Woman mistaken for a man and challenged

No, because I'm not the person who is making the claim. I'm pointing out the gap in their argument.

I've acknowledged that since gender activists have put us in the position where sadly someone gets hurt.

My preference would be to stop pushing for males in female spaces full stop, and find better ways to support gender non conforming males. However if that's not on the table, the best remaining option is to try to minimise the impact to hurt feelings only.

Of course the vast majority of men are harmless. How though do you tell which ones aren't before it's too late?

You worry that even a young ‘tomboy’ girl should be raised to handle being confronted by an angry adult in the toilets (you didn't mention this but let's be clear, this wouid specifically be an angry female adult)
So what if it was an angry female adult?! You seem to be implying that it's " only a lady, can't possibly be scary" which is just bull, sorry. An angry adult as a child is just that, an angry adult!
Hate the "I'm just a lady" narrative on here some have when it suits.

@Onnabugeisha
It isn't doctored.
Read my post with photos and Google her name yourself.
Click on the image, not the link and you will see the badge in the thumbnail.

@Onnabugeisha no, it doesn’t rely on gender stereotypes, it relies on being able to tell what sex someone is - you know, size, hands, feet, gait (due to pelvic geometry. Then speaking to someone gives vocal cues too.
Note you didn’t respond to the point about questioning someone being better than someone getting attacked. Maybe you don’t think so…

The harms, injustices and indignities done to women by gender identity ideology and its proponents those who are many and varied. Those GNC women who feel upset by potentially being challenged by other women in loos are yet another example.

Someone made a mistake. Shit happens. No one died as a result.

Perhaps if people like you weren't so intent upon pushing men into women's spaces, people wouldn't be so on-edge.

That’s all well and good. But doesn’t explain the apparent necessity of destroying any woman who is publicly challenged and says they are upset about the experiences they frequently endure. (Not saying you are doing this personally- referring to the Twitter thread and other similar ones from similar cases).

Posting a doctored photo on Twitter to convince GC women that Tiffany is really called Taylor and goes by they/them is a pretty shit move to be honest. I don’t believe it at all. If she really did go by Taylor and they/them, then the article published 3 days ago would not have repeatedly dead named and mis-gendered her. Also her Facebook page would surely not have her dead name on it either.

Those same tweets are then repeated here as if it the information were true with insinuations that she intended to pass for male. It’s quite depressing really, who is manipulating information and why? What else regarding the “gender wars” is literally fake news?

I'm sorry but you are ignoring the GNC women, some of whom are on this very thread, who say they understand this is happening as a result of trans women pushing female people's boundaries and would rather be challenged themselves than have women afraid to challenge anyone.
But you're saying that conveniently ignoring the ones that have said they would and do care?!

The badge isn't doctored, it's the thumbnail for the article but blurred out in the newspaper itself.
Google her name and check for yourself

I'm sorry but you are ignoring the GNC women, some of whom are on this very thread, who say they understand this is happening as a result of trans women pushing female people's boundaries and would rather be challenged themselves than have women afraid to challenge anyone.

And I'm very sorry that the entitlement of trans women, encouraged by genderist activism, has lead to the point where there is no pain free solution. This did not have to happen. There are many ways society could accommodate trans women and it's a real shame that gender ideology insists - well, let's not mince words, lies - that the only option is to appropriate female spaces, resources and emotional safety in service of males. But, given this is where gender activists have chosen to take us, I would rather some female people are unfortunately embarrassed than all female people are made less safe and less confident in order to meet demands of males.

You worry that even a young ‘tomboy’ girl should be raised to handle being confronted by an angry adult in the toilets (you didn't mention this but let's be clear, this wouid specifically be an angry female adult) but apparently aren't worried that the alternative is that young girls will need to be raised to face an angry or over friendly male adult in the toilets instead.

Incidentally, if you are OK for women's toilets to be open to trans women but not other males, who exactly are you expecting to challenge the men who should not be there, and how is that any different to this scenario?

You accuse feminists of turning GNC women into cannon fodder based on the risk they may be challenged, but you want to turn all female people into cannon fodder with a risk of much worse simply to accomodate male demand.

Women are allowed to defend their right to feel safe
Unless you're one that's seemingly not prettily feminine enough and then you can be challenged and misgendered all you like and told to get out.
I know I'd find that a bit intimidating if that happened to me (I'd give as good as I got but it would shake you a bit I imagine!)

Cross posted with Onn

Whatever the particulars of this case, there is nothing wrong with challenging people who don’t appear to be female who are using female loos.

You can sympathise with the individuals who might be challenged while supporting the right to challenge.

Women are allowed to defend their right to feel safe. And that means not being lovely to everyone all the time.

If women could be confident that men wouldn't push boundaries, then there would be no need to challenge anyone. Until that minority of men stops pushing themselves into women's spaces then the risk of causing an upset by challenging someone is less than the consequences of letting men have unfettered access.

not conforming to stereotypes is something that is very clearly accepted on this board
All well and good being in social media land and words on a page saying you are, but RL clearly says otherwise if gender non conforming women are getting challenged for not being feminine looking enough, or would feel upset or intimidated being confronted in the toilets when out and about.

But it’s not accepted IRL.

Policing toilets relies heavily on gender stereotypes.

The “other people do it too” doesn’t really carry weight with me. If it’s wrong for them (TRAs), it’s also wrong for everyone else to rely on gender stereotypes.

😁 not conforming to stereotypes is something that is very clearly accepted on this board. It’s GII that suggests if you don’t conform to stereotypes then there must be something wrong which needs fixing. Trans ideology, and indeed non-binary relies on gender stereotypes Onnabugeisha

This. ^ I couldn’t have put it better.

Gender nonconforming women & children are viewed as cannon fodder. I had a thread begging MN to at least leave children out of this whole toilet challenge trend, as in properly pre-teen children but to no avail. Apparently even a young ‘tomboy’ girl should be raised to handle being confronted by an angry adult in the toilets. 🤨

I tend to think gender conforming women do not care because it’s not something they’d ever have to experience. So the voices of gender nonconforming women, especially butch lesbians, are simply disregarded and minimised.

They even implied in the article that having a mastectomy was great

Well, it saved her life! But what she said in the article was “these can go”
Which is so far off “this is great” it’s not even coincidental.

”In the first week of July, she had an appointment with the doctor, but it was during a time when appointments were more or less ‘non-existent’ because of coronavirus.

She had other strange symptoms such as wheezing and shoulder pain, but those were initially put down to asthma and working out in the gym.

"When I went for my first appointment, due to the size of my breasts, the GP couldn’t determine whether I had a cyst or something cancerous, so I was referred to Glenfield Hospital two weeks later," she said.

Tiffany had a mammogram and said that she knew she was in trouble when the doctor asked: "How many lumps did you come in with?"

Tiffany said: “I replied with ‘one lump', and she then proceeded to tell me that I had a sizable lump in my right breast, but I also had one in my left."

The doctor did an ultrasound which revealed that the cancer had also spread to her lymph nodes. Further tests revealed that she had three tumours and 13 out of 23 of her lymph nodes were compromised.

She said: “I asked the doctor if It was treatable, or if I was terminal, and she said I had curative-intent, which meant that if I reacted well to the treatment, I had high odds of surviving.

"Once I'd processed the news I realised that I could get both breasts removed. I’ve had to carry around these really heavy things my whole life, but I was in my forties and they were starting to get droopy anyway - so I thought 'these can go'."

They quite clearly do approve!

Somebody on this very thread has said that they would mind, and people laughingly call her things like Sir.
Or does that not matter?

In the end, which is worse - Katie Dolatowski attacks a child in a public toilet, or a female Katie Dolatowski look-alike (I know!) gets asked if she’s in the correct space?
Safeguarding often comes with having to ask some very direct questions. As pp’s have said repeatedly, if males kept out of women’s single-sex spaces, this wouldn't be a problem - that’s where the real issue lies