023 15:30

Longer clip from 8.48, including the follow up Q. Sound quality's not great.

lechiffre55 · 26/01/2023 15:27

MoirasSaggyBundles · 26/01/2023 15:26

Not read all the thread, but posting this clip of NS's u-turn and question dodging in case it hasn't already been posted.

Notice how NS just learned a new word for this speech. Female.
Will wonders never stop...?

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 15:26

IcakethereforeIam · 26/01/2023 15:24

Just a reminder for those who haven't rtff, follow the link to sign the petition so we can see parliament debate this mess

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4668426-petition-update-the-equality-act-to-make-clear-the-characteristic-sex-is-biological-sex

There's also a petition on that board to repeal the GRA, where this whole mess started. Think about signing that. They're government petitions so your details will be safe.

You're right Cake there is

'Breaking' - Transgender rapist won’t be imprisoned in Scotland’s all-women jail, Nicola Sturgeon tells MSPs
MoirasSaggyBundles · 26/01/2023 15:26

Not read all the thread, but posting this clip of NS's u-turn and question dodging in case it hasn't already been posted.

IcakethereforeIam · 26/01/2023 15:24

Just a reminder for those who haven't rtff, follow the link to sign the petition so we can see parliament debate this mess

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4668426-petition-update-the-equality-act-to-make-clear-the-characteristic-sex-is-biological-sex

There's also a petition on that board to repeal the GRA, where this whole mess started. Think about signing that. They're government petitions so your details will be safe.

Boiledbeetle · 26/01/2023 15:23

Raera · 26/01/2023 15:16

Asking for clarity about where this rapist will be imprisoned is a non-starter. The whereabouts of any prisoner should not be public knowledge for safety reasons.
There are many men in male prisons who identify as female, that is not unusual.

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

Seriously?

In the men's prison!!

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 26/01/2023 15:21

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

Men should be imprisoned in a men's prison.

Regardless if they are imprisoned for rape or fraud or traffic offences.

They should never be imprisoned with women.

SockGoddess · 26/01/2023 15:21

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

Well not with the women! In a male prison in a separate sex-offenders' wing. I would want to mitigate the danger from them to other males, by some kind of further segregation, but I can see that's tricky.

Yeahrightthen · 26/01/2023 15:21

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

Oh dear, that is what I think is known as "reaching".

ILikeDungs · 26/01/2023 15:20

Raera · 26/01/2023 15:16

Asking for clarity about where this rapist will be imprisoned is a non-starter. The whereabouts of any prisoner should not be public knowledge for safety reasons.
There are many men in male prisons who identify as female, that is not unusual.

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

If that's where you want to go, where should men who kill men go? That's just silly.

AlecTrevelyan006 · 26/01/2023 15:17

Raera · 26/01/2023 15:16

Asking for clarity about where this rapist will be imprisoned is a non-starter. The whereabouts of any prisoner should not be public knowledge for safety reasons.
There are many men in male prisons who identify as female, that is not unusual.

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

In a prison for men.

Justasec321 · 26/01/2023 15:16

Miajk · 26/01/2023 13:26

Sex and gender are not the same.

I actually couldn't care less if someone wants to be x, y or z.

Safeguarding is important but it's hard to have a sensible conversation when so many people are just anti-trans and hide behind safeguarding but they're actually bigots.

Show quote history

*Safeguarding is important but - *let me help you with that -

Safeguarding is important. but

SockGoddess · 26/01/2023 15:16

I imagine after a while in solitary confinement he might decide he was a man again

I think the ultimate way to ensure that is to put all transwomen prisoners in a special trans prison or unit. Separating the sex-offending ones from the others, for the safety of the others. The ones who weren't genuinely dysphoric/wanting to transition would be changing their mind as they hadn't got what they wanted.

Raera · 26/01/2023 15:16

Asking for clarity about where this rapist will be imprisoned is a non-starter. The whereabouts of any prisoner should not be public knowledge for safety reasons.
There are many men in male prisons who identify as female, that is not unusual.

To add another slant, where should men who rape men be imprisoned?

334bu · 26/01/2023 15:15

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001hfqz

From about 17.45 Rhona Hotchkiss former Governor of Cornton Vale being interviewed on World at One.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 26/01/2023 15:14

It's also very telling that she's agreed that she can't see how it's possible to have a rapist in a female prison.

Not that it's not right to have a rapist in a female prison.

More "it's not very practical" than "that was a fucking stupid idea bound to go wrong".

I think they'll end up in the vulnerable section of another prison mixing with other very vulnerable prisoners (which is what has happened in women's prisons before with trans prisoners).