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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How do you speak up without being called transphobic

314 replies

Enterusername111333 · 30/12/2022 01:04

I just feel so lost... I don't know how to voice my opinion without accusations so I just take the easy option. Where does it end?

OP posts:
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6
Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:48

CompleteGinasaur · 30/12/2022 17:33

Never mind, Boiledbeetle, some of us get it. And empathise - the last time I wore a skirt was in 1986. At my sister's wedding. I was considerably more churlish about it than you were, I'd bought a perfectly lovely and fairly stylish loose linen trousers and tuxedo jacket combo for the occasion, which for a grungy leftover punk was, I thought, enough of a concession. At which point my mother got hold of an earlobe and dragged me off to a perfectly precious little boutique that still wakes me up at night after too much rich food. Can't see why the poster giving you a hard time can't see your loving gesture for what it was, but there's an awful lot of wilful misinterpretation on here that simply eludes me...

my mother bought me, her dungaree wearing, hates pink daughter a broderie englay probably spelt wrong but you know what i mean, pink frilly dress, and patent ridiculous scuff if you even blink wrong girls shoes to wear to her own wedding when i was 10. oh how she laughed.

bitch.

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:43

not how i look for me you pillock they werent my photos i never had to look at them, my poor sister does though.

and disengage and walk away Boiled, walk away.

FKATondelayo · 30/12/2022 17:39

Everything is transphobic. Speaking from a woman's point of view is transphobic. Saying woman and meaning a person with XX chromosomes is transphobic. A 3 year old calling you sir is transphobic.
Using preferred pronouns is transphobic if you don't do it with the right intention and mindset.
Doing the New York Times crossword is transphobic (yep I read this one on Twitter today). Praising successful trans people is transphobic as it's colonialist or something (another tweet from today).

It's Catholicism 2.0. You can sin just in your head even if no-one knows about it and you're still going to hell unless you recant.

Being called transphobic is like being hated by the Daily Mail. It's a compliment.

CompleteGinasaur · 30/12/2022 17:33

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:09

oh ffs i dressed that way so the bloody wedding photos would look good and not with me miserable unkempt in jogging bottoms because i love my sister. stop willfully misinterpreting what im saying.

Never mind, Boiledbeetle, some of us get it. And empathise - the last time I wore a skirt was in 1986. At my sister's wedding. I was considerably more churlish about it than you were, I'd bought a perfectly lovely and fairly stylish loose linen trousers and tuxedo jacket combo for the occasion, which for a grungy leftover punk was, I thought, enough of a concession. At which point my mother got hold of an earlobe and dragged me off to a perfectly precious little boutique that still wakes me up at night after too much rich food. Can't see why the poster giving you a hard time can't see your loving gesture for what it was, but there's an awful lot of wilful misinterpretation on here that simply eludes me...

ANewCreation · 30/12/2022 17:22

OP, any thoughts?

Datun · 30/12/2022 17:16

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Joshitai · 30/12/2022 17:15

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:12

the clothes point was to show the fact that i am a kind thoughtful person, two other things us "GC" are apparently not.

Not comprehending how the way one dresses makes one a kind and thoughtful person?

I think you have some odd ideas about performance of feminine stereotype means you’re a good girl on the inside.

Joshitai · 30/12/2022 17:14

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:09

oh ffs i dressed that way so the bloody wedding photos would look good and not with me miserable unkempt in jogging bottoms because i love my sister. stop willfully misinterpreting what im saying.

That’s not what you said? You were quite poetic:
Now I never wear women's clothes. Never. But...I wore a skirt, and a frilly sleeved top from the women's section, and heels and makeup. And straightened my hair. Because she was worth it, because I love her. Oh and because I'm also not a homophobe.

I put myself out of my comfort zone, i presented myself to the world not as my true authentic self but how many sister wanted me look to the world on her wedding day. that made feel very vulnerable and, very wrong, to use another ideologies words. But I did it to show someone else that they mattered.

Now you’re saying it’s because of vanity over how you’d look in the wedding photos? This is the first time you’ve mentioned how you’d look in the wedding photos. So I’m at a loss as to how I’m misrepresenting what you’ve said earlier?

AlisonDonut · 30/12/2022 17:13

FrancescaContini · 30/12/2022 17:07

Was @AlisonDonut ‘a post deleted because it contained the words “mutilate” and “children” in close proximity to each other?

Weird huh.

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:12

the clothes point was to show the fact that i am a kind thoughtful person, two other things us "GC" are apparently not.

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:09

oh ffs i dressed that way so the bloody wedding photos would look good and not with me miserable unkempt in jogging bottoms because i love my sister. stop willfully misinterpreting what im saying.

FrancescaContini · 30/12/2022 17:08

‘s

FrancescaContini · 30/12/2022 17:07

Was @AlisonDonut ‘a post deleted because it contained the words “mutilate” and “children” in close proximity to each other?

Joshitai · 30/12/2022 17:07

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 13:18

Because if i was a homophobic bigot like gets suggested about us "GC"folk i may have gone to it grudingly, family and all, but I wouldn't have put in one iota of additional effort.

I put myself out of my comfort zone, i presented myself to the world not as my true authentic self but how many sister wanted me look to the world on her wedding day. that made feel very vulnerable and, very wrong, to use another ideologies words.

But I did it to show someone else that they mattered.

Now do any of those actions warrant me getting accused of homophobia.

Was what I did a sign of raging rampant hated of a marginalised othered (not my word these have been used to insult me before) group veering to the more conservative thought processes im being accused of or someone who's kind and tolerant and believes EVERYONE should be able to live as however they choose.

Because if this shows im a bigot well, then there's no hope is there. Were doomed.

Your sister preferred you to dress that way. Got it.

No, I don’t think you are a homophobe at all, I just was confused by your seeming logic of what makes one a homophobe or not a homophobe. So imposed a few questions on you to see why.

For what it’s worth, I don’t agree that not putting in additional effort or being grudging about going to a civil ceremony makes a person a homophobe.

I also feel sad that you felt it necessary to dress the way your sister wanted you to and not as your authentic self out of fear of being branded a homophobe. I can understand the feeling of vulnerability and wrongness that you relate quite well in regards to feminine dress & accessories like heels, make up, and styled hair.

Boiledbeetle · 30/12/2022 17:06

WallaceinAnderland · 30/12/2022 16:18

I really feel there's an opportunity for a joke here

What's the difference between a transphobe and a heretic?

Answers on a postcard

i've only got envelopes, if i seal one can it identify as a postcard?

BellaAmorosa · 30/12/2022 17:02

bellinisurge · 30/12/2022 16:42

As the Lion King meme says "everything the light touches is transphobia". I'm not afraid of trans people. I'm afraid that I can't tell the difference between a transsexual and a bloke pretending to be a woman to access women when they are vulnerable.

From a privacy or dignity perspective, I'm not sure it matters which? The point is that males should not be in women's single sex areas.

bellinisurge · 30/12/2022 16:42

As the Lion King meme says "everything the light touches is transphobia". I'm not afraid of trans people. I'm afraid that I can't tell the difference between a transsexual and a bloke pretending to be a woman to access women when they are vulnerable.

Sparklybutold · 30/12/2022 16:39

@Rheia1983 yeah I think I got a little too excited at this, naively thinking a law which respected sex would also protect it in other spaces, one way is not make self ID so easy and accessible (which I now know Switzerland has done). I don't know how the two can work together really.

FrancescaContini · 30/12/2022 16:29

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Absolutely 👍

AlisonDonut · 30/12/2022 16:29

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Rheia1983 · 30/12/2022 16:28

Sparklybutold · 30/12/2022 14:23

Ah thank you. I actually read about this in the local newspapers but didn't consider this as a move back to sanity from the gender bs myself seeing that self ID came into force just last January. I also couldn't find anything showing that single sex protections are in place here in Switzerland so that women are not put at a disadvantage through self ID.

This is an example of the discussion in this regard (www.swissinfo.ch/ger/wirtschaft/sind-frauenbadis-in-einer-non-binaeren-gesellschaft-noch-zeitgemaess-/47789448). The text is in German.

FrancescaContini · 30/12/2022 16:24

Everything is considered “transphobic” so I would probably laugh and lose respect for the person who equates curiosity or questioning or a well thought-out GC pov with “transphobia”.

lieselotte · 30/12/2022 16:20

LulooLemon · 30/12/2022 13:30

This whole thread will disappear soon, just like all the others.

Big Brother is watching. There is no free speech allowed on MN unless is the right (pro-trans) kind of speech.

In fact, the whole concept of MN being for 'Mums' i.e. women is a joke. MN does not care about the rights of females.

This simply isn't true - MN is one of the few places where women can discuss trans issues without automatically being labelled transphobic and "asked" to leave.

Along with the Times comments section, before you had to use your full name.

nilsmousehammer · 30/12/2022 16:19

That dictionary definition nails it rather perfectly.

WallaceinAnderland · 30/12/2022 16:18

I really feel there's an opportunity for a joke here

What's the difference between a transphobe and a heretic?

Answers on a postcard