“Sex is a result of colonialism”

What are all the different gametes called of these different sexes? There was a joke diagram of eggerms and sperggs once, but I can’t find it. Where/where are they produced? Do two sperggs produce a human? Where does the spergg x spergg gestate? And (obviously because formula has only been around for a short while historically) who breastfeeds these offspring so that they can grow up and reproduce to create further generations themselves?

Obviously this does not involve DSD, which is scientifically proven, and nothing to do with the above. The only charitable solution to her stupidity is she has got completely confused.

OP you need to send her some questions and come back here with the answers. Fascinating she thinks she knows the scientific-denying ‘answers’.

Your friend has gone down the social justice warrior/ BLM/ gender identity wormhole. The ancient Greeks knew there were two sexes, male and female. The bible had god creating male and female separately. The Jewish and Muslim faiths clearly separate people by sex. Sadly your old friend has gone and I think it unlikely you will ever have them back. Once people fall prey to this kind of magical thinking they rarely return to rationalism.

I agree cake.
Best response.

It's a view that appeals to two tropes that are popular with progressives at the moment: that sex is not binary and that there are indigenous "ways of knowing" that are equal (or even superior) to the "Western" scientific approach to knowledge.

Thanks all - some really helpful things in there. The more I think about what she said, the more mad it sounds. Other gems were that there are more than two sexes, you can change sex etc etc. There are actually fewer trans people than there were years ago (???) When I argued back she just said ‘that’s not trueI’, you’ve been reading lies’ etc.

Watch what happens if you prove she is unequivocally wrong on something, or say something she doesn't have an argument to. She'll get very angry, I predict. And declare you are awful and flounce off. Because it's not a rational belief, it's a faith based one.

I think trying to argue reasonably with the batshit is a mistake. The OP's friend is, probably, not racist but what she is disseminating is. Don't entertain it at all. Anyone who comes out with this crap, treat it like you would any other racist shit. Call it out, every single time. Don't reason with it. Call it out. It's racist, end off. It's racist, how dare you. It's racist, I used to think better of you. It's racist, get out of your echo chamber and educate yourself.

It's binary gender which is the social construct. And it's one which 'gender critical feminists' explicitly object to. It's what we were objecting to, right there in the term we use, long before trans issues came to the fore.

The alternative genders in other cultures are, afaik, typically sexed themselves. Hijra are males (rarely, intersex). Balkan sworn virgins are female.

Sounds bloody familiar

Third genders are a result of historical homophobia, with many cultures believing that effeminate men cannot be classified as "real" men and therefore have to sit in another category.

Essentially their existence is due to bigotry that pre-dates any colonialism.

@JoonT really good post btw, and absolutely epitomises the assertions by a transman described on this thread:

“You don’t get to decide whether you’re transphobic or not and you don’t get to decide you’re an ally” www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4725575-you-dont-get-to-decide-whether-youre-transphobic-or-not-and-you-dont-get-to-decide-youre-an-ally

people like your friend remind me of the Paul Whitehouse Fast Show character who spouts second hand opinions in the pub then looks like a knob when challenged.

It’s like Covid conspiracies - the world is a nutty place right now.

Hopefully she’ll come to her senses, give her space (lots!) till then.

So even if sex was a social construct, it’s still ok to have sex- based rights, according to this ideology itself.

Absolutely but it doesn't suit the menz though and it all has to suit the menz.

I don't think your friend is an extremist though OP. Doesn't understand any of it but thinks she does.

Merrily repeating random incomprehensible snippets just like Ai bots do, that sort of makes sense for a bit and then unravels with some critical analysis.

Extremism + authoritarianism = a fucking disaster.

And as the two-sex reproductive process evolved before humans, how can it be a social construct exactly? Wolves, deer etc can tell from sniffing urine if it came from a male or female of their species and behave differently depending on which it is. (Among millions of other animal examples of course) The reason they react differently to the different sexes is to enable survival and reproduction- unsurprisingly as that’s what sex evolved for.

the stupidest thing is I think this idea has arisen in order to “prove” that it’s fine for a man to decide to be a woman as there’s no real difference anyway. But they don’t agree that it’s ok to identify as a different race, and that literally is a social construct. Even so, it still matters because when some groups persecute others, they need protection and to be able to organise on the basis of the reason for their oppression. The same applies to transness - the ultimate social construct. So even if sex was a social construct, it’s still ok to have sex- based rights, according to this ideology itself.

One of my heroes, Bertrand Russell, used to say that the greatest threat to civilization has always been extremism. He used the word 'fanaticism'. There is a certain type of person who is drawn to extremes. They like the idea of antagonising people and smashing things up. The cause doesn't matter. Often, they couldn't care less about the stuff they claim to believe.

We've had all sorts of extremists over the centuries: religious extremists, nationalist extremists, communist extremists, free market extremists. It can take numerous forms. Today, we have woke extremism. Nine times out of ten, these people couldn't care less about the stuff they claim to believe. Their real motives are totally different. It's about power, control, money, etc. In some cases, they just want to show off and get attention.

Other gems were that there are more than two sexes, you can change sex etc etc.

Appropriating differences of sexual development, which are mostly chromosomal conditions. Some babies with these don't survive. Some people have physical and / or learning difficulties. Many are infertile.

In the U.K. the non invasive prenatal test is a blood test that can be done from as early as 10 weeks pregnant iirc, and it's now on the nhs. It tests for all these conditions and others as many are serious conditions. It used pieces of the foetus's dna which are in the mother's blood.

NIPT tests also determine which sex the baby is and would thus know immediately if the baby is later born with a dsd based on the chromosome test and/ or if there's been an issue with the sry gene.

So the assertions quoted above are abelist, racist and misogynistic.

Most of this discussion, interesting though it is, is beside the point. Binary biological sex isn't a 'concept' invented by people. It's a biological reality, evolved millions of years ago and exhibited by many organisms. Humans, in common with all mammals, cannot "change sex". There is no "third sex"

Quite. Sex relates to sexual reproduction. Its not a social construct. Its the means to reproduce the species.

We know exactly what sex is. See above. Someone may have read something in a sociology book which makes them think they shouldn't know what it is. But they do. And so has every person and nearly every species.

Thank god Just! I genuinely can't tell anymore.

that is exactly the shite TRAs come out with all the time.

Your friend is a wilfully blind idiot, OP.

Most of this discussion, interesting though it is, is beside the point. Binary biological sex isn't a 'concept' invented by people. It's a biological reality, evolved millions of years ago and exhibited by many organisms. Humans, in common with all mammals, cannot "change sex". There is no "third sex".

As to her saying "Cases like Karen White etc are apparently not true." - she's simply burying her head in the sand. Denying evidence that's clear and unambiguous. It's analogous to those members of religious groups who deny and cover up or excuse crimes committed by their people because they think they're right, that their cause is more important than inconvenient truths.

That video is very interesting Warrior thank you.

I’m usually pretty much a hard boiled cynic, but every time a white man uses racial slurs to justify his womanhood or a white woman nods along with outrageously racist statements to back a TRA my jaw hangs open.

I grew up in the 80s- racism was everywhere, as a generation I think we’ve had to work to unpick racist ideas from everything we’ve ever learned. And many people have tried and have been relatively successful. I hope so anyway.

But hearing things like the TRA quotes in that vid, makes me wonder how much racism is still going strong in younger, Lib Fem circles. Are they so blinded by their new cause they can’t hear the racist tropes? Or does the racism resonate with their own racist ideas? There’s some uncomfortable shit going on right there.

I would actually say this to ex friend - and then block them.

What an idiot.

I'm sorry you had to deal with this cultish mad talk. It's like talking to a broken A.I.