Is there any democracy that is not in thrall to the gender ideologues?

Makes perfect sense to me. Sorry you experienced what you did. 💐

So yes, we see all these totally unrealistic films where women regularly beat the crap out of men and are practically invulnerable and we’re supposed to think this is a great step forward in how women are portrayed, and a win for feminism.

@RoaringtoLangClegintheDark I was watching the second series of Alice in borderland the other day. In one episode there this tiny tiny teenage girl. She is constantly portrayed as the kick ass fighter in the group and they have her going hand to hand combat with this massive murdering psychopath bloke who's arms reach is probably longer than she is tall and would have just broken her like a twig but for a good while she's able to rain blow after blow down on him.

I know it's a sci fi, gaming based series but the visual is just so jarring and as an older seen more shit person I know that girl would have been dead before she even got one blow in, but I'm assuming the kids of today think to some degree the girl would stand a chance

This is definitely a thing among some younger women. I’ve been accused of misogyny for saying that there’s a physical difference between females and males, that women are vulnerable relative to men

I have too. But to be fair, I can remember having a similar attitude when I was very young, e.g. and genuinely believing that all we needed was a few self defence classes to keep up. I found out the hard way that I was being delusional but, if you never get that kind of wake-up call, I imagine it could take years for the penny to drop.

Spot on

This is definitely a thing among some younger women. I’ve been accused of misogyny for saying that there’s a physical difference between females and males, that women are vulnerable relative to men. The reasoning, if you can call it that, is I think that there’s a value judgment attached to the type of physical strength that men generally have more of.

So yes, we see all these totally unrealistic films where women regularly beat the crap out of men and are practically invulnerable and we’re supposed to think this is a great step forward in how women are portrayed, and a win for feminism.

Except of course it isn’t, because it’s saying women only have worth if they’re female versions of men rather than for our own selves. And it actually consolidates the idea that people who are physically more vulnerable and not able to easily overpower a would-be assailant are somehow “less”, and consequently less deserving of respect - which is not just anti-woman but also hugely ableist and anti-child.

While there’s a win in having more female characters, this trope is hugely anti-feminist as it’s saying only women who are “as good as” men are inspirational role models; women can’t be valued for the reality of who we are; and the kind of strengths we tend to have more of - eg stamina, endurance, emotional strength, and the small matter of the capacity to grow another human being inside us - are worth less. Worthless, even. Completely unvalued, completely out of the picture when it comes to assessing the social status of a human being.

Patriarchy as usual.

It breaks my heart to see younger women falling for this reinvented version of the same old hierarchy, and deluding themselves their worldview is feminist.

MagpiePi · Today 10:42

I find it disturbing the number of women who say that a few rapes and assualts might happen but even if they do, it will be such a small number that they don't matter because the important thing is for gender ideaology to be given full rein.

Yeah like in their heads it's equal to losing your phone in the back of a taxi. It's shit in the moment but no biggy you can just get another phone.

No thought to the fact that if just one woman is raped that is one woman to many that will spend a lifetime with that rape popping into her head when she least expects it, having flashes of the rape when they accidentally stand next to a person wearing the same deodorant, when a song plays on the radio. Never mind the multitude of other issues. This is the pg version.

rape isn't like losing your phone, you can't just have sex with someone else and that erases the existence and memory of the rape.

Not one single woman is acceptable collateral damage. Not one.

Thanks for all the flowers everyone, very kind.👐

@SnowWayOut

This sounds silly but I sometimes wonder if these young women have had a diet of media with physically strong, powerful women that can beat up men with no problem. Think Buffy, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, etc.
Do they believe women are stronger than they actually are and people who say, 'wait a minute, men are stronger than you' are just saying women are weak and that's why they react so strongly to it?

Maybe you're onto something there because the person's reaction was so strong, maybe she thought I was denigrating all women by proxy or something. Yes, we have been exposed to a media narrative of women being stronger or at least as strong as men.

Looking back to the 80s and early 90s I remember films like The Accused, and other films highlighting domestic violence. Those sorts of films either aren't being made anymore or don't grab attention. No one likes to feel weak though so maybe a bit understandable.

You sound like me and my sister, she's the older one and had to do the looking after and worrying about me as my mother wasn't fit for the job. She was also the shy sensitive one whereas i was the whirlwind of talk to anyone don't give a toss type. If i hadn't have been the one of us that was abused I'd have gone through life totally not getting it, whereas my sister could see things much more clearly from a much younger age than me.

Ughh I can't get my brain to find the words I'm trying to say today.

That’s very astute of you. Yes I’m 2 years older and was the eldest female child so that may also have had some influence but also personality wise I was always very sensitive and shy whereas my dsis is outgoing and sociable. We are chalk and cheese.

I find it disturbing the number of women who say that a few rapes and assualts might happen but even if they do, it will be such a small number that they don't matter because the important thing is for gender ideaology to be given full rein.

The number of people killed by drunk drivers is an average of 549 per year (https://www.quittance.co.uk/uk-drink-driving-statistics). This seems like a very small number compared to the UK population (67 million), but nobody would think it is acceptable because some people are physically addicted to alcohol, or even if they just enjoy having a drink and then want to go for a drive.

The trouble is countries like Hungary or Poland where they aren’t in thrall to gender ideology are horrific for LGB rights and women’s rights.

And isn't this one of the clever ways this ideology works in targeting vulnerable children. Imagine being a politician and your niece or nephew is trans. The child will undoubtedly have fragile mental health, they may have started down a controversial medical pathway, some family members will be totally on board and you have to play along with new name and pronouns and being lovely and caring. Any family member who does not agree is frowned on. You absolutely know that any comment you make publicly will be heard by this child. If you say what you think, you will be seen as betraying them. They will probably cry a lot and you will be blamed for the breakdown in their mental health and it will destroy relationships with many family members. It is a form of emotional blackmail and one of the reasons child transition is so vital to this ideology.

@Signalbox you see now I'm curious which of you was the eldest? Could that have any bearing, as if your the eldest you'll have shouldered a different burden than a younger sister would when your mother died. Don't worry you don't have to answer I'm just wondering wether the death of your mother caused different coping mechanisms to come into play?

I don't honestly think it's necessarily just one thing. I just find myself wondering why some people think how they do. I mean a lot of the current issues and arguments also depend on how much empathy a person has for the plight of others.

Sorry I'm just rambling now.

This sounds silly but I sometimes wonder if these young women have had a diet of media with physically strong, powerful women that can beat up men with no problem. Think Buffy, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, etc.
Do they believe women are stronger than they actually are and people who say, 'wait a minute, men are stronger than you' are just saying women are weak and that's why they react so strongly to it?

I hadn't thought about the on-screen change in the portrayal of female characters. That could definitely play a role. I'd say that's a controlled environment. The ecological validity is essentially nil.

At the same time, we're told there's an epidemic of sexual harassment at school and in clubs. I actually don't believe it's worse than 30 years ago, until we add the internet. There, I think we have high reflection of the real world..but it's "online" so not real in many ways. There seems to be a massive disconnect between, for example, someone acting out their kink/fetish on the internet and the understanding that it's in any way related to real life.

It's rather odd that this generation claim to be the most sexually harassed, yet don't think what men act out in real life is in any way relevant to their own real life, if a mobile phone is in their hand/on a stand.

Although having said that I think it is definitely a mixture of social influence AND character.

It is mostly younger women raised in a protective environment then?

I don’t think so. My Dsis and I are both in our 50s and we weren’t brought up in a particularly protected environment. Our DM died when we were small and were left to our own devices from very young. I really think the difference between us due to our different character traits rather than social influence.

Protective not projective

@DysonSpheres 💐the abuse does definitely help refine that innate instinct a person has as regards to danger. You like me are probably more on alert because of it.

So your thought about those raised in projective environments must surely dampen that same instinct. If nothing bad had ever really happened to you then you don't pick up on the small signals, the tone of a voice, the tension that can hang in the air, the prickle of alertness you get when you enter a situation that looks fine but can hold hidden dangers.is

Maybe this is why we are being demonized for being to OTT, they just haven't had the unfortunate experiences that shake a lot of women's views on what It's safe and acceptable and what is not.

This sounds silly but I sometimes wonder if these young women have had a diet of media with physically strong, powerful women that can beat up men with no problem. Think Buffy, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, etc.
Do they believe women are stronger than they actually are and people who say, 'wait a minute, men are stronger than you' are just saying women are weak and that's why they react so strongly to it?

Yeah royal corgi. That’s really it. It’s bonkers law

just that

at Xmas gathering yesterday everyone was scoffing at it

male cousin said how long does it take for me to be a woman now , oh and how do I live as a woman ?

'they haven't stand down' should read 'they have to stand down' - stupid autocorrect.

I agree, Wellies. I think it's interesting that a lot of the parliamentary opposition in Scotland came from MSPs pointing out all the risks from sexual predators. No one, as far as I'm aware, simply said: "This is nonsense. You are passing a law that contradicts science, and that makes as much sense as passing a law that says the earth is flat."

Certainly in the UK, a lot of politicians are very open about how their policy is influenced by a close and generally young relative or other close contact. However, we elected that politician - not their relative or friend or their local shouty CLP member - to work for the best interests of us and our children. If they can't do that, if they so weak as to be led by their own children, then they haven't stand down. We shouldn't allow them to remain in office. I understand they need to use their own judgement to balance constituents' needs, views and interests but as this is such a niche and harmful middle-class fad their obsession with it is downright weird, especially when there are so many more important issues.

Thanks for reminding us DysonSpheres about why most women know why some men are a threat to women.
And yes Wellies54. It's a lie that anyone can change sex and no democracy should ever enshrine lies in law and compel citizens to believe in them. We leave that to the totalitarian fascist states.