Keir Starmer fudge fudge waffle waffle

Starmer: '16 is too young to change legal gender' www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-64281548

On BBC news app now.

The UK Labour leader voiced "concerns" about the Scottish government's reforms to the process, citing a potential impact on UK-wide equalities law.

However, he stopped short of backing a challenge to the Holyrood legislation, something UK ministers are considering.

Lifelong Labour voter and now have nobody to vote for. Starmer can piss off wanting to take away ‘indignities’

what about the fucking indignity of being frightened and not being able to use a public or workplace toilet without stress because it is full of MEN?

He's as blind as he can be
Just sees what he wants to see
Keir Starmer, can you see me at all

Starmer is 21% in the lead in the polls.
The economy is shit so the incumbents will not build up their poll lead irrespective of what they do. They've also had 13 years and people get bored and want any half decent change.

So Starmer knows that although women are half the electorate, the gender issue will not be enough to lose more than a relatively small minority of them. Added to which if he came out as against self ID he'd likely lose as many TQs.

So he sits on the fence and once safely in power, probably with a stonking majority, he can do what he likes.

I actually think he does believe that those who claim to be trapped in the wrong body are some harmless downtrodden minority and that they are a tiny number and if they say they are women he is not going to argue. He will protect single sex spaces but his definition of single sex will be very different to mine and to objective reality.

We just need to keep this issue at the forefront. The tide has not turned.

@sensechec Succession

I do have some sympathy with Starmer though. I think the centre/left voter population really is split on this issue. Many (not all) of my nice, intelligent friends and colleagues have pronouns on their emails etc. So I kind of don't blame him sitting on the fence for now and letting the Tories sort it out.

I don't have any sympathy for him. He is a leader, it is his job to provide leadership. Most people are woefully uninformed about this issue and deliberately* *so, when facts are laid out, all but the most zealous see this for what it is. If he took a hard line on this nonsense most people would realise what has been going on and he will win far more respect. Pronouns would dissappear overnight, vast majority conforming to social pressure and complacently believe they're being good people. That's fine for Joe public, it's not remotely OK for the leader of the opposition. Its his job to identify injustice and stand against it. He should be using his position to positively influence public opinion not just flapping around like the hopeless weathercock that he is.

Caroline Nokes is fully TWAW. She was one of the driving forces behind PM May's announcement of Self ID in 2017.

Being split on the issue doesn't require anyone to utter any variation of "some men can be women"

He's an educated man. He should be able to work out a sentence that supports the issues trans people by really do suffer whilst not trampling over women's rights.

It's the 'understanding silence/acquiescence' that has allowed all the ridiculous gender ideology to run riot.

From what I've heard and read, I'd say Starmer is more scared of factions within his own party than he is of the electorate. And to be fair, I think he has good reason - it's all very well speculating about what voters think but he has to make it through to a general election first.

Ironically, I think the one thing most likely to make him feel secure enough to face down the TRA lobby would be a comfortable government majority. Equally ironically, I won't trust him to deliver on this unless he speaks up.

So round and round he goes. I might even kind of sympathise, but not enough to vote for him.

“If you asked me to name the indignity in the current law, I would say that a waiting time if you have had gender reassignment surgery, especially if you have no male genitals, is too long.”

Very few transwomen indeed have no male genitals. Really that’s as it should be though so it would cause problems if castration were to become a factor in getting one more quickly.

He’s as much use as a marzipan dildo

Which one? Succession or professor?

was thinking exactly that.

When it comes to the next election, even though it is a fundamental issue, I don't think it will be one of the major things talked about.

I'm still not confident that the government will use section 35 re the Bill passed in the Scottish Parliament.

If you asked me to name the indignity in the current law, I would say that a waiting time if you have had gender reassignment surgery, especially if you have no male genitals, is too long.

100% no to self-ID though.

I think there is enough commonality between Lib Dem, Green and Labour voters that if one of those parties' leaders stuck their head above the parapet and clearly said "we support women, the female kind" they would gather a huge amount of support from members of the other two parties.

I gather she's always been very keen on this gendered soul nonsense. See also Layla Moran. And yet, we are often told, "nobody" or at least "nobody of significance" is claiming that people can be born in the wrong body.

Should be Nokes. Although Nonkes has a rather good thing to it.

I gather Caroline Nonkes is peddling the "born in the wrong body" shtick.

I thought that expression was disapproved of now by the genderwoosters.

However, what he did not say was that he would not have challenged the bill if he was in Rishi’s position. He glossed over the fact that he did not agree with major components of the bills yet his party in Scotland was instrumental in getting the bill through despite his reservations.

He also recognises the potential negative impacts under the EA which Scottish Government has declared are simply not there.

While he waffled, it was the things he didn’t say that were more interesting.

I agree though, he is just going to sit back and see where this lands. He has that luxury now.

There can never be any going back to ‘this isn’t an issue that the majority of people are concerned about’. Caroline Nokes on the other hand is playing plenty of slipperyness. I have never seen her show one iota of understanding about what she referred to also as ‘safe spaces’, she even tacked on single sex.

When either of those two politicians talk about safe spaces and ‘women’ and in Nokes case ‘single sex spaces’, I always feel like I have been gaslit. Because they have shown themselves to say the things they believe people want to hear, while upholding that 1% of ‘women’ are not female and I can only assume Nokes is talking about GRC holders included in ‘single sex spaces’.

And that has always been the issue. It is so fucked up and I dare any person who supported ‘they just want to be called ‘women’, be kind!’ to deny that this ambiguity is not the direct outcome of that annexing of language. Only a fool would say the normalisation of calling males ‘women’ did not largely contribute to this whole fucking mess.

He's a politician what do you expect ?

None of them ever have an answer for the question asked them in these telly slots , just spout whatever they want to promote .

Doesn't matter what colour badge they are wearing every one of them is a lying slimeball

I agree @rogdmum. Mr "I used to be DPP dontcha know" Starmer suddenly wants to wait and see what the legal advice says? Not really credible.

Mark Harper had a reasonable position and didn't even try to play the "two sides are equally toxic" card (twitter.com/bbcpolitics/status/1614568610898542593?s=46&t=Bici_MMvRpXq7VAjcvSPwA)

Time for "one for the blokes" bingo:

twitter.com/bbcpolitics/status/1614563863982411777?s=46&t=Bici_MMvRpXq7VAjcvSPwA

Re the GRR Bill, I think he views us as guinea pigs and is waiting to see how it goes over the next couple of years and he’ll use that to determine his position for the next General election. I don’t think he’ll do anything but waffle until then.